ID card Bill dropped

tkiely · 05-04-2005, 23:17

It has been announced that due to time limitations before the election, the ID card Bill has been taken off the adgenda.

Personally, and professionally (IT security consultant) I found the bill itself and SOME of the people involved in its inception (who I met ina professional capacity) to be less than acceptable.

I do wonder if the Government found this election to be a very handy excuse to drop a bill which could have left tham with egg on their faces?????

Ramrod · 05-04-2005, 23:26

Definitely looks like it!

the_neurotic_cat · 05-04-2005, 23:29

Oh Thank God ... thats great news!

It would have been a total waste of time and money in regards to any serious criminal activity, just making it slightly more expensive to do whatever they would do anyway.

Egg's ? ... Face's ? ... say, whats happened to Prescot anyway?

06-04-2005, 00:27

Whilst it is good news, unfortunately all that means is that they're likely to try to stick the same thing through in the next Parliament

**Maggy** · 06-04-2005, 01:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graham

Whilst it is good news, unfortunately all that means is that they're likely to try to stick the same thing through in the next Parliament

Only if they get back in with a decent majority surely?Otherwise it will be a waste of time.

nffc · 06-04-2005, 01:54

They'll get in again unfortunately but by how much? As for the ID cards I can't see how it would add anything, it would be no security value except in the case of those without a driving licence or passport... and how many does that entail?

Surely it would make better sense for anyone without either to be "made" to have either a passport or a provisional- and then be required to produce within 48 hrs of a reasonable request.

ID cards especially those containing sensitive data, I have qualms about. I've got nowt to hide but the prospect of having a big file with potentially sensitive information, to which people can "tap into" on a computer [with the added security implications] is rather Orwellian in concept and could have human rights implications IMHO.

Making people carry ID is not a problem [I already carry a photocard licence] but the "intelligent" ID proposed, and making it compulsory, is the problem.

Surely there's a "middle way"...

jrhnewark · 06-04-2005, 02:27

Crap idea from its' inception.

Funny how Labour are finally feeling the head from the Lib Dems - and about time too. I want rid of Labour.

Monster Jedi · 06-04-2005, 02:29

It reminds me of Mother Russia. "Papers Please."

me283 · 06-04-2005, 08:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by nffc

They'll get in again unfortunately but by how much? As for the ID cards I can't see how it would add anything, it would be no security value except in the case of those without a driving licence or passport... and how many does that entail?

Surely it would make better sense for anyone without either to be "made" to have either a passport or a provisional- and then be required to produce within 48 hrs of a reasonable request.

ID cards especially those containing sensitive data, I have qualms about. I've got nowt to hide but the prospect of having a big file with potentially sensitive information, to which people can "tap into" on a computer [with the added security implications] is rather Orwellian in concept and could have human rights implications IMHO.

Making people carry ID is not a problem [I already carry a photocard licence] but the "intelligent" ID proposed, and making it compulsory, is the problem.

Surely there's a "middle way"...

Personally I can see the benefits, but agree that a "middle way" might be better. Unfortunately it is a sign of the times, and the way society has evolved, that sees us even considering a need for such a Bill.

Xaccers · 06-04-2005, 08:07

This is good news.
Don't get me wrong, I'm for ID cards as I've seen the benifits a well thought out and implimented ID card scheme can bring to people in other countries (where the locals also don't have an issue with cards either)
Its just (from current evidence) I have no confidence in Labour to impliment such a scheme correctly.
If they did try, you can practically guarentee that it would be late, way over budget, and not do what it's supposed to do!

me283 · 06-04-2005, 08:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xaccers

This is good news.
Don't get me wrong, I'm for ID cards as I've seen the benifits a well thought out and implimented ID card scheme can bring to people in other countries (where the locals also don't have an issue with cards either)
Its just (from current evidence) I have no confidence in Labour to impliment such a scheme correctly.
If they did try, you can practically guarentee that it would be late, way over budget, and not do what it's supposed to do!

Right with you on that one Xaccers. And I am struggling with the concept of how the whole scheme would impinge on the wonderful "human rights"... Just imagine how it would be if the wonderful Mr. Prescott were put in charge of it!

philip.j.fry · 06-04-2005, 08:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Incognitas

Only if they get back in with a decent majority surely?Otherwise it will be a waste of time.

Unfortunately, I'm fairly certain that if we have a Conservative government they will pick the idea up as their own

06-04-2005, 12:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Incognitas

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graham

they're likely to try to stick the same thing through in the next Parliament

Only if they get back in with a decent majority surely?Otherwise it will be a waste of time.

It depends on which way the Tories go. First they said they wouldn't support it, then they said they would if it fulfilled their "five tests", then they decided it wouldn't and said they would not support it (presumably because they saw more possible votes in that).

After the Election they can support it again without needing to worry about losing votes.

Stuart · 06-04-2005, 12:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xaccers

This is good news.
Don't get me wrong, I'm for ID cards as I've seen the benifits a well thought out and implimented ID card scheme can bring to people in other countries (where the locals also don't have an issue with cards either)
Its just (from current evidence) I have no confidence in Labour to impliment such a scheme correctly.
If they did try, you can practically guarentee that it would be late, way over budget, and not do what it's supposed to do!

Agreed. I too can see the benefits (not sure increased security will be one as someone will inevitably find a way to forge ID cards), but I don't trust the government to implement it. Look at the fun they've had with the various projects they have been involved with so far (CPS anyone?).

Quote:

Originally Posted by me283

Right with you on that one Xaccers. And I am struggling with the concept of how the whole scheme would impinge on the wonderful "human rights"... Just imagine how it would be if the wonderful Mr. Prescott were put in charge of it!

Heavens.. We agree on something?

BBKing · 06-04-2005, 12:26

The Tories, certainly Michael Howard, are just as keen on ID cards, so no go there.

We're British, we don't do goons in uniform demanding papers. A hearty 'Get Stuffed' to that idea. Check out how the ID card scheme the existed during WW2 ended - basically a member of the public told a copper to eff off - it got to court and the judge ruled that the law was daft.

The key point here was never the ID card - it's the national database of about 50 different things about everyone in Britain (except foreigners, including the Irish, who in particular are allowed to come in without passports, either. Of course, there's no terrorist threat there, is there?). Such a database is a) invasive b) expensive and c) wouldn't work properly anyway. The risk is that if your details on it are incorrect, they are seen as correct by the entire State apparatus and you are the one who is wrong because 'the computer says so'. Technology isn't advanced enough yet and Government IT is less trustworthy than an abacus anyway.

The only people who'd benefit would be policemen with an interest in bossing people around and large multinational consultancies who'd take billions of our money and deliver a crap system.