School Leavers Unfit For Work 2011 Edition

[Ignitionnet]

Yep it's that old chestnut again.

As a product of grammar school education which gave him a lot of social mobility I'm a big fan of selective education, I would be interested in the perspectives of any teachers and employers that are here as to how true this story is.

Certainly anecdotally there's plenty of evidence that standards have declined, and indeed by some measures there are statistics that support this point of view.

I would agree that we need a return of grammar schools or modern equivalent .The main problem that i see is that the education system seems to think everyone is capable of the same standard and are educated such which is obviously not the case .
And as an employer albeit very small yes i think the standard is very low

[haydnwalker]

I was educated in a Comprehensive School.... I came out OK, university educated etc.

I don't necessarily think its schools that have "gone down hill" but rather, parents no longer pushing/urging their kids to become well educated, which leads to "bums".

My parents weren't posh or anything, but they saw the potential in me, and urged me to reach it.

Some people, granted, aren't academic, but some of them just want to sit around watching TV and drinking tinnies. I think TV has some part to play, as have some teachers, peer pressure etc, but ultimately, its the individual that chooses to become educated (or not) and make something of their lives (again...or not).

[Welshchris]

There was a guy in my year in school who was in what was then called the slow learners group. When he left school he was still barely able to read and write and his wife is now not only teaching him but also their two kids at the same time. I know he was a complete idiot and so on always smoking drugs and so on but i think a lot to do with his behaviour was people just gave up on him but as a teenager you dont see what you do now as an adult looking back.

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet

Yep it's that old chestnut again.

As a product of grammar school education which gave him a lot of social mobility I'm a big fan of selective education, I would be interested in the perspectives of any teachers and employers that are here as to how true this story is.

Certainly anecdotally there's plenty of evidence that standards have declined, and indeed by some measures there are statistics that support this point of view.

Standards have declined because behaviour and discipline have declined.This is as a result of children and parents now exclusively regarding their own rights as paramount.The rights of educators to do their job unimpeded and other students to get a hassle free education don't even figure.

Also business and would be employers are always complaining about this every decade..they said the same during the period of Grammar schools.They tend to see education as being only for turning out a trained workforce that they can then put straight to work without any expenditure on their part.

[Angua]

Originally Posted by Maggy J

Standards have declined because behaviour and discipline have declined.This is asa result of children and parents now exclusively regarding their own rights as paramount.The rights of educators to do their job unimpeded and other students to get a hassle free education don't even figure.

Also business and would be employers are always complaining about this every decade..they said the same during the period of Grammar schools.They tend to see education as being only for turning out a trained workforce that they can then put straight to work without any expenditure on their part.

It does seem to have become that children are taking the lead with parental support. Rather than teachers having the lead with parental support.

Would also add the loss of the apprentice system has skewed the education system toward academic study which is not suitable for all.

[haydnwalker]

Originally Posted by Maggy J

They tend to see education as being only for turning out a trained workforce that they can then put straight to work without any expenditure on their part.

Business are unfortunately being completely unrealistic with their opinions.

You can't just put someone to work with no training whatsoever. Even me, in a technical role, had to be trained, and I still do need ongoing training - its the nature of my job.

As a teacher you still get trained (otherwise what are "Training Days" for?) Private Industry cannot be any different - even if those industries say otherwise...

[Welshchris]

i have to say though my education suffered majorly as a result of being bullied and the school offering little support. I dont think i would be here now if it wasnt for a teacher who would come to find me to give me his keys to go back into his classroom on break and lunchtimes. He also used to give me a lift home sometimes. I was very very close as a teenager to suicide and now having post traumatic stress from it i have attempted it 4 times.

[v0id]

If someone fails to get ANY GCSEs, even if the grades are poor then they should be taken out back and shot as they obviously didn't even bother to turn up to the exams

[Caff]

'Unfit for work' is a scary term.
With support and inspiration anyone can reach their full potential, whatever that level is.

We all need the porter in the hospital to take us from reception to the operating table and get the instruments there swiftly, and the surgeon to work the magic, and the cleaner to help keep the germs away, and the guy/girl keeping the carpark flowing, and hospitality staff to make us smile and make sure we get fed and watered.

Get my drift?

'Reaching full potential' is all and everything to me.
There's a place in the world for everyone and it might not be 'the work place either'.

[Ignitionnet]

Originally Posted by haydnwalker

Business are unfortunately being completely unrealistic with their opinions.

You can't just put someone to work with no training whatsoever. Even me, in a technical role, had to be trained, and I still do need ongoing training - its the nature of my job.

As a teacher you still get trained (otherwise what are "Training Days" for?) Private Industry cannot be any different - even if those industries say otherwise...

It's not training in general they are complaining about, I think it's having to do basic remedial skills training in maths and English.

Obviously companies will have to accept the need to train their staff somewhat when they join, even if it's just procedural training.

[Caff]

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet

It's not training in general they are complaining about, I think it's having to do basic remedial skills training in maths and English.

If only you had sat in on one

[Ignitionnet]

Originally Posted by Caff

If only you had sat in on one

Bumhole.

Fair enough, I left myself so open you could drive a truck through, well played

[Caff]

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet

Bumhole.

Fair enough, I left myself so open you could drive a truck through, well played

I beg your pardon???

[Ignitionnet]

Originally Posted by Caff

I beg your pardon???

You made a really quite sharp funny, apparently without noticing!