Coronavirus

Originally Posted by Pierre

Finally you’re getting it. .........

No, of course the numbers are real. Like I’ve said on here many times I don’t believe lockdowns are the answer.

But the government do, and the best way to control a population is to scare them into obedience.

The figures are what they are, but it is still at the end of the day for the vast majority a mild disease

I just don’t understand your perspective on this. How is it that you’re failing to grasp that the government is taking population-scale decisions here - not because they think lockdown is the solution to your mild case of covid, but because at the population scale the reproduction rate we’re seeing means that at any one time there are now about as many serious covid cases as the NHS can handle. The NHS is routinely stretched by seasonal flu when it is operating normally (I.e. still doing regular cancer screenings, hip replacements and the rest). Today, it is stretched to the limit even after much of its normal operation has been surrendered to covid patient care.

If the government is trying to scare people into compliance, then that’s because people have lost the ability to modify their behaviour for the sake of their wider community, and can only be manipulated into something they think is in their personal interest. And that’s a really sad reflection of what we as a nation have become.

Originally Posted by Chris

I just don’t understand your perspective on this. How is it that you’re failing to grasp that the government is taking population-scale decisions here - not because they think lockdown is the solution to your mild case of covid, but because at the population scale the reproduction rate we’re seeing means that at any one time there are now about as many serious covid cases as the NHS can handle. The NHS is routinely stretched by seasonal flu when it is operating normally (I.e. still doing regular cancer screenings, hip replacements and the rest). Today, it is stretched to the limit even after much of its normal operation has been surrendered to covid patient care.

If the government is trying to scare people into compliance, then that’s because people have lost the ability to modify their behaviour for the sake of their wider community, and can only be manipulated into something they think is in their personal interest. And that’s a really sad reflection of what we as a nation have become.

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by Pierre

It’s the weekly Sunday Scare’em routine. The new variant is lurking behind the bushes and is going to jump out and kill you if you leave the house.

Have you heard the radio ads? “If you’re on public transport or in the park, it like the people around you will be infected with coronavirus”........... really.

Keep ‘em scared, keep’em scared.

Too right, people should be scared.

Scared of catching it and passing it on to someone whose immune system my not be able to cope and they end up seriously ill in hospital or worse, dead.

Taking precautions and lockdowns are to help stop the NHS being swamped rather than just making people stay home for the hell of it.

People that think its a hoax or that its the government trying to control us are just plain daft. I personally know people that have passed away covid. It's not nice at all. I certainly don't want to risk catching it.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by Hugh

Apologies - I forgot the <sarcasm> tags...

I wonder if the 4K+ plus people admitted every day lately realise they’re not really ill, just a propaganda tactic?

That’s not what I said

---------- Post added at 11:26 ---------- Previous post was at 11:17 ----------

Originally Posted by Chris

I just don’t understand your perspective on this. How is it that you’re failing to grasp that the government is taking population-scale decisions here - not because they think lockdown is the solution to your mild case of covid, but because at the population scale the reproduction rate we’re seeing means that at any one time there are now about as many serious covid cases as the NHS can handle. The NHS is routinely stretched by seasonal flu when it is operating normally (I.e. still doing regular cancer screenings, hip replacements and the rest). Today, it is stretched to the limit even after much of its normal operation has been surrendered to covid patient care.

If the government is trying to scare people into compliance, then that’s because people have lost the ability to modify their behaviour for the sake of their wider community, and can only be manipulated into something they think is in their personal interest. And that’s a really sad reflection of what we as a nation have become.

Because I would prefer to be advised rationally.

Just be straight up about everything in a calm clear way.

I don’t like it when anyone let , alone the government, try and intimidate me and scare me with irrational propaganda.

The 30% more deadly variant being a prime example.

I’ve never said it is a hoax / conspiracy or anything like that - ever, and I have always adhered to the rules.

But I absolutely within my rights to question how this is being handled.

[daveeb]

Originally Posted by Chris

I just don’t understand your perspective on this. How is it that you’re failing to grasp that the government is taking population-scale decisions here - not because they think lockdown is the solution to your mild case of covid, but because at the population scale the reproduction rate we’re seeing means that at any one time there are now about as many serious covid cases as the NHS can handle. The NHS is routinely stretched by seasonal flu when it is operating normally (I.e. still doing regular cancer screenings, hip replacements and the rest). Today, it is stretched to the limit even after much of its normal operation has been surrendered to covid patient care.

If the government is trying to scare people into compliance, then that’s because people have lost the ability to modify their behaviour for the sake of their wider community, and can only be manipulated into something they think is in their personal interest. And that’s a really sad reflection of what we as a nation have become.

An excellent analysis of the situation. Some some people just don't get it and just think of themselves.

[Mr K]

Originally Posted by daveeb

An excellent analysis of the situation. Some some people just don't get it and just think of themselves.

