School helped secret abortion - Page 2

iadom · 13-05-2004, 12:32

Whilst I agree with most of the points made, with the amount of peer pressure and explicit sex on TV and in the media, these unfortunate circumstances are all to common, even in families of otherwise well cared for and loved children.

"There but for the grace of God" springs to mind.

One thing does concern me greatly, these decisions where not taken by teaching staff but by counsellors from the Mansfield Primary Care Trust and to quote the front page of the Daily Telegraph "the counsellors are not medically trained"
I think this is a very dangerous and totally immoral,although not illegal act.

How do any of you know how this parent cared for her child.

orangebird · 13-05-2004, 12:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by downquark1

Is that:

The girl changed her mind and the mother found out

or

The mother found out, then the girl changed her mind

IIRC from gmtv this morning, it was a chemical abortion - medication administered at two seperate intervals. The first had already been administered when the mother found out.

Alanmelon · 13-05-2004, 12:46

Quote:

How do any of you know how this parent cared for her child.

Quite right, we don't. I'm not condoning the actions of the school/counsellors/authorities here, it may have been possible to handle the situation differently, but we don't know the facts.

What irritates me is the all too common pass the blame attitude that so many people demonstrate today. The mother seems to be of the belief that the whole situation is neither the fault of her, nor her daughter. I just think she needs to look at what caused the situation in the first place before attacking the actions of those who were trying to help, be that in a misguided manner or not.

orangebird · 13-05-2004, 12:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by towny

Possibly. On the other hand, as Ramrod says, you can't predict the behaviour of adolescent teenagers, male or female. Either way, I object very strongly to a school teacher or social worker acting as sole arbiter of what constitutes parental failure. That is far, far too great a responsibility to be wielded by one person in summary fashion, as this tragic case very clearly demonstrates.

IMO it would've been even more tragic if a 14 year old had had a baby.....

iadom · 13-05-2004, 12:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by orangebird

IMO it would've been even more tragic if a 14 year old had had a baby.....

That is not always the case, I know personally of a similar case, both sets of parents rallied round and the child of this couple is a fabulous person, who lights up the life of everyone who meets him.

We do not know how well this young girl would have coped but to deny her parents any say in the matter is very, very, wrong.

orangebird · 13-05-2004, 12:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by iadom

That is not always the case, I know personally of a similar case, both sets of parents rallied round and the child of this couple is a fabulous person, who lights up the life of everyone who meets him.

I'm sure he does. It doesn't make it right that a CHILD should bring another child into the world.

Quote:

We do not know how well this young girl would have coped but to deny her parents any say in the matter is very, very, wrong.

It was the girls choice. She didn't want her parents told, and it's not up to the school/counsellors to break that confidence.

Stuart · 13-05-2004, 13:00

I am personally not sure what to think about this. Yes, I agree that the school should have informed the mother about this.

I also think that the pregnancy should not have happened in the first place, but, as Ramrod has stated accidents do happen.

We have heard the Mother complaining about how the school took the decision away from her, but has she told the daughter about the facts of life, or just relied on the School's sex ed classes to teach her. Has she asked the daughter if she followed the guidlines given in Sex Education?

iadom · 13-05-2004, 13:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by orangebird

I'm sure he does. It doesn't make it right that a CHILD should bring another child into the world.

It was the girls choice. She didn't want her parents told, and it's not up to the school/counsellors to break that confidence.

So she is "child enough" not to be allowed to have a baby, but "adult enough" to make this decision without any input from her parents and legal guardians.

orangebird · 13-05-2004, 13:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by iadom

So she is "child enough" not to be allowed to have a baby, but "adult enough" to make this decision without any input from her parents and legal guardians.

Where did I say that?

Once again, fingers are being pointed at all those that are NOT to blame for the reason this incident occured in the first place.

The GIRL had underage sex, the GIRL got pregnant, the GIRL didn't want to tell her parents......

Jon M · 13-05-2004, 13:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by orangebird

Where did I say that?

in the bit he quoted

orangebird · 13-05-2004, 13:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by s1lv3r

in the bit he quoted

Nope, still can't see where I said that..... read it again and don't twist my words.

Sorry, but if it was a daughter of mine, as much as I'd be p1ssed of she got herself in such a mess in the first place, I would be encouraging her to terminate too.

Ramrod · 13-05-2004, 13:16

She isn't yet an adult, because of this, her parents should have been informed (imo).

Quote:

Originally Posted by orangebird

Sorry, but if it was a daughter of mine, as much as I'd be p1ssed of she got herself in such a mess in the first place, I would be encouraging her to terminate too.

Same here. That's not the issue.

iadom · 13-05-2004, 13:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by orangebird

Sorry, but if it was a daughter of mine, as much as I'd be p1ssed of she got herself in such a mess in the first place, I would be encouraging her to terminate too.

Always assuming that you got to know , and preferably not by overhearing her classmates talking about it.

Jon M · 13-05-2004, 13:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by orangebird

IMO it would've been even more tragic if a 14 year old had had a baby.....

would a 14yr old deciding to kill a human being be more tragic than giving birth to it?

OB, i think it's pretty obvious we're not going to agree.. me being pro-life and you obviously being pro-choice (or pro-nolife, whatever)

I'll leave it there, I think I've said my peace.

orangebird · 13-05-2004, 13:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ramrod

She isn't yet an adult, because of this, her parents should have been informed (imo).

Same here. That's not the issue.

No, you're right it's not, just MPO. The school/counsellors did the right and legal thing. Whether it was morally right or not is another matter, which is entirely down to the indiviuals personal opinion.