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Originally Posted by Xaccers
Question to squatters: Did you obtain illegal entry
Squatters: Ooo no, the window was wide open, we didn't smash it then repair it, because that would mean we broke the law and you could evict us without a court order.
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Xaccers, with all due respect, I think you are trying to belittle the issue here.
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Originally Posted by Xaccers
Mr Angry, while you are out shopping and have left your house empty, someone could break in, repair the damage and remove the evidence of the criminal activity, and then change your locks.
Until you can get a PIO showing that you have a right to be in the house, there is nothing that can be done.
The time required to claim squatters rights is simply the time to break in, clean up and change locks.
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PIO's apply only where the property in question was previously occupied by a tenant or in the ownership of a landlord, council, housing association or freehold owner - not a legal owner / occupier. Your analogy above applies
only in those situations. In my situation, if the above were to happen to me, house owner as opposed to landlord / tenant, then a simple call to the police and, if necessary, my bank would be sufficient to prove criminal access (that, and my neighbours standing around asking who was in my house).
Russ D pointed out earlier the case of David Dale from Port Talbot. From his occupation (a landlord) I think we can see how Mr Dale ended up in the situation he ended up in. If there had been criminal activity engaged in to gain access, which in this case there was not, then I'm pretty sure the police would have acted appropriately.
You posted earlier about squatters websites advising potential squatters to break windows to gain access to properties. For the avoidance of doubt I feel it only fair and balanced that I point out that they refer, specifically, to empty / vacant houses (empty and vacant in the sense that they are standing unoccupied - not lived in).
This is not a legally constituted organization endorsing it's members to engage in the opportunist crime of burglary in the event that the current occupier has popped out to the shops or off to Bognor Regis for their annual holiday - that is breaking and entering. Any law abiding citizen would understand that, unless of course you're attempting to assert, contrary to the law and the police, that squatters exercising their legal right to squat in unoccupied / vacant properties are breaking the law.
You posted earlier that squatting was made "illegal" under the 1977 act - this is not correct. Squatting is, to this day, still legal.
Lord Hausham argued that conspiracy to commit tresspass (which, contrary to popular belief, is ulawful but not illegal) should be made illegal. He was defeated and the law commission instead introduced five new offences
1: Using or threatening violence to secure entry knowing there is someone present opposed to the entry (Section 6)
2: Being on premises as a trespasser and failing to leave after having been required to do so by a
displaced residential occupier or a protected intending occupier (Section 7)
3: Trespassing with a weapon of offence (Section 8)
4: Trespassing on embassy or consular property (Section 9)
5: Resisting or obstructing a bailiff or sheriff executing a possession order under Order 113 or 26 (Section 10).
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Paul, Your post is 100% spot on.