I think most people do get it, but still don't care. They're more worried about their next holiday and personal wealth, than the health of those around them. Sad sign of the times.

If of course they themselves or a family member becomes seriously ill their attitude completely changes. Our PM is a case in point.

[denphone]

Originally Posted by daveeb

An excellent analysis of the situation. Some some people just don't get it and just think of themselves.

Exactly..

---------- Post added at 12:28 ---------- Previous post was at 12:26 ----------

Originally Posted by Mr K

I think most people do get it, but still don't care. They're more worried about their next holiday and personal wealth, than the health of those around them. Sad sign of the times.

If of course they themselves or a family member becomes seriously ill their attitude completely changes. Our PM is a case in point.

Spot on analysis.

[Sephiroth]

This is potentially worrying.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-55785787

Health officials said a 56-year-old woman who had recently returned [to NZ] from Europe tested positive 10 days after completing a compulsory two-week period of managed isolation.

We keenly await a report on the reason for this.

[jfman]

Originally Posted by Pierre

It’s the weekly Sunday Scare’em routine. The new variant is lurking behind the bushes and is going to jump out and kill you if you leave the house.

Have you heard the radio ads? “If you’re on public transport or in the park, it like the people around you will be infected with coronavirus”........... really.

Keep ‘em scared, keep’em scared.

If there’s more than 100 people in the park that’s true.

---------- Post added at 13:23 ---------- Previous post was at 13:18 ----------

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

This is potentially worrying.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-55785787



We keenly await a report on the reason for this.

Very worrying for NZ, but they’ve had a few examples of community transmission successfully stamped out before so I’m rooting for them.

Potentially false negative tests or simply a late onset of infection. It’s always been thought possible just unlikely as the vast majority are between by days 5-7.

I did read a theory on the “new variant” that it was more difficult to detect and that’s one hypothesis for greater spread - people who test negative continue their lives as normal. Don’t know if further analysis has been done.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by daveeb

An excellent analysis of the situation. Some some people just don't get it and just think of themselves.

Questioning the effectiveness of lockdowns is not selfish, it’s the opposite. Thinking of all the people who have and will lose their jobs, potentially their homes. Thinking of people stuck in tiny flats, people that are alone, kids at risk, the list goes on and on.

I’m lucky, I have a massive garden and live in a rural area, never went to the pub or cinema that often. lockdown hasn’t affected me at all. The only potential issue was with schooling and I qualify for essential worker status so that is now sorted.

So believe me, I am not thinking of myself I can ride out lockdowns just fine, but I don’t agree they are the answer.

---------- Post added at 13:46 ---------- Previous post was at 13:45 ----------

Originally Posted by jfman

If there’s more than 100 people in the park that’s true..

Well they don’t know that and it’s not an issue if everyone follows the guidance.

[pip08456]

Originally Posted by jfman

If there’s more than 100 people in the park that’s true.

Depends on how big the park is.

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by jfman

I

Very worrying for NZ, but they’ve had a few examples of community transmission successfully stamped out before so I’m rooting for them.

Potentially false negative tests or simply a late onset of infection. It’s always been thought possible just unlikely as the vast majority are between by days 5-7.

I did read a theory on the “new variant” that it was more difficult to detect and that’s one hypothesis for greater spread - people who test negative continue their lives as normal. Don’t know if further analysis has been done.

.. and for the UK too. If people arriving here go into quarantine, show negative after the required period and then go down with CV a week or two later, then the boffins have missed something.

[Angua]

Why the best message is "act as if you have Covid-19"! Then at least you will be taking all the measure you personally can, to stop the spread.

[jfman]

Originally Posted by Pierre

Questioning the effectiveness of lockdowns is not selfish, it’s the opposite. Thinking of all the people who have and will lose their jobs, potentially their homes. Thinking of people stuck in tiny flats, people that are alone, kids at risk, the list goes on and on.

Red herring. Even Sweden is seeing an economic impact, despite taking no meaningful restrictions for the first 6-9 months.

The idea that there’s a lot of businesses out there that would thrive with people voluntarily shielding, many continuing to work from home for their own safety is mistaken. Businesses are in trouble either way.

I’m lucky, I have a massive garden and live in a rural area, never went to the pub or cinema that often. lockdown hasn’t affected me at all. The only potential issue was with schooling and I qualify for essential worker status so that is now sorted.

So believe me, I am not thinking of myself I can ride out lockdowns just fine, but I don’t agree they are the answer.

Well they don’t know that and it’s not an issue if everyone follows the guidance.

Went to two local parks this weekend. One where I grew up had more people in it than I’ve seen in my entire life. The other nearby had about 80 folk it it when I did a quick count. I’m pretty confident anyone spending even half an hour to an hour there would have shared the space with 100 different people.

I'm so lucky to live 5 minutes from a beach with huge open spaces and a country park on the back of the village.