HDMI leads

Juliek21 · 07-01-2010, 19:36

Have just been to Comet to buy a new TV and the salesman tried to convince me to buy a new HDMI lead for Â£60. He said the one you get with the V+ box isn't good enough.
I'm completely new to all this - does anyone have any advice please

andyandy · 07-01-2010, 19:39

Don't buy it!!

The one provided will be good enough.

Have a quick look at this

http://www.avforums.com/forums/sky-h...-big-scam.html

D_Skids · 07-01-2010, 19:49

I guarantee this will open up a minefield so I am going to say this then dive for cover!

HDMI leads are digital which means they send nothing more than 1s and 0s so the signal will either get there or it wont. The picture wont be any better or worse.

The only thing I would say would be don't buy the cheapest going just because the build quality may be crap but you shouldn't need to spend more than Â£10 or Â£15 tops.

Right i'm off!!!

Oatie · 07-01-2010, 19:58

Had an argument with a salesman in Comet a while back about this. Tried to tell me the colours would be more vivid with their 60quid cable. I would have loved to have got into a proper technical 'to do' with him but the missus dragged me away.

No need to spend more than a fiver on a cable. Only spend more if you want to go more than a few metres.

SMG · 07-01-2010, 20:04

Ha, Comet salesmen are the easiest people to con. Spout some technical crap at them & they will agree with you. Â£60.00, my backside.

MovedGoalPosts · 07-01-2010, 20:12

They want to sell you that lead because it is so overpriced due to the profit markup. It's how the store makes it's money from the gullible punter.

D_Skids · 07-01-2010, 20:12

My mate spent about Â£60 on some for his TV and he insists the picture is better but its just 'Don't want to admit I wasted Â£60' Syndrome

Anybody who has spent a lot of money on them does the same but you offer to bring you Â£10 lead round to see the difference they will make an excuse not to do it

Charlie_Bubble · 07-01-2010, 20:17

As already said by Oatie, if your cable only has to be up to about 3 metres you can safely get a much cheaper cable. It's only when you start approaching 5 metres plus that a more expensive cable is needed.

07-01-2010, 20:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by SMG

Ha, Comet salesmen are the easiest people to con. Spout some technical crap at them & they will agree with you. Â£60.00, my backside.

I asked don't know why I asked one of their sales staff the following question a year ago:

question - will there be a HD Freeview integrated TV in the foreseeable future

Answer - SKY will never let it happen

Rest my case

Flyboy · 07-01-2010, 20:30

Wasn't trying to sell you a Sky package as well by any chance?

07-01-2010, 20:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flyboy

Wasn't trying to sell you a Sky package as well by any chance?

No but he was trying to sell me a VHS player though

jem · 07-01-2010, 20:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by D_Skids

I guarantee this will open up a minefield so I am going to say this then dive for cover!

HDMI leads are digital which means they send nothing more than 1s and 0s so the signal will either get there or it wont. The picture wont be any better or worse.

...snip

Of course eveyone knows that HDMI cables are digital and therefore only send ones and zeros. Unfortunately everyone is wrong. HDMI in common with all copper (and indeed wireless) signals are NOT digital, they actually carry an analogue waveform on which is superimposed a digital signal. In simple terms the voltages on the cables are constantly changing (hence analogue) if it's above a certain value then the receiving equipment interprets it as a 1 and if it's below that value then it's a 0.

Now the longer the cable, the more the signal degrades to the point when it's no longer possible to accurately distinguish between what should be 1s and 0s and at that point the picture will fail completely. Also timing the signals is absolutely crucial, if the timing slides out of tolerance again the signal collapses, at the high frequencies involved, the cable will act as an aerial radiating radio waves out and picking up interference. This is helped by twisting the pairs of wires in a particular way. Get the number of twists per meter wrong and again the signal can degrade faster than it should.

Bend the cable and one set of wires on the outside of the will stretch more than those on the inside. Bend it too much and the difference in length can (and does) cause timing errors. HDCP is particularly sensitive to this, if HDCP doesn't handshake properly (and it does it every two seconds) then you simply won't get a picture.

