Virgin Media to possibly peer with LINX (London Internet Exchange)

[AbyssUnderground]

Originally Posted by joglynne

Thanks for your post Broadbandings.

So, does this mean we could be cautiously optimistic about what could happen if Virgin Media take some action that they could have taken in the past but didn't?

If so why didn't Virgin Media do this before? Is it a costly procedure to do the necessary configuration ?

Yes, thanks for the response. My knowledge wasn't great in that area but you've set a lot straight. Still, its nice to know we might actually get better speeds and both companies might save money in the long run.

Anyway just thought it would be nice for people to know this info, since I know a fair few cableforum users have OVH servers.

[Ignitionnet]

Originally Posted by AbyssUnderground

Yes, thanks for the response. My knowledge wasn't great in that area but you've set a lot straight. Still, its nice to know we might actually get better speeds and both companies might save money in the long run.

Anyway just thought it would be nice for people to know this info, since I know a fair few cableforum users have OVH servers.

Pleasure, thanks for posting the info. It's what forums like this one are for, sharing info and inviting comments from others.

Originally Posted by Broadbandings

I think you're a bit confused about what LINX is.

LINX is a neutral peering point which ISPs, etc, connect to in order to trade traffic for free. ntl and Telewest were both connected to this for some time.

This does not mean that ntl and Telewest or any other member of LINX donate any bandwidth to other networks, it means that networks can be connected directly across the LINX switches without using an intermediate or transit provider. The connections on LINX are point to point and exist purely for ISPs to trade their own traffic. ISPs peer at LINX, apart from a peering with LINX's collectors for stats.

What's been done there is that OVH have set up a BGP peering session with Virgin Media, both were already at and connected to LINX but the configuration wasn't in place, and are awaiting Virgin doing the configuration on their side, then instead of traffic having to go through Virgin's saturated DTAG link to reach OVH it will just go across Virgin's connection to the LINX LAN and reach OVH directly.

This should resolve issues people are seeing with speeds, so long as Virgin's LINX connections aren't saturated of course

Swift Diagram:

Before:

VM ---- DTAG routers and whatever else--- OVH

After

VM ---(LINX switches)--- OVH

Saves both VM and OVH a few quid / euros as well, not paying DTAG.

OK ... thanks for that, we're about 80% of the way towards understanding what the OP was on about. Now, to complete the circle, would you mind spelling out some acronyms please:

LINX
OVH
DTAG

Originally Posted by Broadbandings

Virgin Media suck moose wang at setting up peerings in a timely fashion, they suck moose wang at managing their external connectivity generally.

To do the necessary config can be done in the time it takes to spend a penny.

/wonders whether moose wang should be in the swear filter

[Ignitionnet]

LINX - London Internet Exchange - http://www.linx.net
OVH - No idea but a hosting company - http://www.ovh.co.uk
DTAG - Deutsche Telekom AG - German Telecom - http://www.telekom.com

By all means filter moose wang, whatever wang you might want to mention VM's peering and transit sucks it

[AbyssUnderground]

Originally Posted by Chris

OK ... thanks for that, we're about 80% of the way towards understanding what the OP was on about.

Well I knew what I was on about

[Ignitionnet]

I didn't have a clue what I was on about but it sounded good

[Chrysalis]

didnt ntl (pre VM) have linx peering? I remember the old situation where the gigabit ports were constantly maxed and various isps on linx were trying to get ntl to upgrade to 10gigabit.

[Ignitionnet]

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

didnt ntl (pre VM) have linx peering? I remember the old situation where the gigabit ports were constantly maxed and various isps on linx were trying to get ntl to upgrade to 10gigabit.

Originally Posted by BenMcr

Virgin Media is and both ntl and telewest were members of LINX for many years

[dragon]

Originally Posted by Graham M

Love the grammar and spelling in the email

OVH are a French company and I believe English isn't Olly/octaves primary language.

[AbyssUnderground]

Originally Posted by dragon

OVH are a French company and I believe English isn't Olly/octaves primary language.

Correct, Oles/Octave's primary language is French, but his English is improving I will admit. He never used to post on the UK forum because of his bad English but now he does. He often does better than the Google translations too!

[superkey]

I think you'll find that VM has the highest number of interfaces at LINX - 5 of which are 10G so plenty of capacity. They also already have multiple peering sessions with OVH at Amsterdam, Paris and Frankfurt and have had those for a number of years.

