Oftel: What is Broadband?

[MovedGoalPosts]

Oftel are consulting on a re-definition of broadband:

Review of the Wholesale Broadband Access Market

The new draft broadband definition is:

Asymmetric broadband internet access has a number of characteristics that individually or as a group distinguish it as a higher quality service than narrowband internet access:
†¢ it provides higher speeds, in excess of 256kbit/s downstream capacity;
†¢ it offers an always-on service, or at least has an ability to establish rapidly a connection to the internet;
†¢ it allows use of the exchange line for voice telephony and internet access at the same time; and
†¢ it allows content delivery which is not practical on narrowband internet access such as real time video content.

Therefore ntl's 150k service is not broadband (the Advertising Standards Authority have already said as much in one of thier adjudications).

The question is, does this definition go far enough?

Should Oftel not say what they mean i.e. broadband has to be over 500k downstream so you can actually use media streaming even if the service is contended?

Should there be an upstream speed mentioned, is 128k (ntl's speed) adequate, or should a minimum be 256k?

Should "it allows an always on service" be clarified to mean "no limits on data uploads / downloads"?

Anyone want to send their observations to Oftel, the closing dat is early July.

[Steve H]

To be Honest - The Average User wouldnt Care less about it being defined broadband or not.. Its alot faster than 56k (Usually), and its always on (usually), So the only people really bothered are the tee total politicians.

[Sociable]

Originally posted by Steve_NTL
To be Honest - The Average User wouldnt Care less about it being defined broadband or not.. Its alot faster than 56k (Usually), and its always on (usually), So the only people really bothered are the tee total politicians.

Not true the reason Oftel and the ASA have both taken a stand on this is that both have a duty to protect the public from abuse.

The reason for this is that "Joe Public" tends to hear a word like "Broadband" and assumes this means things like streaming video and other high data transfer applications will be available.

Even the very latest adverts for NTL on TV this evening give the impression the 150k service is true "Broadband" as it is "High Speed" this is clearly bending the acceptable use of the term.

"A rose by any other name would smell as sweet" BUT.......

It would be a dam site harder to market!

[darkone338]

didn't the term "broadband" come from the actual frequency that the signal is transmitted across the wire?

Out Of Band frequencies are used to provide ADSL over a standard phone line and I was under the impression this is where the term "broadband" came from, its the marketing numbnuts who dont understand technology that have caused all the confusion.

Speed shouldn't be the defining factor, its the technology, not the speed that defined the name.....


From Dictionary.com

broad·b and (brÃÃâ€*’´dbnd)
adj.
Of, relating to, or having a wide band of electromagnetic frequencies: a broadband network

[Ignition]

Aside from the dictionary definitions and Oftel's definition which changes daily to please the Government the definition that I liked best was a connection of equal to or greater than 2Mbits per second bandwidth in both directions.

To be honest the technologies being distributed to homes at the moment are nothing more than stopgaps, DSL more than cable but nonetheless both are equally guilty and to be honest the only step forward really is fibre to the home.

[MovedGoalPosts]

I think Oftel want their new defintion to last for about 2 years, which is as long as the current one has. When the current one was launched services of 150k and 256k did not exists hence their current definition of bb being in excess of 128k (so ntls 128k service never was bb to Oftel)

Much of the confusion comes from Oftel wanting to make the UK look good for European statistics and the governments online britain strategies. So for statistics Oftel still count ntls 128 - now 150k - service as bb.

Naturally the public are confused. Enlightened users will understand many of the differences. Many "punters" that ntl aim the 150k service at probably do not understandthese subtleties and will believe the sales pitch (hence the ASA agreeing the 128 service was not boradband in view of the publice perception, not industry view). This is potentially a misdescription of service and a risk of disappointed customers (nothing new there then for ntl).

To reduce confusion I believe a robust defintion of what bb means is essential. This then becomes the standard to be used by all government agencies, Oftel, ASA, etc.

[scrotnig]

Well 150k to most people is not narrowband and not dialup, therefore most people are happy to consider it broadband.

In all my work at ntl: I have not once heard of anyone with a genuine grievance about this issue.

[matty4donna]

ive never really understood why ntl dont just put the 150k up to 256k - thats what it is/was in ex-cwc area's via the STB anyway. It would sort out all this confusion and save any hassle from Oftel.

[DannyA]

you must off seen on el reg and the inq, that thing about sweeden?


They have had fantastic speeds for years.