So we all need to go out any pay hundreds of pounds for cables? Well no. For most cases when we are only talking about a metre or so the tolerances in the cable specs are enough that any old Â£3 cable should work just fine. However I'd be tempted to pay a little more, say Â£10 or so to be a bit more reassured that the cable has been manufactured properly.

Certainly the two or three meter Â£200-Â£300 cables that you sometimes see for sale promising much better picture quality than a Â£20 cable are really taking the p**s but I just wanted to say that HDMI is actually a very complex system and the oft repeated, 'well it's digital so it either works or it doesn't; and a Â£2 cable is just as good as a Â£500 one' just isn't true. HDMI cable are NOT all the same but unless you are dealing with long lengths or are in a particularly noisy (electrically speaking) environment, you really don't have to go overboard.

Juliek21 · 07-01-2010, 20:59

Thanks for all you help - I thought I'd probably done the right thing by saying no but it's always best to speak to those in the know. he tried to sell me an extended warranty as well. I soon put him right on that one.

andyandy · 07-01-2010, 21:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Juliek21

Thanks for all you help - I thought I'd probably done the right thing by saying no but it's always best to speak to those in the know. he tried to sell me an extended warranty as well. I soon put him right on that one.

Ha ha! Nice one! Bet you had to say 'no' to the warranty at least 5 times...

"But what if the first 3 months where free..."

Just give me the bloody TV!!

hedgie · 07-01-2010, 21:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by jem

Of course eveyone knows that HDMI cables are digital and therefore only send ones and zeros. Unfortunately everyone is wrong. HDMI in common with all copper (and indeed wireless) signals are NOT digital, they actually carry an analogue waveform on which is superimposed a digital signal. In simple terms the voltages on the cables are constantly changing (hence analogue) if it's above a certain value then the receiving equipment interprets it as a 1 and if it's below that value then it's a 0.

Now the longer the cable, the more the signal degrades to the point when it's no longer possible to accurately distinguish between what should be 1s and 0s and at that point the picture will fail completely. Also timing the signals is absolutely crucial, if the timing slides out of tolerance again the signal collapses, at the high frequencies involved, the cable will act as an aerial radiating radio waves out and picking up interference. This is helped by twisting the pairs of wires in a particular way. Get the number of twists per meter wrong and again the signal can degrade faster than it should.

Bend the cable and one set of wires on the outside of the will stretch more than those on the inside. Bend it too much and the difference in length can (and does) cause timing errors. HDCP is particularly sensitive to this, if HDCP doesn't handshake properly (and it does it every two seconds) then you simply won't get a picture.

So we all need to go out any pay hundreds of pounds for cables? Well no. For most cases when we are only talking about a metre or so the tolerances in the cable specs are enough that any old Â£3 cable should work just fine. However I'd be tempted to pay a little more, say Â£10 or so to be a bit more reassured that the cable has been manufactured properly.

Certainly the two or three meter Â£200-Â£300 cables that you sometimes see for sale promising much better picture quality than a Â£20 cable are really taking the p**s but I just wanted to say that HDMI is actually a very complex system and the oft repeated, 'well it's digital so it either works or it doesn't; and a Â£2 cable is just as good as a Â£500 one' just isn't true. HDMI cable are NOT all the same but unless you are dealing with long lengths or are in a particularly noisy (electrically speaking) environment, you really don't have to go overboard.

Well said,

I think I eventually got the same point over in this thread.

http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/sh...php?t=33654072

I got my voice heard on pages three and four.

There really is some cr@p spouted on both side of the argument. For a domestic application I am convinced that it IS worth paying a bit more for a cable. I have set my budget at the Â£20 mark.

I have read some reports that HDMI devices can synchronise more slowly with a poor quality cable. If nothing else, better quality cables are gold plated which reduces oxidisation on the contacts. If you have paid say Â£700 for a 40" screen, Â£175 for a Bluray why not Â£20 for a cable. Thats before you start considering AV Amps and Surround Sound.

Well thats my two cents worth.