Mum had sex with son

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by Russ D

Whether between two adults, two minors or an adult and a minor, I'd still call it abuse.

Why is two adults consenting to sex abuse when related (parent-offspring/brother-sister) but not when strangers?


BTW I'd still like to know what the bible, or any other religious texts say about incest

Originally Posted by Russ D

Do you not consider incest to be 'abuse'?

No, I do not.

I've just read through this entire thread and I'm astonished at the level of blind prejudice being demonstrated by some people who I thought were beyond such things.

For the record, whatever other views of Jerrek's I may disagree with, on this subject I entirely agree with his points.

Yes, breeding children from incestuous relationships is genetically unwise at present because we cannot predict the results and risk the reinforcement of recessive genetic characteristics (although, curiously, we're quite happy to interbreed "pure" strains of animals to get desired characteristics, but that's another matter).

But we are not *talking* about children, either them being involved or them being the result of such relationship, despite the repeated attempts by some in this thread to claim that is what is under discussion.

These two people were *adults* according to the law and nobody was forced or coerced into acts they didn't want to do.

I have said before and I will say again that the majority *cannot* and *should not* be allowed to dictate what is "acceptable" for others to do when there are no "victims". We have seen too much of this in the past: "Homosexuality is wrong, prostitution is wrong, women being able to vote is wrong, inter-racial marriages are wrong, reading this is wrong, looking at that is wrong, thinking the other is most definitely wrong!"

Why should non-procreative sex between two consenting adults be classified as "abuse" or "wrong" just because they are related? "Because it's incest!" comes the reply. Well, yes, but that doesn't exactly answer the question, does it? It's wrong because it's incest and because it's incest, it's wrong. But that's just a circular argument that goes nowhere.

So can anyone who is against this come up with a logical and reasonable argument?

Originally Posted by Xaccers

If memory serves, the law does not recognise that a man can be raped by a woman, so therefore as they actually had intercourse, it would have to be consensual on his part too.

I was just checking back and noticed this.

Under the new Sexual Offences Act 2003 all offences are "gender neutral".

http://www.legislation.hmso.gov.uk/a...3/20030042.htm

[philip.j.fry]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

BTW I'd still like to know what the bible, or any other religious texts say about incest

http://www.rotten.com/library/religi...ancies/incest/

http://biblia.com/sex/masturbation.htm

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.co...ut/incest.html

http://www.rationalchristianity.net/incest.html

http://www.bible.org/docs/qa/qa.asp?StudyID=132

Disclaimer: I take no responsibility for the content of the links, I just typed 'Bible Incest' into Google because I felt sorry for Xaccers with no-one answering his question

[Bifta]

Originally Posted by Graham

So can anyone who is against this come up with a logical and reasonable argument?

Just because you're a lot more broad minded than most of society doesn't detract from the fact that we find it utterly disgusting, the very thought of having sexual intercourse with a family member turns my stomach, answer me this, would you have sex with your mum? How about your dad? If the answer is "no, I'm not sexually attracted to them", how about if you were?

Originally Posted by Xaccers

Just out of interest, what do we do in cases where two people marry and have kids, then later find out they are siblings?

AIUI under UK law the marriage is automatically annulled because it was not legal in the first place.

[Paul K]

Before this thread turns into a red-rep slinging fiasco can we all just calm down and take a moment to think before we post?
Having been red reppped twice within this thread for voicing an opinion I'm getting to the point where I am thinking of asking for the thread to be temporarily closed while people are red repping for differing opinions. Red reps are not supposed to be dished out just because you don't agree with someones opinion and feel that your opinion is more valid.
Can we calm this thread down please

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by Graham

I was just checking back and noticed this.

Under the new Sexual Offences Act 2003 all offences are "gender neutral".

http://www.legislation.hmso.gov.uk/a...3/20030042.htm

Rape isn't. It clearly refers to person A (the rapist) as "he"

[Chimaera]

Yes - I'm walking away from this one for being red repped for posting my opinion, which is what I thought a forum was all about?
AND my first one in over 2 years of posting!
Didn't realise you got red reps for daring to disagree with another forum member

[paulyoung666]

Originally Posted by Chimaera

Yes - I'm walking away from this one for being red repped for posting my opinion, which is what I thought a forum was all about?
AND my first one in over 2 years of posting!
Didn't realise you got red reps for daring to disagree with another forum member

yes i fear i am going to do the same , i am sorry but it is pretty sad to red rep someone for having an opinion , the 2 of you know who you are , such a sad day

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by Graham

AIUI under UK law the marriage is automatically annulled because it was not legal in the first place.

Are they charged with incest?
Are they no longer allowed to have a relationship?
What if they've had kids?

All interesting questions

Originally Posted by Bifta

Just because you're a lot more broad minded than most of society doesn't detract from the fact that we find it utterly disgusting, the very thought of having sexual intercourse with a family member turns my stomach,

Fine, that's your opinion and your right and I'm not saying you can't hold that viewpoint. But it's not a logical and resonable argument, is it?

answer me this, would you have sex with your mum? How about your dad? If the answer is "no, I'm not sexually attracted to them", how about if you were?

Whether I would or not is my own business. Whether I am attracted to them or not is my business. What I do about it is *nobody's* business but mine and my parents if it's between two consenting adults and not done for procreation.

Now you answer me this: What if I was a Roman Catholic and wanted to go out with a Protestant. How many people do you know who would *also* find that stomach turning? Or what if I was white and wanted to go out with a black girl? Or what if I wanted to go out with another man?

All of these have been "stomach turning" for some people in the past, yet, somehow, we have managed to be grown up enough about such things that we can get over our knee-jerk responses that it's automatically "wrong" if we try hard enough to open our minds.


(PS Should I have replied to this? I thought you didn't want me to contact you at all... )

[Paul K]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

Are they charged with incest?
Are they no longer allowed to have a relationship?
What if they've had kids?

All interesting questions

Interesting questions that may lead to answers that some people may not like or agree with but very valid questions. Anyone want to answer them though?

[Nemesis]

So we're back to Red repping on a difference of opinion ..... tut tut ...

Childish behaviour strikes again ....

Think this thread should calm down for a while before we start seeing an influx of reported post complaints .....

[Bifta]

Originally Posted by Graham

Whether I would or not is my own business. Whether I am attracted to them or not is my business. What I do about it is *nobody's* business but mine and my parents if it's between two consenting adults and not done for procreation.

Nice *cop out*

Now you answer me this: What if I was a Roman Catholic and wanted to go out with a Protestant. How many people do you know who would *also* find that stomach turning?

Absolutely none, sorry.

Or what if I was white and wanted to go out with a black girl? Or what if I wanted to go out with another man?

Again, I personally don't know anyone that would find that sickening, however, if I were to ask everyone one I meet if they thought it was ok for someone to give their own mum a stuffing, I'm willing to bet that nearly if not all of them would answer no.

All of these have been "stomach turning" for some people in the past, yet, somehow, we have managed to be grown up enough about such things that we can get over our knee-jerk responses that it's automatically "wrong" if we try hard enough to open our minds.

Oh I see, if we don't find incest acceptable then we're immature, I don't want to get over my reaction to it, I'm sorry if I'm not as mature as you because I find such an act depraved.