Racial Equality ??

Have the Commission for Racial Equality finally lost the plot ?

Black boys may have to be separated from their classmates to help improve their school performance, says the Commission for Racial Equality.

Link > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/4323979.stm

[punky]

Originally Posted by Paul M

Have the Commission for Racial Equality finally lost the plot ?



Link > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/4323979.stm

Correct me if i'm wrong, but isn't the whole reason the Civil Rights movement was set up in the first place - to stop that happening?

Truth is far stranger than fiction.

[Ramrod]

He also suggested black fathers should be denied access to their sons if they refuse to attend parents' evenings

Actually it makes sense to me.What they mean is that the youngsters need to be separated from other like minded young black teenage boys because they are a poor influence on each other education wise.It's not a racist issue at all just a means to address a problem in the short term.

Young black teenage boys are seriously underachieving and it is an issue that needs to be addressed.Some of these boys have no positive male role model to influence them and for some of them an absent father is the only example they have of a black male in their lives.There are too few teachers who are black let alone male ones.So I don't think that the gentleman concerned is mad and the commission have most definitely not lost the plot.

IF young black teenage boys continue to leave school with as few qualifications that some do at present we will end up with a vast proportion of disaffected young black men.Not trying to stereotype but I can see how that might lead to serious problems in the areas that they live in.A state of no hope already exists in some inner city areas in this country.A good education that leads to a good job with a reasonable income is what we all aspire to.Some youngsters in the black communities are not buying into this however and it can only lead to trouble for society in the wrong run.

[Niles Crane]

Originally Posted by Incognitas

Actually it makes sense to me.What they mean is that the youngsters need to be separated from other like minded young black teenage boys because they are a poor influence on each other education wise.It's not a racist issue at all just a means to address a problem in the short term.

Young black teenage boys are seriously underachieving and it is an issue that needs to be addressed.Some of these boys have no positive male role model to influence them and for some of them an absent father is the only example they have of a black male in their lives.There are too few teachers who are black let alone male ones.So I don't think that the gentleman concerned is mad and the commission have most definitely not lost the plot.

IF young black teenage boys continue to leave school with as few qualifications that some do at present we will end up with a vast proportion of disaffected young black men.Not trying to stereotype but I can see how that might lead to serious problems in the areas that they live in.A state of no hope already exists in some inner city areas in this country.A good education that leads to a good job with a reasonable income is what we all aspire to.Some youngsters in the black communities are not buying into this however and it can only lead to trouble for society in the wrong run.

Very well put.

Originally Posted by Paul M

Have the Commission for Racial Equality finally lost the plot ?

Or maybe they've done some joined up thinking?

However this isn't IMO simply to do with Black Boys, there seems, in some groups, to be a culture of "it's not cool to do well at school", ie not simply not being "swotty" but actually trying to do badly.

That may do wonders for the "teen image", but it's damn all use for their future.

[Escapee]

Originally Posted by Incognitas

Actually it makes sense to me.What they mean is that the youngsters need to be separated from other like minded young black teenage boys because they are a poor influence on each other education wise.It's not a racist issue at all just a means to address a problem in the short term.

Young black teenage boys are seriously underachieving and it is an issue that needs to be addressed.Some of these boys have no positive male role model to influence them and for some of them an absent father is the only example they have of a black male in their lives.There are too few teachers who are black let alone male ones.So I don't think that the gentleman concerned is mad and the commission have most definitely not lost the plot.

IF young black teenage boys continue to leave school with as few qualifications that some do at present we will end up with a vast proportion of disaffected young black men.Not trying to stereotype but I can see how that might lead to serious problems in the areas that they live in.A state of no hope already exists in some inner city areas in this country.A good education that leads to a good job with a reasonable income is what we all aspire to.Some youngsters in the black communities are not buying into this however and it can only lead to trouble for society in the wrong run.

I see, and somewhat agree with the idea if a group is not performing and it will help them to improve.

However, think what a fuss we would see if for instance it was quoted as "White boys to be seperated etc etc etc"

I wonder how much fuss the people who shout about racial equality would make about it!

The whole situation would be deemed racist if it was reversed.

I just read this article and nearly choked on my breakfast!

Only someone from the CRE could possibly suggest this without demands for his resignation from everywhere.

As to whether it makes sense? Probably.

Just as it makes sense to educate girls and boys in separate schools. Both do better without the distracting influence of the other.

What is being called for here? Separate schools for girls and boys AND separate schools based on religion, ethnicity?

So now our equality/integration (political correctness etc.) would have us segragating everyone during their formative years, say from 4-18, and then we'll just put them right back into society at large and expect them all to understand each other and accept each other.
Yeah, right.

While this might be ideal for individual groups, it's hardly a recipe for success for society as a whole.

[punky]

I suspect old Trev has no knowlege at all of the civil rights movement in the US then.

Good job the people involved in Brown vs Board Of Education are all dead, because they'll be spitting feathers atm.

My personally feeling on this is that if these black boys are causing trouble, then sitting them next to like minded people deliberately would mean they would encourage and help escalate each other. In that respect such a class of kids would be unteachable and require something an ex-SAS or 1st Para teacher just to maintain some kind of order.

