how about we start a campaign to let VM know that we DONT LIKE SHAPING - Page 12

dontpannic · 11-05-2007, 10:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Angry

No, unlimited apparently means:

Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1) - Cite This Source unÃƒâ€šÃ‚Â·limÃƒâ€šÃ‚Â·itÃƒâ€šÃ‚Â·ed

/ʌnˈlɪm

ɪ

tɪd/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[uhn-lim-i-tid] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â€šÂ¬Ã¢â‚¬Å“adjective 1.not limited; unrestricted; unconfined: unlimited trade. 2.boundless; infinite; vast: the unlimited skies. 3.without any qualification or exception; unconditional.
[Origin: 1400ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â€šÂ¬Ã¢â‚¬Å“50; late ME; see un-1, limited

]

I don't see "except for speed limits" anywhere in there, do you?

No I don't, but Virgin do not advertise "unlimited broadband" they advertise "unlimited downloads"! And give me one good example of when you have been completely cut off by VM for downloading.

Come on... I'm waiting!

Bertie_MB · 11-05-2007, 10:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Angry

Lovely rationale there Bertie, the old "individual cases" trickspeak. Each individual case, when viewed collectively, constitutes a percentage of the overall customer base

Well spotted, but there aren't that many of them (well so far, as you can assume that most home users won't even notice a slower speed). If the complaining ones threaten to leave VM and do so I doubt VM will care as it's such a small number. VM have hundreds of people doing research into the market, it's not like they've just gone "oh lets implement shaping and see what happens".

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Angry

My earlier "Who polices the police"? comment reflects this.

Ofcom

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Angry

Are you of the opinion that if someone is wrongly traffic managed (on a service tier that they pay for) that it is entirely acceptable for that to happen?

No, but **** happens. It's not acceptable for the people who get low speeds on their 20MB connection (even without shaping), however if I spent all my time worrying about other people's connections I wouldn't get much done.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Angry

Since when have VM become the custodians of legal / illegal content? To put this in context (and entirely dispel any notion that there is some sort of "legal content" consideration playing any part in this decision) VM are using a "download up to 4000 music tracks in a day" pitch to sell this service. Who do you know that can afford to pay for that sort of legally downloaded content a day?

No one, but thats marketing my friend. If people are foolish enough to think "oh i can download 4000 tracks yay" then thats their fault...

I never said they were the "custodians" - my point is that of the people hitting those limits I expect much is due to illegal content. Since, as you rightly pointed out, no one can afford to pay for that much media.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Angry

Nice attempt at a sleight, but it's not my campaign.

I apologise, 'your' is both singular and plural. I meant it in the plural sense to all those 'campaigning'.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Angry

And it's about time people stood up to them and asked quite simply why

Keeping over 3 million people happy is always going to be an impossible task. As dontpannic said, with that volume of business they must be doing something right.

11-05-2007, 10:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by dontpannic

HOW MANY TIMES????

How is it a limited service?

Tell me how Virgin are stopping you downloading when you've reached the speed limit?

I am not going to stay here arguing the obvious.
Take a look at the dictionary at the word " unlimited "
Sums up my position fully.

Mr Angry · 11-05-2007, 10:41

Bertie, I tip my hat to you sir!

dontpannic · 11-05-2007, 10:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by arcamalpha2004

I am not going to stay here arguing the obvious.
Take a look at the dictionary at the word " unlimited "
Sums up my position fully.

VIRGIN DO NOT ADVERTISE UNLIMITED BROADBAND THEY ADVERTISE UNLIMITED DOWNLOADS.

See my above post... Then answer my question.

jcuk · 11-05-2007, 10:42

in effect - depending on how much you download and when you download it will depend on the speed at which you download, but you can download whatever and as much as you want

your gonna get speed drops at peak times with any other provider anyway, but the issue that stands with them is ping times and qos?

PC_Arcade · 11-05-2007, 10:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by dontpannic

VIRGIN DO NOT ADVERTISE UNLIMITED BROADBAND THEY ADVERTISE UNLIMITED DOWNLOADS.

See my above post... Then answer my question.

http://allyours.virginmedia.com/html.../noncable.html

They do on non-cable

(Sorry, I'm just being pedantic)

jcuk · 11-05-2007, 10:59

lol :P dont go for their adsl, its terrible afaik

Mr Angry · 11-05-2007, 11:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by dontpannic

No I don't, but Virgin do not advertise "unlimited broadband" they advertise "unlimited downloads"! And give me one good example of when you have been completely cut off by VM for downloading.

Come on... I'm waiting!

You're, erroneously, assuming that I may be one of the 5%. I'm afraid you're wrong - so I'll pass on your "Come on...I'm waiting" game if you don't mind.

buba3d · 11-05-2007, 11:13

Meh i'm not fused about shaping/capping, i do my downloads after 12 and between 4pm.

jcuk · 11-05-2007, 11:38

guys if you have xp pro and you feel upset about the whole shaping thing, use xp's built in remote desktop, use online help to see how it works and make sure ports forwarded on your router, otherwise use WinVNC.

basically lets your remote into your computer from almost anywhere online and do whatever u need to do. id recommend it if your out during the day and require stuff downloaded.

but yeah prep for bigger power bills

lol x

i find the software outstanding so the cap doesent bother me

Ignatius · 11-05-2007, 11:55

Query on DUMeter

I currently use another program to monitor my usage - problem is, it's a fat lot of good for the following reasons:

1) I use several PCs in the house. We have a "family" computer in the hall, and both kids have a computer in their bedroom (limited to specific web sites). There's my work PC in the study, and both the wife and I have a laptop. This would lead to me having to install DUMeter on 6 machines and manually aggregate the data - not pretty.

2) I stream data from the main house PC over my internal network to the TV to allow me to watch programs on the TV (using Hauppauge's media MVP) I can't speak for DU, but my current monitor provides no way to exclude from it's statistics traffic destined for the internal network. Files copied between PCs also add to this issue.

3) My current monitoring solution can't be set to keep a separate total of traffic during a specific time-frame (ie 4pm to midnight) making it impossible for me to measure bandwidth used during the peak period (I can't reset it at 4pm as I don't get home until 6)

The combination of the above 3 factors makes it pretty much impossible at the moment to monitor my internet bandwidth usage.

Will DUMeter help with any of the above? or am I doomed to be unable to challenge NTL on whether my bandwidth usage breaches their AUP?

PC_Arcade · 11-05-2007, 12:01

IMHO You're going to need a router / switch with SNMP in order to keep tabs on that.

What router do you have?

Ignatius · 11-05-2007, 12:08

http://www.kcorplifestyle.com/produc...75/KLS-575.htm

Does support SNMP. I did a bit of looking around last time the idea of capping came around to see if I could find a way of making use of that, but I didn't really get anywhere.

PC_Arcade · 11-05-2007, 12:13

If you go to www.paessler.com and download PRTG Traffic Grapher, go into your modems homepage and set snmp to an unused ip and pick a password

Put the same ip and password into PRTG and you should be good to go, just monitor the uplink port