General : VM Marketing Cold Calls & Customer Security

[MovedGoalPosts]

So last night I get a phone call to my mobile. Claims to be on behalf of Virgin Media and clearly from overseas. "I have an offer for you on your TV service"

They then want to take me through security, and want two letters from my password.

Now call me paranoid, but, this is a cold call. They have called me, I don't actually know it is Virgin Media, they just claim it is.

I could give out these two password letters. And I know that by itself isn't a problem. But in a couple of weeks when I've forgotten about this, somebody else calls, and again I give out two different letters. Doesn't take too much for people to start to be able to predict my password.

Now if I use that or similar passwords elsewhere (I'm trying to avoid this, but to be honest there are now so many places that we use passwords that inevitably a pattern forms), things get more vulnerable.

So Virgin Media, if you want to make me an offer that is too good to refuse, perhaps, if you must cold call (by the way I thought I was opted out of such stuff). Just describe the offer. If I want it I can call back on a number that I recognise, and then I'll be happy to do your security.

Oh and by the way, I deal with all companies the same way, especially credit card when I get called to apparently check an unexpected transaction.

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by Rob

So last night I get a phone call to my mobile. Claims to be on behalf of Virgin Media and clearly from overseas. "I have an offer for you on your TV service"

They then want to take me through security, and want two letters from my password.

Now call me paranoid, but, this is a cold call. They have called me, I don't actually know it is Virgin Media, they just claim it is.

I could give out these two password letters. And I know that by itself isn't a problem. But in a couple of weeks when I've forgotten about this, somebody else calls, and again I give out two different letters. Doesn't take too much for people to start to be able to predict my password.

Now if I use that or similar passwords elsewhere (I'm trying to avoid this, but to be honest there are now so many places that we use passwords that inevitably a pattern forms), things get more vulnerable.

So Virgin Media, if you want to make me an offer that is too good to refuse, perhaps, if you must cold call (by the way I thought I was opted out of such stuff). Just describe the offer. If I want it I can call back on a number that I recognise, and then I'll be happy to do your security.

Oh and by the way, I deal with all companies the same way, especially credit card when I get called to apparently check an unexpected transaction.

The thing is, if everyone responded to cold calls by saying they were not interested and put the phone down, the call centre sales teams would go out of business, the fraudsters would get fed up and go back to robbing banks and we would all get some peace.

Well, unless you're a banker of course!

[BenMcr]

Originally Posted by Rob

So Virgin Media, if you want to make me an offer that is too good to refuse, perhaps, if you must cold call (by the way I thought I was opted out of such stuff). Just describe the offer. If I want it I can call back on a number that I recognise, and then I'll be happy to do your security.

I believe the reason they ask for security immediately is that if they start describing the offer without doing so e.g. 'Upgrade to TV XL for only £5' or something, it could be classed as disclosing details of the state of your account at present, which is then breaking DPA rules.

[WBC-WORKER]

Originally Posted by BenMcr

I believe the reason they ask for security immediately is that if they start describing the offer without doing so e.g. 'Upgrade to TV XL for only £5' or something, it could be classed as disclosing details of the state of your account at present, which is then breaking DPA rules.

it should be a two way street - if they want Customers to prove who they are then its only reasonable that ' they prove who they are '

it should be dead easy to store a ' caller password ' so that they can use it when they call.

for far too long Companies hide behind the DPA even although the act is there to protect Customers.

[gizuk]

Originally Posted by BenMcr

I believe the reason they ask for security immediately is that if they start describing the offer without doing so e.g. 'Upgrade to TV XL for only £5' or something, it could be classed as disclosing details of the state of your account at present, which is then breaking DPA rules.

How on earth would offering a discounted cable package come up against the Data Protection Act???

[BenMcr]

The DPA is about releasing information to 3rd parties. If you call someone up and immediately launch into a discussion about what upgrades are on offer, then they are specific to where the account is at present - therefore you are releasing details about the account.

It's been several years since I was on the phone, but when I was we had rules that unless it was straight away if we called someone back after they had called in, we had to do DPA again as potentially we could end up speaking to the wrong person.

[gizuk]

Originally Posted by BenMcr

The DPA is about releasing information to 3rd parties. If you call someone up and immediately launch into a discussion about what upgrades are on offer, then they are specific to where the account is at present - therefore you are releasing details about the account.

It's been several years since I was on the phone, but when I was we had rules that unless it was straight away if we called someone back after they had called in, we had to do DPA again as potentially we could end up speaking to the wrong person.

No, the DPA is about releasing personal, identifiable information.

Talking about an offer doesn't need protection.

I can understand the company wanting to make sure they are talking to the correct person, but wrapping it up in the "DPA" label is like blaming everything on that evil Europe.

[japitts]

Originally Posted by WBC-WORKER

it should be a two way street - if they want Customers to prove who they are then its only reasonable that ' they prove who they are '

it should be dead easy to store a ' caller password ' so that they can use it when they call.

for far too long Companies hide behind the DPA even although the act is there to protect Customers.

Absolutely right - I've taken to asking these callers to quote two letters from my password to me, and I'll quote two back at them... or something similar.

[BenMcr]

Originally Posted by gizuk

No, the DPA is about releasing personal, identifiable information.

Talking about an offer doesn't need protection.

I can understand the company wanting to make sure they are talking to the correct person, but wrapping it up in the "DPA" label is like blaming everything on that evil Europe.

Sorry, my error in my reply.

But what is 'personal information' can still be fairly wide:

http://ico.org.uk/for_organisations/...nce_guide.ashx

Does the data ‘relate to’ the identifiable living individual, whether in personal or family life, business or profession?

Yes The data is ‘personal data’ for the purposes of the DPA

Is the data used, or is it to be used, to inform or influence actions or decisions affecting an identifiable individual?

Yes The data is ‘personal data’ for the purposes of the DPA.

Informing or influencing decisions - Example: Data about an individual’s phone or electricity account clearly determines what the
individual will be charged.

So to me unless the offer has no direct connection to the existing account e.g. 'pay this standard price for Sky Sports that everyone can get' then it's a personal offer e.g. 'we're offering you Talk Unlimited because we can see your call usage is high' and would be considered 'related to' or 'used to inform or influence actions of' an identifiable individual.

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by WBC-WORKER

it should be a two way street - if they want Customers to prove who they are then its only reasonable that ' they prove who they are '

it should be dead easy to store a ' caller password ' so that they can use it when they call.

for far too long Companies hide behind the DPA even although the act is there to protect Customers.

Or maybe... 'If you are trying to sell something to me, press 1. If you want to know what I think of your company, press 2. If you want to know whether I have signed up to the preference service and your call is unlawful, press 3. If you want to make a donation......etc.

I am getting seriously fed up with cold callers, as you may appreciate!

[Doug P]

I would never deal that way anyway from any cold call. I might have lost the odd good deal but doubt is more than four or five and they were hardly worth a fortune if they were genuine.

Much happier to say no thanks to cold callers.

[BenMcr]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

If you want to know whether I have signed up to the preference service and your call is unlawful, press 3.

It's not always unlawful.

http://consumers.ofcom.org.uk/phone/...lls/#stopcalls

Also, TPS registration does not work if you have previously given a firm permission to market to you by phone.

You may have done this without even realising. For example, some forms include a tick box which allows you to opt-in, or in some cases opt-out, of direct marketing by that organisation.

By opting-in (or not opting-out) you may inadvertently have agreed to receive sales and marketing calls, even though your number is registered with the TPS.

I have NEVER been contacted in this way by phone by VM.I get emails instead informing me of any offers or they mail me.So I too would be wondering why they had phoned me and asked for my details.

[Bananaman_007]

I have been with Virgin for 4 years now and i am hounded to the extreme. Every week i get personal mobile phone offers, i have no idea why as i have told them time and time again to remove me from the mailing lists and that i am in a mobile contact elsewhere. They have now taken to calling me trying to get me to upgrade to Sky Sports or movies with exclusive offers. These exclusive offers are not so exclusive as they have been quoted on here (3 month half price movies and sports). I explained to the pushy woman i have no interest in either and she said something along the lines of what about when your friends come over and want to watch movies or sports. That just made my angry and i terminated the call.

Block the number?