Lets say a white person said this, purely out of a desire to all round improve things. Do you think Trev would come out and agree with him? Or say that the guy is racist, etc?

[Russ]

Originally Posted by Incognitas

Actually it makes sense to me.What they mean is that the youngsters need to be separated from other like minded young black teenage boys because they are a poor influence on each other education wise.It's not a racist issue at all just a means to address a problem in the short term.

Young black teenage boys are seriously underachieving and it is an issue that needs to be addressed.Some of these boys have no positive male role model to influence them and for some of them an absent father is the only example they have of a black male in their lives.There are too few teachers who are black let alone male ones.So I don't think that the gentleman concerned is mad and the commission have most definitely not lost the plot.

IF young black teenage boys continue to leave school with as few qualifications that some do at present we will end up with a vast proportion of disaffected young black men.Not trying to stereotype but I can see how that might lead to serious problems in the areas that they live in.A state of no hope already exists in some inner city areas in this country.A good education that leads to a good job with a reasonable income is what we all aspire to.Some youngsters in the black communities are not buying into this however and it can only lead to trouble for society in the wrong run.

So Apartheid/Segregation is ok if it benefits the blacks...

</frivelous comment>

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by Incognitas

Actually it makes sense to me.What they mean is that the youngsters need to be separated from other like minded young black teenage boys because they are a poor influence on each other education wise.It's not a racist issue at all just a means to address a problem in the short term.

what about poor achieving white boys, asian boys? do we just them go by the wayside.

Young black teenage boys are seriously underachieving and it is an issue that needs to be addressed.Some of these boys have no positive male role model to influence them and for some of them an absent father is the only example they have of a black male in their lives.

Newsflash the nuclear family rarely exists, there are plenty of white boys from single parent families.

There are too few teachers who are black let alone male ones.So I don't think that the gentleman concerned is mad and the commission have most definitely not lost the plot.

There are too few teachers full stop.

IF young black teenage boys continue to leave school with as few qualifications that some do at present we will end up with a vast proportion of disaffected young black men.Not trying to stereotype but I can see how that might lead to serious problems in the areas that they live in.A state of no hope already exists in some inner city areas in this country.A good education that leads to a good job with a reasonable income is what we all aspire to.Some youngsters in the black communities are not buying into this however and it can only lead to trouble for society in the wrong run.

But isn't this an inner city, young male attitude. It's not a race issue. I agree something needs to be addressed but why single out the Black kids for preferential treatment.

[Ramrod]

Much as this seems like turning the clock back to segregation I think it's a good thing that someone is looking at different ideas on how to teach young black boys. I do not however, think that the teaching system is failing them (as that hypocritical black female labour minister once said) they are failing themselves as a result of peer pressure and probably black youth culture. I don't really understand how teaching them on their own would help matters as they would still be in a class with others of their ilk.
__________________

Originally Posted by Pierre

what about poor achieving white boys, asian boys? do we just them go by the wayside.
Newsflash the nuclear family rarely exists, there are plenty of white boys from single parent families.
but why single out the Black kids for preferential treatment.

We need to start somewhere and thats a good a place as any

[punky]

I'd like to know why Trev has to bring race into this. I suspect he has to, to justify his own existance. If he isn't moaning about something, they he might be made redundant

When I was at school, our years were separated into different groups. The smarter in one, and the less-smarter in another. Race never came into it. Smart black people when in the smart group, and the less-smart black people went in the less-smart group. When I went to secondary school and groups went from 2 to 5, it wsa exam and homework results which dictated what class you were in(scholarship pupils were in their own supergroup naturally).

I can't see whats wrong with that and why race needs to be a contributing factor. Do smart black people have to be put into this black group filled with less-smarter black people? And if not, then what is the point of the whole thing?

[SOSAGES]

i brave move it cant carry on as it is now - if it upsets a few people so be it, you dont like it move

Originally Posted by Incognitas

Actually it makes sense to me.What they mean is that the youngsters need to be separated from other like minded young black teenage boys because they are a poor influence on each other education wise.It's not a racist issue at all just a means to address a problem in the short term.

Young black teenage boys are seriously underachieving and it is an issue that needs to be addressed.Some of these boys have no positive male role model to influence them and for some of them an absent father is the only example they have of a black male in their lives.There are too few teachers who are black let alone male ones.So I don't think that the gentleman concerned is mad and the commission have most definitely not lost the plot.

IF young black teenage boys continue to leave school with as few qualifications that some do at present we will end up with a vast proportion of disaffected young black men.Not trying to stereotype but I can see how that might lead to serious problems in the areas that they live in.A state of no hope already exists in some inner city areas in this country.A good education that leads to a good job with a reasonable income is what we all aspire to.Some youngsters in the black communities are not buying into this however and it can only lead to trouble for society in the wrong run.

I'm not sure about the wisdom of removing black youth from their peers. I think black youth do have role models very successful role models in all walks of life. Clearly, there are black youth who have succeeded in the present set up. A teacher is a teacher regardless of ethnicity.

I agree we have got to deal with a section of black youth who are disaffected and there may be other external reasons for disaffection.

Separation is not the answer.