Cameron: No means testing for pensioner benefits

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-31580520

Universal benefits for pensioners will once again be protected if the Conservatives win May's general election, David Cameron will say later.

Mr Cameron promised at the 2010 election not to introduce means testing for benefits such as bus passes, TV licences and the winter fuel allowance. In a speech, he will repeat that pledge for the next Parliament.

Just a week after announcing that young people (18 to 25) will have to work to get their Job Seekers Allowance it highlights the inequality over who is paying for austerity. There is one section of society that has been entirely ring-fenced from the cuts from triple-locked pensions, to not means-testing the benefits as above, to privileged savings rates under-writing from the Government. Meanwhile equivalent benefits have been either completely taken away from the young or subjected to many conditions.

I think it's hard to take the Tories seriously when they talk about the need for austerity when they're protecting their biggest consistency from it's affects. How much moral authority do they have to make the case for it when they're put into power on the back of voters who are immune from it? It's not that I think these benefits should be taken away from the elderly either, they shouldn't, but they need to at least stop being so aggressive in cutting it for the young. Bring back EMA and travel passes for the under-20s. They too rarely earn enough to make these benefits trivial, means-test it if you have too.

It's a fairly straightforward promise to make, given the potential cost of the means testing would make any saving negligible.

Originally Posted by Chris

It's a fairly straightforward promise to make, given the potential cost of the means testing would make any saving negligible.

And it's a pretty standard reply that would be given by all parties..If they said it first.

Originally Posted by Chris

It's a fairly straightforward promise to make, given the potential cost of the means testing would make any saving negligible.

That's true of a lot of these cuts though. The amounts are often quite minor in comparison to the overall budget. Most of it seems more about symbolism of doing something against profligate spending rather than a genuine attempt to cut the deficit.

[heero_yuy]

Originally Posted by Damien

That's true of a lot of these cuts though. The amounts are often quite minor in comparison to the overall budget. Most of it seems more about symbolism of doing something against profligate spending rather than a genuine attempt to cut the deficit.

Many a mickle makes a muckle as they say. Save a lot of little bits and then you have a big saving. By the same token make lots of small wasting decisions and suddenly there's a huge deficit.

[Kursk]

Originally Posted by Damien

It's not that I think these benefits should be taken away from the elderly either, they shouldn't, but they need to at least stop being so aggressive in cutting it for the young.

So you're happy that pensioners receive these benefits but unhappy that younger people don't get enough in benefits?

The juxtaposition seems irrelevant unless you feel the Cons are robbing Peter to pay Paul?

Originally Posted by Kursk

So you're happy that pensioners receive these benefits but unhappy that younger people don't get enough in benefits?

The juxtaposition seems irrelevant unless you feel the Cons are robbing Peter to pay Paul?

I am unhappy that the unequal application of benefit cuts to disproportionately target the young.

[heero_yuy]

Originally Posted by Damien

I am unhappy that the unequal application of benefit cuts to disproportionately target the young.

But the young are in a better position to improve themselves and their income. Pensioners have just what they have and are unlikely to be able supplement their income from a job even part time.

They as a group are also less likely to claim benefits they are entitled to if they were means tested.

[Kursk]

Originally Posted by Damien

Bring back EMA and travel passes for the under-20s.

EMA is available in the UK where respective Governments have made it a priority from their slice of the pie.

Travel passes - buy a bike, you're young. .

[Ramrod]

Why should pensioners be means tested? They paid into the pot all their lives on the understanding that they would get X amount paid back to them when they retired. It would be unfair to now move the goalposts.
Young people on the other hand, haven't been promised the whole 'cradle to grave' thing

[rhyds]

It all boils down to one simple fact.

The over 65s vote.

The under 25s don't.

[Taf]

Originally Posted by rhyds

It all boils down to one simple fact.

The over 65s vote.

The under 25s don't.

So true.

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by Chris

It's a fairly straightforward promise to make, given the potential cost of the means testing would make any saving negligible.

Iirc the saving from scrapping housing benefit for under 25's wasn't huge in context and the bedroom tax saving were swallowed up by presumably related fraud and error in the housing benefit system going up three times, negligible savings or costs didn't matter then so why doesn't Dave just tell the truth about why he is terrified of upsetting the old folk.

[Kursk]

Well, Dave might believe that pensioners deserve their benefits and/or that if a section of the electorate can't be bothered to participate, then they get what they are given.

Perhaps the penny will drop with young people that now they are out of nappies they have responsibilities to fulfil.

Most pensioners do deserve their benefits but to universally give a benefit when it is not needed is a simple way to reduce the bill a bit and would make the changes to the system look fairer even if they weren't. There is a sizeable group of pensioners that do not need the pension they get from the state and wouldn't even miss it if it were gone how can it be right when we're constantly told we need to keep hitting some groups but not others. If the system cannot be universally fair then it needs to be properly reformed this is just the conservative version of using the system for their own ends the very thing that has created the problem in the first place

This whole "welfare reform" act the tories and disgustingly the lib dems have been selling the last five years is a joke it was cost cutting on the most vulnerable and weakest groups in our society and by and large the public have said and done nothing to stop it in fact they got behind it. Safety nets are there not for the planned way you think your life will go but for those times when unplanned disaster strikes and as a so called developed nation we shoud have one but it needs to better then it is and less widely used as it is.

No reasonable person in the UK argues the benefits system is not fulfiling the role it was intended or that for a small number has become a choice rather then the safety net it was always meant to be. But the system is what politicians have made it and as the years and parites have gone by they made changes to the system to better allow them too misuse it as they needed too and then pretend they will sort the problem out which none of them have either the intention or real will to do. We need reform and we need it badly but people have to take off the blinkers look into it and see a con job when it's happening and stop complaining that politicians treat us like idiots when we allow them to get away with it so much.

More people this year will have no party to vote for because they are all a gurgled mess in the centre ground they all spout the same populist rubbish to thier targeted demographic apart from ed milliband and while i never liked him or agree with much of what he says he has raised his head above the cosy little wall and said things that differentiate himself from the rest. This country is in a mess and none of them are interested in really sorting out many of the problems we have because they are not affected by it directly and their own vested interests do not rely on it so no solutions just more hot air for the foreseeable future.

How long will it take the public to stop letting these crooks at westminster play us off against each other and start actually demanding they become the public servants they are supposed to be rather then a bunch of trough swillers looking after themselves and thier friends sometimes we really are more idiotic then they even think.