why are black people underachievers ?

[downquark1]

Polo mint to first person to name the song and writers..

Ludicrous?

[BBKing]

The songwriter or my arguments?

Originally Posted by BBKing

That Nelson Mandela never gets off his arse, does he?

Remove the word 'black' from the whole palaver and it comes down to a rich middle aged man complaining about what a let down the Youth of Today are. This has been said by every older generation about every younger generation since Before the Dawna Time.

As for language, the great thing about English is that it's constantly evolving (as opposed to, say, French). There's nothing better or worse about black street slang than any other English dialect. It's not the words you use so much as what you're saying with them, and there are plenty of interesting things being said.

Rap and hip-hop have a bad reputation because people can easily pick out parts of songs that glorify violence, drugs, guns, money, objectify women or use bad language, and miss the bits that say 'stand up for yourself', 'get an education', 'respect people'. This is demonisation and close to outright racism.

You don't, unless you're Mary Whitehouse or mad (same thing, really) condemn rock and roll on the basis of lines like:

'Out of the doorway/The bullets rip/Another one bites the dust'
'The squirminââ‚à ƒâ€šÃ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢ dog whoââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢s just had her day/Under my thumb/A girl who has just changed her ways'
'Clearly I remember pickinââ‚Ã⠀šÃ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢ on the boy/Seemed a harmless little f!ck'
'Turn off your mind, relax and float downstream'
''Who the f!ck do you think you are/Get out of my hair/who the f!ck do you think you are/Comin' round here'
'So you can make me *** that doesn't make you Jesus'
'C!ck-sucker Tammy get your mother f!ckin' dammy/We're goin' downtown to the C!ck-Suckers' Ball/F!ck, suck an' fight/'Till beginnin' of the broad daylight'

Polo mint to first person to name the song and writers...

Doesn't mean that he and every other old fart doesn't actually have a point.

Young black males in the US and the UK do have a proportionally high group of under achievers.Now we could just ignore it,but it would to me as an educator suck if we just ignored the problem.If we don't do something,one of these days it will bite us.

However as long as the resultant riots aren't on our doorsteps why should we worry?

Come on doesn't anyone have any ideas?

Incog.

[downquark1]

Originally Posted by BBKing

The songwriter or my arguments?

Song writer.

I honestly have no clue I just hear people bang on about him and his lyrics. Or is it a trick question?

[BBKing]

Doesn't mean that he and every other old fart doesn't actually have a point.

It's just that it's the same point that's been made for centuries, without the world going into meltdown. Today's riotous youth are tomorrow's old farts. This isn't meant to belittle education, rather the reverse. If the old farts were better educated about the young, and the young better educated full stop, this would be an improvement I'd welcome.

downquark1 - it's sort of a trick question, but I did say 'rock and roll'

[neel2k]

Originally Posted by Russ D

But what about in the world of sport, especially boxing and long-distance running, where the best of the best usually turn out to be black?

Well in the case of long distant running, where Kenya (my country of origin) rules (the 1st and 2nd places in men's London marathon were won by Kenyans and the 1st place in the women's was won by a kenyan) I would explain it by the fact that they and their ancestors have lived at a high altitude so therefore developing bigger lungs and having more red blood cells to carry the oxygen to muscles.
And regarding boxing, I think anyone can do well, regardless of race, Boxing takes skill and training and whoever is dedicated to their training can do well. Vitali Klitschko proves that the best of the best in boxing are not always black.

Regarding education, I feel that teachers think that Black students are not too smart and therefore they do not try as much with black students as with other students. And instead of helping black students in academic subjects they are encouraged in PE.

[Russ]

Can you name 5 current world-class white heavyweight boxers?

[BBKing]

Heavyweight is different to other levels of boxing in that black boxers do predominate (at least recently). There are white heavyweights though, Bonin, the Klitschkos, Golota for instance. Hey, that's nearly five. Eastern Europe seems to be heaving with giants.

At other weights things are much more equal.

[neel2k]

Good point, I can only name 3 Joe Mesi and the Klitschko brothers.
So do you think that Black people have an advantage in boxing because they are black? What differences make them superior?

Originally Posted by neel2k

Good point, I can only name 3 Joe Mesi and the Klitschko brothers.
So do you think that Black people have an advantage in boxing because they are black? What differences make them superior?

first can I say Kip Keino was 'the man'

I think this may have been done before in regard to swimming ?

allegedly the average black man has a higher density body, due to more muscle, less fat & a higher bone mass, than the 'average' white man - much better for boxing ?

Originally Posted by neel2k

Regarding education, I feel that teachers think that Black students are not too smart and therefore they do not try as much with black students as with other students. And instead of helping black students in academic subjects they are encouraged in PE.

Not true in MY case I can assure you.It was a pretty sweeping thing to say in my opinion.

[Russ]

Originally Posted by neel2k

So do you think that Black people have an advantage in boxing because they are black? What differences make them superior?

I have no idea if this is indeed the case but think of the greatest boxers in their class over the years....Ali, Foreman, Tyson, Lewis, Bruno (haha, only joking ), Eubank, Hammed etc etc. Of course there have been some great white guys (and in Calzaghe's case, white and Welsh ) but the black guys outweight (pardon the pun) the white in terms of success.

[neel2k]

Originally Posted by homealone

first can I say Kip Keino was 'the man'

I think this may have been done before in regard to swimming ?

allegedly the average black man has a higher density body, due to more muscle, less fat & a higher bone mass, than the 'average' white man - much better for boxing ?

Yea, the average West African (including african americans and caribbeans) have less body fat, higher centre of gravity, narrower hips, higher levels of testosterone and more fast-twitch muscle than white people or east-africans, Which would be useful in boxing, but I still think that its more a matter of training and maybe the black dominance of boxing is because more black young people get into boxing than white people.

Originally Posted by Incognitas

Not true in MY case I can assure you.It was a pretty sweeping thing to say in my opinion.

Yes, it was a pretty sweeping thing to say and i'm sorry if I offended you. It is a generalisation and therefore will not apply to everyone. This is just the impression I get from my school, I also discussed this with my sociology teacher and she agreed with quite a lot of what I had to say.

Originally Posted by neel2k

Yea, the average West African (including african americans and caribbeans) have less body fat, higher centre of gravity, narrower hips, higher levels of testosterone and more fast-twitch muscle than white people or east-africans, Which would be useful in boxing, but I still think that its more a matter of training and maybe the black dominance of boxing is because more black young people get into boxing than white people.

point taken, I used to live in Kenya and yes, people weren't built that way,

Athletics is more relevant for them?

[Nikko]

Originally Posted by BBKing

snip

downquark1 - it's sort of a trick question, but I did say 'rock and roll'

I know its only rock n roll - but I like it