Also just to clarify, DTAG are not a VM Transit providor but a 10G Peer and there's plenty of capacity on it :-)

Need to bear in mind that VM are still running two ASNs - 5462 and 5089. The prefixes behind 5462 are in the process of being moved onto 5089 which is supposed to be completing by the end of this year. The two ASNs don't neccesarily have the same peering sessions in the same locations.

[Ignitionnet]

Morning superkey, start of NMC shift?

You might want to check regarding DTAG being a peer, they don't seem to know that they peer with VM looking at the communities that are set in the routes they hold for you guys, they list you as a transit customer.

Community: 3320:1826 3320:2010 3320:9010

3320:1826 Imported in Great Britain
3320:2010 Imported in Europe
3320:9010 Imported from a customer

As opposed to:

3320:9020 Imported from a peerr

Their mis-spelling not mine

I checked on 5462 as well - same thing, no sign of a peering with DTAG and as far as DTAG are concerned has been moved behind 5089.

If VM have multiple peerings with OVH they're either down or were broken by the AS migration, which is far from impossible when noting some of VM's internal routing has been broken by the AS migration. Be quite impressive to break a peering to the extent where you prefer a longer AS path but still from what I've seen 5462's external connectivity has also been largely moved behind 5089 even where it's the better paths.

Originally Posted by superkey

I think you'll find that VM has the highest number of interfaces at LINX - 5 of which are 10G so plenty of capacity. They also already have multiple peering sessions with OVH at Amsterdam, Paris and Frankfurt and have had those for a number of years.

Also just to clarify, DTAG are not a VM Transit providor but a 10G Peer and there's plenty of capacity on it :-)

Need to bear in mind that VM are still running two ASNs - 5462 and 5089. The prefixes behind 5462 are in the process of being moved onto 5089 which is supposed to be completing by the end of this year. The two ASNs don't neccesarily have the same peering sessions in the same locations.

to the forum, superkey, it's nice to have an expert voice around here in discussions like this.

[Chrysalis]

Originally Posted by superkey

I think you'll find that VM has the highest number of interfaces at LINX - 5 of which are 10G so plenty of capacity. They also already have multiple peering sessions with OVH at Amsterdam, Paris and Frankfurt and have had those for a number of years.

Also just to clarify, DTAG are not a VM Transit providor but a 10G Peer and there's plenty of capacity on it :-)

Need to bear in mind that VM are still running two ASNs - 5462 and 5089. The prefixes behind 5462 are in the process of being moved onto 5089 which is supposed to be completing by the end of this year. The two ASNs don't neccesarily have the same peering sessions in the same locations.

ahh so they upgraded since then

[superkey]

Originally Posted by Broadbandings

Morning superkey, start of NMC shift?

You might want to check regarding DTAG being a peer, they don't seem to know that they peer with VM looking at the communities that are set in the routes they hold for you guys, they list you as a transit customer.

Community: 3320:1826 3320:2010 3320:9010

3320:1826 Imported in Great Britain
3320:2010 Imported in Europe
3320:9010 Imported from a customer

As opposed to:

3320:9020 Imported from a peerr

Their mis-spelling not mine

I checked on 5462 as well - same thing, no sign of a peering with DTAG and as far as DTAG are concerned has been moved behind 5089.

If VM have multiple peerings with OVH they're either down or were broken by the AS migration, which is far from impossible when noting some of VM's internal routing has been broken by the AS migration. Be quite impressive to break a peering to the extent where you prefer a longer AS path but still from what I've seen 5462's external connectivity has also been largely moved behind 5089 even where it's the better paths.

I couldn't comment :-)

I think DT are probably that lowest of low type of peer - the paid private peer so technically VM are their customer but DT just advertise a partial table consisting of their own directly connected routes.

It may be a private peer policy 'thing' on the routing front which means DT advertised prefixes are being preferred over other sources of that same prefix, even where that source is another 'peer'

Best thing to do if the problem is still persisting would be for OVH to mail nmc@virginmedia.co.uk saying they are a public peer on 5089 and that it looks like VM are preferring the OVH pre-fixes being advertised by the DTAG paid/private peering session. It would be costing VM money to see the OVH trafic by DTAG so I'm sure they would be keen to see that traffic via the 'free' public peer with OVH.