My Danish friends translated for me - I believe it was about £30 a month for 10Mbits <> symetrical.

Yup - both ways.
Lovelly Bostream!


Check out this new mother crusher ->


http://www.bonet.se/page.php?xml=swe...ontext=private

26Mbit a month costs - 398 Sweedish Kronor a month.

398.00 SEK
Sweden Kronor = 30.5434 GBP
United Kingdom Pounds (Cheers XE)

[Sociable]

Originally posted by matty4donna
ive never really understood why ntl dont just put the 150k up to 256k - thats what it is/was in ex-cwc area's via the STB anyway. It would sort out all this confusion and save any hassle from Oftel.

Simple answer is that the majority of the network is not set up to handle that level of demand. It could be but that would require additional capital expenditure.

My guess is even jumping them from 128 to 150 was at least one aspect of the decison about changing the AUP to limit the use to maxing a 128 connection.

NTL's philosophy has always been to "Hook" new users with a "We are best" tag. 150 gives an edge on any 128 service without placing too high a demand on the infrastructure.

Maybe a better solution would be to start using some new wording to clarify diferent levels of "Broadband" along these lines.

"Browsing-BroadBand" = always on services that are limited to speeds below 512k. Ideal for dial-up users only wishing to experience the same baisc web content slightly faster and also free up a phone line.

"Normal-BroadBand" = always on services that allow medium quality streaming and are limited to speeds over 512 and below 1000. Ideal for users wishing to expand their use of the web not just in speed but also in terms of content and applications.

"High-Speed-BroadBand" = always on services that allow high quality streaming and have speeds of at least 1000. Ideal for those wishing to gain the maximum experience both in terms of speed and content.

It should also be mandatory to include a reference to any limitations as to use should they apply and such reference must be in the advertising and not hidden in any AUP.

Adding such examples of what each level of service is best used for helps give real meaning to the term broadband and allows informed choices to be made by prospective customers.

[distortal]

IIRC 128/150 isn't considered Broadband by the ASA, but the Government DOES include those users in order to produce a higher figure for 'Broadband' users in the UK - so who's right?

[bigitup_j]

i can't see why ntl just have 256k instead of 150k. it would be fair to the customers without set-top-box broadband and ntl would have no more trouble with the ASA or oftel.

and keep the price at £17.99 (super value)

[MovedGoalPosts]

The current Oftel broadband defintion, if my recollection is correct, is for a connection where downstream speed exceeds 128kbps.

This definition has been present for 2 years or so, but is now due for revision, hence my original post.

I think, quite simply, ntl's reason for the upgrade of 128k to the 150k service was simply so that their services are all technically broadband within the meaning of the current defintion.

The reality is however that the 150k speed is woefully inadequate to enable the user to take advantage of the opportunities available to proper speed broadband, which includes decent videao streaming. The ASA in their judgments against ntl have recognised this, following the principle that the average joe public will not understand what speeds mean, but probably do understand the concepts of what broadband services ought to be able to do. In my opinion it's time the Oftel definition (and indeed all government quangos) used the same yardsticks, so a properly drafted definition is vital.

[Ignition]

To be honest I care little for any definition of what broadband is as I don't consider any product available in the UK, apart from 2Mbit SDSL which is priced well out of residential customers reach, to be broadband.
Our 'top end' speeds are laughable, 2048/256 mostly, which is apparently making Telewest's network suffer somewhat and is minimum £65 from nearly all other decent providers. (Not counting people like Internet Central who made a complete cock-up of the rollout and whose networks can't actually support it reliably anyway). Quite scary that the absolute fastest you can get is 8192/768 @ £300 per month, not including VAT
I remember BT saying they were going to have 5Mbit out and about by 2005. Erm, well with services 5 times faster downstream already available elsewhere, nice one BT, stop obsessing about lost revenue on the leased lines, take the hit and supply what the people want. No excuses, backbone is cheap, the copper is already there to homes, and the technology is there already. Pure greed that's stopping it. At least in ntl's case the limitations are those of DOCSIS which not that much can be done about without huge expense, which is, I'm sure, being done bit by bit.

[Shaun]

Originally posted by bigitup_j
i can't see why ntl just have 256k instead of 150k. it would be fair to the customers without set-top-box broadband and ntl would have no more trouble with the ASA or oftel.

and keep the price at £17.99 (super value)

Then we would have a Telco company to be proud of, come on Ntl: make us proud!