Pair guilty of cutting down Sycamore Gap tree

Two men have been found guilty of the "mindless destruction" of the world famous Sycamore Gap tree, the felling of which sparked international outrage.
The tree had grown in a dip on Hadrian's Wall in Northumberland for more than 100 years before it was cut down in a "moronic mission" in the early hours of 28 September 2023, Newcastle Crown Court heard.
Daniel Michael Graham, 39, from Carlisle, and Adam Carruthers, 32, from Wigton in Cumbria, were each convicted of two counts of criminal damage.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cly38wr66dro

They now have to decide what the tree was actually worth, which is a material concern in criminal damage cases.

Both these fools are now locked up on remand, but they will certainly be spending a lot longer in jail after their get sentenced in July.

I seriously can’t get my head round what they thought they were achieving.

[papa smurf]

it's a lot of fuss for a tree, we've only got 3 billion of them in the UK.

[thenry]

I keep thinking something along the lines of legendary status. Foolish way to become part of history but some do some strange things.

[mrmistoffelees]

Originally Posted by papa smurf

it's a lot of fuss for a tree, we've only got 3 billion of them in the UK.

I kind of have to agree to this, whilst I’m aware of its significance. It seems odd that we have prisons running at nearly at 100% capacity and yet we choose to remand individuals who represent minimal risk to people in society.

Originally Posted by papa smurf

it's a lot of fuss for a tree, we've only got 3 billion of them in the UK.

Yep, the whole reaction to this is just way OTT.
Same with that other one the pub cut down, its just a tree.

[Mr K]

Yep they are insane rotters, and should be sent down for it. However a week long trial? There are for worse crimes being committed every day with 1 % of the coverage and court time.

Make them plant and pay for 10 000 trees would be an appropriate sentence, or as is more likely, send them inside for a few weeks , and then let them out to sell their nutty story to the papers ( which are made from trees..). Then be a benefit burden to the state...

Two of them tried together on 2 counts each - having served on a couple of jury trials, I think that is about the time required. It depends how much of the evidence is contested, really. And these two Einsteins thought they could convince the jury it was all some big coincidence that their phone and their car were tracked to and from the Gap, and that one of them had a video of a tree being chopped down, geolocated to the same place.

[Jaymoss]

Just stop oil throwing paint at a painting it is just a painting no big deal

Well it is criminal damage and the tree is or historical importance as is the painting. No difference.

[nomadking]

So what is meant to be the basis for the valuation?

Prosecutors had initially valued the damage to the tree at £622,191, but Graham's barrister, Christopher Knox, said the authorities had since lowered their estimate to about £450,000 while his team reckoned the true figure to be "much lower than that".

[papa smurf]

Originally Posted by nomadking

So what is meant to be the basis for the valuation?

What's the going price of logs

[Jaymoss]

Did the tree attract tourism ? if so there is loss of revenue from that to consider in damages. It is not as simple as saying it is just a tree

Originally Posted by nomadking

So what is meant to be the basis for the valuation?

There isnt one, since it was never for sale (or going to be), in fact, who "owned" it.

---------- Post added at 22:06 ---------- Previous post was at 22:06 ----------

Originally Posted by Jaymoss

It is not as simple as saying it is just a tree

It really is.

It did attract tourism, having really begun to be very famous when it featured in Robin Hood Prince of Thieves in 1990. There will be lost tourism costs, but also costs associated with disposal of the tree and grounds maintenance costs with nurturing its replacement over several years to come.

It really isn’t “just a tree”, no matter how perplexing all this is to those who think in such black and white terms.

[Pierre]

A pair of knobheads whose motivation, I know not.

But, guilty only of being a public nuisance at the most, by any reasonable person, and they should never have been incarcerated, if they have been, at all …ever.

There’s tens of thousands of real crimes that impact people every day, that are ignored by the police.

This, is not a major criminal offence, if it’s criminal at all.

It’s criminal damage, according to law and the decision of a jury - and as the damage exceeds £5k it is subject to up to 10 years in jail.