Scores die in Israeli air strikes

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

So all those little childrens bodies were not civilian then? Try and defend the indefensable in your own mind if you wish but don't try and excuse it to the rest of us.

I see you bring this up again (trying to make out civilians were deliberately targetted), remind us, didn't you say the same thing about the RAF bombers over Dresden?

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

I see you bring this up again (trying to make out civilians were deliberately targetted), remind us, didn't you say the same thing about the RAF bombers over Dresden?

No I don't believe I did, what I do recall saying is that if Dresden happened to day it'd be a war crime.

I don't need to make out they are being targetted, the numbers speak for themselves and I don't actually believe they are being deliberately targetted, I don't think Israel gives anymore of a damn about them than Hamas.

Originally Posted by SMG

Can you clarify? Excuse for what??

Originally Posted by demented
You may not like international law but it is there

Clarify it enough for you?

[Maribel]

Originally Posted by chaos23

Hows this one for you then? Straight from Wiki

Foreverwar, you have been



Foreverwar: perhaps you need to look further than your usual "reliable" CIA sources.

First all of all Foreverwar has not been 'pwned', he only said that chaos should get it from other sources other than a anti-sementic site. I also believe that site shows the Jewish statlements I have referring too. (I was kindly informed to 'educate' myself when I made that remark)

[chaos23]

Originally Posted by Damien

First all of all Foreverwar has not been 'pwned', he only said that chaos should get it from other sources other than a anti-sementic site. I also believe that site shows the Jewish statlements I have referring too. (I was kindly informed to 'educate' myself when I made that remark)

No he is not, Foreverwar is trying to rewrite history. Its a fact that Palestine has been wiped off the map by Israel in collaberation with the US and UK.

[Saaf_laandon_mo]

What I find suprising is that Israel have not allowed foreign aid into Gaza in order to help deal with saving the lives of the civilian casualties. That is an abhorent stance to take.

[Kymmy]

Everyone is entitled to a view, no matter how accurate or misguided that view is... Now can I suggest we concentrate more on the actual topic than on each other....

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by Saaf_laandon_mo

What I find suprising is that Israel have not allowed foreign aid into Gaza in order to help deal with saving the lives of the civilian casualties. That is an abhorent stance to take.

Except they have been.
You also have to remember the UN and various aid agencies have been complicit in terrorist attacks against Israel, so they can't just open the borders and wave them through, hence the restriction on aid, but it has been getting through. Just because it's not been reported by Auntie doesn't mean it isn't happening, never forget that.
Even when Israel claims it's closed the borders to all travel, it still allows aid through, just not in floods.
Course, if Gazans had spent their time building up a nation rather than trying to destroy one (and their leaders lining their own pockets in the process), they wouldn't need aid.

Chaos, thanks once again for shooting yourself in the foot by proving Damien's point.
Oh you're also forgetting the Soviet Union and their support for Israel.
I'm not suprised though that you aren't aware that under the British everyone to the east and west of the Jordan river were palestinians, no matter their religion.
So, what are your views on the Jordanian occupation of Palestine? Afterall, they occupy a much larger area than the west bank or gaza.

What are your comments on Jordan and Egypt's post '48 occupation of Gaza and the West Bank?

[chaos23]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

Except they have been.
You also have to remember the UN and various aid agencies have been complicit in terrorist attacks against Israel, so they can't just open the borders and wave them through, hence the restriction on aid, but it has been getting through. Just because it's not been reported by Auntie doesn't mean it isn't happening, never forget that.
Even when Israel claims it's closed the borders to all travel, it still allows aid through, just not in floods.
Course, if Gazans had spent their time building up a nation rather than trying to destroy one (and their leaders lining their own pockets in the process), they wouldn't need aid.

Chaos, thanks once again for shooting yourself in the foot by proving Damien's point.
Oh you're also forgetting the Soviet Union and their support for Israel.
I'm not suprised though that you aren't aware that under the British everyone to the east and west of the Jordan river were palestinians, no matter their religion.
So, what are your views on the Jordanian occupation of Palestine? Afterall, they occupy a much larger area than the west bank or gaza.

What are your comments on Jordan and Egypt's post '48 occupation of Gaza and the West Bank?

Even when Israel claims it's closed the borders to all travel, it still allows aid through, just not in floods. Evidence please........

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by chaos23

Even when Israel claims it's closed the borders to all travel, it still allows aid through, just not in floods. Evidence please........

Borders closed but they allow aid through (aunty reports it as border being opened, but then no other traffic is allowed through, so the border isn't open) although it does have the decency to report that while the border was sealed supplies were allowed through later in the article, oh and this is while Israel was under attack from rockets during the "ceasefire"
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/mid...st/7733511.stm

Here's one that mentions the borders being clamped tight apart from essentials (and it also mentions some palestinian school girls who were murdered by gazan militants in a rocket attack)
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/1..._n_153539.html

A total of 106 trucks carried medicine, fuel, cooking gas and other vital goods into Gaza, including a small donation from Egypt

Interesting it mentions Egypt, they're keeping their border shut too you know, but hey, they're not Israel so is it ok for them to do that?

