[Update] A request - do NTL traffic shape? (Yes, they do) - Page 6

Chrysalis · 07-10-2006, 14:24

increased upstream as well there, I wonder if they opening 2nd downstream channels as well rolling out 20mbit on single 27mbit downstream channels sounds scary.

morrk · 07-10-2006, 14:44

Something has to change soon if Ntl are going to roll out hdtv in december as I have heard.

07-10-2006, 15:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by morrk

Something has to change soon if Ntl are going to roll out hdtv in december as I have heard.

?

What does traffic shaping have to do with HDTV

ziggycat · 08-10-2006, 10:16

For the people here who aren't being 'shaped' at the moment well good for you but let me say this, i'm sure you'll have something to say when they impose it in your area because its fecked up. Seems like once again NTL have screwed up, just try running any p2p software (bittorrent etc), and you'll see your whole service crumble to a snails pace.

Personaly I'd rather see caps reintroduced than this, the 75gig limit on the 10meg line was more than enough for me and most users I imagine, and I consider myself a moderate user. I would download maybe 40gig on a heavy month but at least I could do this at the full speed using all the bandwidth I pay for.

Did manage to speak to an english CS who confirmed traffic shaping was happening and had been for two months since it was first trialed in Cardiff, Its now being rolled out accross the network.

Btw he did confirm to me this is only for customers on 10meg.

How on earth do they think a 20meg service is going to work, when they can't give people what they pay for now.

punky · 08-10-2006, 12:13

It seems there is a way to bypass traffic shaping under BitTorrent. It involves enabling encryption under your BT client. Because your ISP can't 'read' this encrypted traffic, it can't tell its BT traffic and can't filter it.

Anyway, I found this which tells you how to enable it.

It would be great if someone on here subject to traffic shaping can come out and say it works or not.

Stuart · 08-10-2006, 13:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by punky

It seems there is a way to bypass traffic shaping under BitTorrent. It involves enabling encryption under your BT client. Because your ISP can't 'read' this encrypted traffic, it can't tell its BT traffic and can't filter it.

Anyway, I found this which tells you how to enable it.

It would be great if someone on here subject to traffic shaping can come out and say it works or not.

Actually, if James Henry is correct, NTL's traffic shaping can detect encrypted bit torrent traffic. I don't know how it works (and even if I did, I wouldn't discuss it in public). Remember, they don't need to be able to read the traffic, they just need to recognise the encryption. There would HAVE to be a certain pattern in the encrypted data for the torrent client to be able to detet it. NTL just need to look for that pattern.

Of course, that's assuming they don't just traffic shape any traffic they can't access.

punky · 08-10-2006, 13:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stuart C

Actually, if James Henry is correct, NTL's traffic shaping can detect encrypted bit torrent traffic. I don't know how it works (and even if I did, I wouldn't discuss it in public). Remember, they don't need to be able to read the traffic, they just need to recognise the encryption. There would HAVE to be a certain pattern in the encrypted data for the torrent client to be able to detet it. NTL just need to look for that pattern.

Of course, that's assuming they don't just traffic shape any traffic they can't access.

Well, I had my suspicions which is why I wanted some people to trial it.

Bill's having problems with speed tests... Assuming its traffic shaping and not just congestion, then they are filtering regular HTTP traffic as well. Not sure if that counts as 'non-time critical' applications, which according to the news report, shouldn't.

Stuart · 08-10-2006, 13:57

I have to admit, I don't know if they can, that was just what I came up with after a couple of minutes of thinking about how I would solve the problem (if required to).

ziggycat · 08-10-2006, 14:26

Tried encryption(forced) with utorrent/azereus on port xxxx but still its being shaped, what I object to most is the internet becomes almost unusable whith just two torrents running (connected to less than 20 seeds/leachers total dl @20kbps average, ul @5kbps).

As soon as I kill utorrent, my service resumes to normal. This is not a machine problem I've tested it on 2 other pc's at home, and with a direct modem connection.

Stuart · 08-10-2006, 14:32

ziggy, are you accessing the net through a Samsung STB? I have a samsung STB that appears to have trouble when you open multiple connections.

ziggycat · 08-10-2006, 14:39

No I'm using an NTL 250 cable modem.
Need to get my service downgraded to 4 meg and test it.

Chrysalis · 08-10-2006, 21:47

The people encrypting their p2p to escape shaping is probably contributing towards isps such as ntl shaping more traffic, I am still on the fence when it comes to shaping but I think all customers should be entitled to xx gig amount of traffic unshaped on "any" protocol so they use their quota how they see fit I also think its wrong to shape only people who happen to be also paying the most for their connection. Once this gets around their will be masses downgrading to 4mbit to upgrade their "real" speeds and ntl lose turnover as a result.

Web-Junkie · 10-10-2006, 00:30

But won't NTL just shape the 4meg service then and you're back to square one?

totalwar · 10-10-2006, 01:50

If everyone downgrades from 10mb broadband to 4mb and enough do this they might start taking notice.Just make sure you tell them why your down grading to 4mb or lower.From reading from some posts not going to make much difference in what speeds you get anyway because of the shaping that going on.

and there are now legal reasons why people use bittorrent more and more company's are looking in use this form of connection because of the bandwith they save of course this means money saving for them.

FusionXN1 · 10-10-2006, 02:43

Now that is very true! Blizzard (Creators of World of Warcraft for people who don't know) use bittorrent for movie downloads, there big 2gb trial client and even updates.