Brexit (Old)

[ianch99]

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

It was intended as a compliment to Mr. K. Not back-handed but absolutely benign and well meant.

In that case, I apologise ..

Unfortunately, I am old enough to remember Terry Thomas

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by ianch99

<SNIP>

You really need to accept that, in this country, people are allowed to hold different views and importantly, allowed to voice them.
[SEPH]: Oh please. What a ridiculous thing to say and to accuse me of.

You believe that Germany, France and Ireland are in an evil EU conspiracy, etc. You are wrong of course but you are quite entitled to repeat such nonsense .. as you due ... regularly ..
[SEPH]: What's wrong with you? I never said any of that. I simply reinforced my point about hegemony, domination. "Evil" doesn't come into it. Just the steps towards federalisation and so on.

What may possibly help to bring the two sides together are two things:

1. some honesty in admitting that there is no mandate for No Deal per the Leave campaign "manifesto"
[SEPH]: A Remainer's mantra in the face of the Referendum result.

2. stop treating Brexit as a "Winner Takes All" game. The vote was so close that imposing an extreme implementation of Brexit would be a severe mistake. History tells us this ..
[SEPH]: Hence my valid point about a margin of 1 in Parliament being all that's needed to pass a law. A margin >1m in a Referendum shouldn't be argued about. Again, Remainer nonsense.

Sorry, whilst you are perfectly entitled to your view, your polarised interpretation of democracy is the problem that many Remainers have and it is they who are causing the division in the face of a clear Referendum result.

[ianch99]

Found on Twitter:

Oh this is just incredible. Are you ready for this? We’ve been trawling Hansard for examples of hypocrisy by our Brexit overlords & found this👇. In the debate on Scottish/Welsh devolution, Iain Duncan Smith tabled a Commons amendment pushing the option of… A SECOND REFERENDUM

Are there two Iain Duncan Smith's?

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by ianch99

In that case, I apologise ..

Unfortunately, I am old enough to remember Terry Thomas

So am I. TT was hilarious. A pity we differ on that too!


---------- Post added at 19:51 ---------- Previous post was at 19:48 ----------

Originally Posted by ianch99

Found on Twitter:



Are there two Iain Duncan Smith's?

A gem indeed. I'm rather enjoying this Brexit stuff because it is making havoc with the politicians who have always been a self-interested bunch of incompetents (except Maggie's lot).

But I'd still rather the Referendum result was honoured and if we end up remaining, that'll be fun too.

[Mr K]

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

TT was hilarious. A pity we differ on that too!

Came to a sad end Terry Thomas, died in poverty
Suspect he would have been a Brexiteer and called the EU an 'absolute shower', top bloke all the same

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by mrmistoffelees

I quite clearly said that neither of the options that you provided will satisfy a fractured society as a whole based on quite clear evidence of whats available to read

I said nothing about my views whatsoever in the above post.

Society isn't yet fractured - at least not down to Brexit.
There are differences of opinion, but "fracture" is too strong a word for now.

If Brexit is thwarted, then a fracture may well occur as previously peaceful people take to the street, then to be exploited by the violent types.

The Referendum must be honored; the Remainers won't take to the streets in the "fractured" sense.

[Mr K]

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

Society isn't yet fractured - at least not down to Brexit.
There are differences of opinion, but "fracture" is too strong a word for now.

If Brexit is thwarted, then a fracture may well occur as previously peaceful people take to the street, then to be exploited by the violent types.

The Referendum must be honored; the Remainers won't take to the streets in the "fractured" sense.

Society is fractured, but it's not just down to Brexit, been that way since the 1980s and a certain PM who claimed ' there's no such thing as society'. We certainly haven't 'all been in it together' as another crap PM claimed 9 years ago.

The real issue will not be Remainers post Brexit, it will be the ' just about managing' working class Leavers, who realise they've been conned big time by those rich career politicians who will be relatively unaffected.

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by Mr K

Society is fractured, but it's not just down to Brexit, been that way since the 1980s and a certain PM who claimed ' there's no such thing as society'. We certainly haven't 'all been in it together' as another crap PM claimed 9 years ago.

The real issue will not be Remainers post Brexit, it will be the ' just about managing' working class Leavers, who realise they've been conned big time by those rich career politicians who will be relatively unaffected.

It won't be just the Leavers. I did say "yet" with what you've said in mind.

[pip08456]

I found this rather a humourous solution.

[papa smurf]

Originally Posted by pip08456

I found this rather a humourous solution.

Plan B

[RichardCoulter]

Watched a history programme last night; didn't know that we had tried to join the EU in 1963 and were rejected because of France.

I understand that it was the Heath Government that finally took us into the EU in 1974 (what changed to appease France?), so was the actual referendum held afterwards to allow us to decide whether to stay in it or not?

From what I gather, the result was 'No'. Was this honoured in any way?

[papa smurf]

Originally Posted by RichardCoulter

Watched a history programme last night; didn't know that we had tried to join the EU in 1963 and were rejected because of France.

I understand that it was the Heath Government that finally took us into the EU in 1974 (what changed to appease France?), so was the actual referendum held afterwards to allow us to decide whether to stay in it or not?

From what I gather, the result was 'No'. Was this honoured in any way?

“ The Government has announced the results of the renegotiation of the United Kingdom's terms of membership of the European Community.

Do you think the United Kingdom should stay in the European Community (the Common Market)? ”
Location United Kingdom (pop. 56.225m)
Date 5 June 1975

Results
Votes %
Yes 17,378,581 67.23%
No 8,470,073 32.77%
Valid votes 25,848,654 99.79%





https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1975_U...hip_referendum













Invalid or blank votes 54,540 0.21%
Total votes 25,903,194 100.00%
Registered voters/turnout 40,086,677 64.62%

Between 21 and 28 October 1971 the House of Commons debated whether or not the UK should become a member of the EC, with then Prime Minister Edward Heath commenting just before the vote:

“ But tonight when this House endorses this Motion many millions of people right across the world will rejoice that we have taken our rightful place in a truly United Europe! ”
The House of Commons voted 356-244 in favour of the motion, with the Prime Minister commenting straight afterwards on behalf of the house.

“ Resolved, That this House approves Her Majesty's Government's decision of principle to join the European Communities on the basis of the arrangements which have been negotiated. ”
No referendum was held when Britain agreed to an accession treaty on 22 January 1972 or when the European Communities Act 1972 went through the legislative process, on the grounds that to hold one would be unconstitutional. The United Kingdom joined the European Communities on 1 January 1973, along with Denmark and the Republic of Ireland. The EC would later become the European Union.

Originally Posted by Mr K

Society is fractured, but it's not just down to Brexit, been that way since the 1980s and a certain PM who claimed ' there's no such thing as society'. We certainly haven't 'all been in it together' as another crap PM claimed 9 years ago.

The real issue will not be Remainers post Brexit, it will be the ' just about managing' working class Leavers, who realise they've been conned big time by those rich career politicians who will be relatively unaffected.

Context is all...

And, you know, there is no such thing as society. There are individual men and women and there are families. And no governments can do anything except through people, and people must look to themselves first. It is our duty to look after ourselves and then, also, to look after our neighbours.

[pip08456]

Originally Posted by RichardCoulter

Watched a history programme last night; didn't know that we had tried to join the EU in 1963 and were rejected because of France.

I understand that it was the Heath Government that finally took us into the EU in 1974 (what changed to appease France?), so was the actual referendum held afterwards to allow us to decide whether to stay in it or not?

From what I gather, the result was 'No'. Was this honoured in any way?

The rejections of France to Britain were mainly because of De Gaulle being a 100% anglophobe. After his death in 1970 tthe door was opened.

[papa smurf]

Originally Posted by pip08456

The rejections of France to Britain were mainly because of De Gaulle being a 100% anglophobe. After his death in 1970 tthe door was opened.

If only he had lived we would all be happy.