Talking of which, this somewhat bias blog reports: http://elderofziyon.blogspot.com/200...into-gaza.html

Convoys carrying food and medical aid worth six million pounds ($1 million) sent by the Egyptian Red Crescent to the Hamas-run Gaza Strip on Monday await inspection at the Israeli controlled Karam Abu-Salem [Kerem Shalom] border crossing.

Mohamed Orabi, the head of the organization in North Sinai, told AlArabiya.net that five trucks were loaded with 40 tons of flour, 20 tons of rice and some medical supplies and sent to Gaza Strip.

An Egyptian official at the Rafah border crossing said Egyptian authorities had agreed with Israel to allow the trucks in on Monday however through the Karam Abu-Salem border so that Israel could ascertain that no weapons were being smuggled into the Strip.

Now, would you care to actually answer the points I raised?
How do you feel about the Jordanian and Egyptian occupations post '48?

Originally Posted by chaos23

Hows this one for you then? Straight from Wiki

Originally Posted by Xaccers

Except they have been.
You also have to remember the UN and various aid agencies have been complicit in terrorist attacks against Israel, so they can't just open the borders and wave them through, hence the restriction on aid, but it has been getting through. Just because it's not been reported by Auntie doesn't mean it isn't happening, never forget that.
Even when Israel claims it's closed the borders to all travel, it still allows aid through, just not in floods.
Course, if Gazans had spent their time building up a nation rather than trying to destroy one (and their leaders lining their own pockets in the process), they wouldn't need aid.

Chaos, thanks once again for shooting yourself in the foot by proving Damien's point.
Oh you're also forgetting the Soviet Union and their support for Israel.
I'm not suprised though that you aren't aware that under the British everyone to the east and west of the Jordan river were palestinians, no matter their religion.
So, what are your views on the Jordanian occupation of Palestine? Afterall, they occupy a much larger area than the west bank or gaza.

What are your comments on Jordan and Egypt's post '48 occupation of Gaza and the West Bank?

Also from Wiki article on Palestine - Palestine mandate in 1923 (issued by League of Nations); someone else appears to have claimed large chunks of territory.

btw, may I point out that I am not pro-Israel - I am pro even-handedness. I think the Israelis are over-reacting (as I have said before in this thread), but I also think they are being provoked into this - no one is "innocent" in this debacle, but I think only the Israelis have the power to defuse the situation, but as they have an election early next year, none of the politicians can afford to be seen as "weak on terrorism".

There is a lot of history and bad feeling (on both sides, as the Gaza Strip is governed by a different party to the rest of Palestine), and trying to say "Israeli evil" or "Hamas evil" doesn't (imho) help solve the problem.

[Saaf_laandon_mo]

Xaccers, if you read the article regarding aid on the 17th November, you will see that this coincided with Eid so to me, its more a public relations excercise then anything else. Additionally it's all pretty restricted.

You are right, since the mass bombardment and slaughtering of non militant women, men and children border hardly any aid has gone through. Border controls have only been open today have they not? It is all very controlled and restricted, awaiting examination.

S_l_m,

they are examined because weapons have been smuggled through this way before.

Also, there is a border crossing on the Egyptian border, with exactly the same restrictions - no one seems to focus on this.

[chaos23]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

Borders closed but they allow aid through (aunty reports it as border being opened, but then no other traffic is allowed through, so the border isn't open) although it does have the decency to report that while the border was sealed supplies were allowed through later in the article, oh and this is while Israel was under attack from rockets during the "ceasefire"
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/mid...st/7733511.stm

Here's one that mentions the borders being clamped tight apart from essentials (and it also mentions some palestinian school girls who were murdered by gazan militants in a rocket attack)
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/1..._n_153539.html


Interesting it mentions Egypt, they're keeping their border shut too you know, but hey, they're not Israel so is it ok for them to do that?

Talking of which, this somewhat bias blog reports: http://elderofziyon.blogspot.com/200...into-gaza.html


Now, would you care to actually answer the points I raised?
How do you feel about the Jordanian and Egyptian occupations post '48?

Egypt and Jordan are no longer occupying palestine, They occupied Palestine land to protect the Palestinian people from ZIONIST occupation. When Egypt and Jordan left the Israelis occupied this land as well. they didnt oppress its people The Israelis are not only occupying Palestine, they are wiping Palestine and the Palestinian people from the map.

Unfortunatly,today, Egypt is controlled by a puppet government and are collaberating with the west.

[Ramrod]

From the Times: