O2 Plc Shares - Cash Alternative

[MovedGoalPosts]

MMO2, formerly cellnet, was hived off from the BT group a few years ago. Many punters who bought BT shares will have been issues with some MMO2 shares when the demerger occured.

Today I received a cheque under the heading of "O2 plc - Capital Reorganisation". Apparently my pitiful sized holding of MMO2 Shares have been sold, as part of MMO2 being swallowed into a new parent group O2 plc under some form of "capital reorganisation".

Now I do not recall having at any time given my specific consent to allow my shares to be sold. Reading a note, apparently I have either "elected" or have made a "deemed election" for cash instead of shares in the reorganised company. Apparently if you did not make any response, you have made a deemed election for this cash alternative instead of shares.

Looking on the MMO2 web site they were going through the motions of this in January, and might have contacted me at that time. I honestly cannot recall having seen anything, and certainly nothing that clearly and obviously stated my shares would be sold if I did not say I wanted to retain them.

In simple terms, if I do not specifically and positively consent to the sale of shares, which are my property, how can they legally be sold?

[paulyoung666]

probably some obsure legal way of doing things that the layman will never ever understand

[bmxbandit]

Originally Posted by MovedGoalPosts

In simple terms, if I do not specifically and positively consent to the sale of shares, which are my property, how can they legally be sold?

maybe they had a call option on the shares? check your original documentation. looks like they should have sent you something, but it all seems to above board imho

i started to read the info pdf they released, but was beginning to lose the will to live after the first page...

[MovedGoalPosts]

Originally Posted by paulyoung666

probably some obsure legal way of doing things that the layman will never ever understand

Possibly, but these shares were commonly issued to the layman, as a rusult of government sell offs, so special care is needed, I would hope, to spell things out
__________________

Originally Posted by bmxbandit

maybe they had a call option on the shares? check your original documentation. looks like they should have sent you something, but it all seems to above board imho

i started to read the info pdf they released, but was beginning to lose the will to live after the first page...

Maybe, but if they do have such a thing, and being ignorant on this stuff, only bought shares in BT as years ago, it seemed to be the thing to do. I can't recollect any one telling me that I could invest for only as long as they wanted me too. It does seem rather unfair.

& I agree about the will to live, which is why the smallholder of these sorts of shares will probably have missed out or misunderstood?

[bmxbandit]

are you being given the market value of the shares, or is it at a previously agreed price?

these things arent weighed in favour of the average joe, unless you're prepared to sift through endless pages of small print theres always a chance you'll get shafted. it's business, it aint fair...

[MovedGoalPosts]

It seems to be market value as at 5:00pm on March 2005 (some sort of effective date I think) plus 5 p for every share that was held, being some sort of incentive. That may be a reasonable offer, but that isn't really, to me, the point.

I recall seeing something in the city pages of a paper a few days ago that a number of people had gone for the cash offer. The paper thought they should have kept the shares, for the medium long term, althouhg price has since dropped.

I didn't need the cash back but know that it might have cost me more, in relative terms share dealings, etc., If I'd sold on my own on the future. I understand that O2 felt they had too many small shareholdings and that was costing them money. I might have chosen to sell, had I have realised or understood, I might not. My choice was removed. That seems wrong that by failing to act, you loose your ownership, even if you are reimbursed.

I just don't get how someone can sell what is my onwership / investment without my positive agreement to it.

[bmxbandit]

If you do not complete and return the enclosed White form (Form of Election), or revoke it and fail to
advise mmO2 of your revised choice, you will be deemed to have elected for the Cash Alternative.

if you didnt get the letter, looks like you'll just have to put up with it!

looks to me like mmO2 ran out of liquid cash so got the parent company O2 to buy them out. a pretty unusual move by the looks of it, which needed a court order to allow to happen. i'd be willing to bet there'd be something in the small print of your orginal shares that says they are allowed to do this under exceptional circumstances.

[MovedGoalPosts]

I think I'll write a letter to the Registrars asking for confirmation that it was legal.

[Aragorn]

IMO, you shouold be thankful you did get the money for them! My 100 mm02 shares are in a Crest acc and O2 decided that they wouldn't buy back Crest lodged shares, so I'm still stuck with £100 of shares that would cost ~£15 to sell Still they're a long term investment

[SMHarman]

O2 got fed up with the costs of dealing with their small shareholders (you) as something silly like 95% of the members held 100 shares makeing up less than 4% of the share ownership. Dividend cheques cost more to print and send than their value, the register was expensive to maintain etc.

So they petitioned that it would be in the best interests of the company to liquidate these shares through a buyback. At the same time decided to do a tidy up of the ownerhship structure and also rename the listed company O2. This was all approved by the courts, shareholders etc and is above board.

You had to positivly agree to keep the shares if you wanted to - financial advisors think that this is the best course of action as mobile phone networks are a good long term investment.

Did you keep the registrar up to date on your address? It would seem so if you got the cheque. Did you really not get the documents? Did they come attached to teh financial statements and you just chose to bin them?

Talk to the registrar. You may be able to get the decision unwound, but I doubt it. If you really want them, you can buy them back with the cheque you have just recieved at less than they bought them from you and make a few p profit.

[TigaSefi]

i postively said I wanted to keep my shares cos I like being an awkward git and the dividends I get are nice enough to treat myself to stuff.

[andygrif]

Originally Posted by MovedGoalPosts

In simple terms, if I do not specifically and positively consent to the sale of shares, which are my property, how can they legally be sold?

Let me first say I'm not an expert on share dealing so this may be utterly wrong....

The way I understand it is that you do not have any property being sold here. You have a cash investment in a company, the bit of paper with the number of shares you own is only a statement if you like, you don't physically own anything. Well technically the bit of paper is worth 0.001p in most cases.

As a shareholder you have a right of opinion, but it would seem that the decision has been made without you, which could be down to the number of shares you own.

There's something funky going on at O2..which means that MMO2 has become O2 following a High Court rubber stamp of some debt restructuring. As a result shareholders were offered a decent premium for taking a cash offer or to elect to hold new O2 shares instead.

I would guess that one of two things have happened.

1. If no reply came from you as to your preference then they assumed you wanted the cash and sent the cheque to you.

2. The group/company that administrates your share pot collectively elected to accept the cash price.

It's worth getting in touch with your stockbroker, or if you held the shares directly with MMO2 get in touch with O2's brokers (I think it's LloydsTSB) to find out what the deal is.

Whilst it may be too late to reinstate your previous shares, if it can be shown that someone has acted negligently then you have a case to ask for the cash equivalent of today new O2 share price or for the costs it would involve in putting you back to the position you would be in if they had sent the letter asking if you wanted to convert your shares.

Like I said though, I am NOT an expert...you should seek the advice of someone who is...and I am not 100% au fait with the whole situation with O2 either!!

[MovedGoalPosts]

Looks like there's a bit of a hornet's nest stirred up on this one.

The "helpline" from Lloyds TSB registrars is overloaded, and just disconnects you

[SMHarman]

Originally Posted by MovedGoalPosts

Looks like there's a bit of a hornet's nest stirred up on this one.

The "helpline" from Lloyds TSB registrars is overloaded, and just disconnects you

O2 sent lots of documents out - despite the outside of the envelope saying "Important - Response Required - Time Sensitive Information - Your investment may be at risk if you do not respond" - your average joe public decided this meant ignore or put in the bin, now the cheque arrives they suddenly realise that "Important - Response Required - Time Sensitive Information - Your investment may be at risk if you do not respond" was true.

Not saying that is the case for the OP as he / she genuinely may not have recieved the docs, but I bet it is the case for most of them.

[TigaSefi]

Originally Posted by SMHarman

O2 sent lots of documents out - despite the outside of the envelope saying "Important - Response Required - Time Sensitive Information - Your investment may be at risk if you do not respond" - your average joe public decided this meant ignore or put in the bin, now the cheque arrives they suddenly realise that "Important - Response Required - Time Sensitive Information - Your investment may be at risk if you do not respond" was true.

Not saying that is the case for the OP as he / she genuinely may not have recieved the docs, but I bet it is the case for most of them.

Unfortunately that is true. I routinely open every single piece of mail I get before deciding to junk it or it may have some use.