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Originally Posted by ScaredWebWarrior
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Originally Posted by Graham
What about all those British ex-Pats out in the Middle East etc who want to drink alcohol against Islamic law? Somehow the Muslim communities seem to have come to an accommodation with them, why can't we do the same with the Muslims here?
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Seems that maybe they're not as accomodating as we're expected to be. |
It seems pretty damn accommodating to me.
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Originally Posted by Graham
I do. It's called "Intelligence based Policing" ie using intelligence (in both senses of the word!) so you don't end up harassing innocent people based solely on what they look like or how they dress or where they pray.
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But where is the intelligence going to come from? It is quite clear that to some Muslims the fact that we're talking about Islamic terrorists means that they've got problems informing on them.
Can't see a lot of intelligence turning up from that quarter.
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I have answered this one several times already. We have to develop policies where the Muslim community would consider it to be worthwhile providing information instead of alienating them.
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Originally Posted by Graham
And once again I have little doubt that Osama Bin Laden and friends are sitting in their caves, watching satellite TV and laughing as we throw away the liberties that make our society *FREE* and which they hate so much.
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Someone said something about Snarks and how repetition proves nothing?
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There is a difference between simply saying something again and again and a reasonable extrapolation based on known facts.
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Originally Posted by Graham
I'm sure you would, but once again I point out, *YOU* are unlikely to be stopped or harassed, so again it seems a case of "I'm alright, Jack, it's ok to hassle people who aren't *me* so long as *I* feel safe".
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I don't believe support for this is driven by selfishness - simply if it doesn't directly affect someone, then they're hardly going to have a strong opinion against it.
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A Stop and Search policy directed against Muslims or Blacks or Irish people isn't going to directly affect me, yet *I* have a strong opinion against it because *I* can see that such things, if allowed to run unchecked will eventually affect *everyone*!
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Originally Posted by Graham
Let's say that a certain person who uses the alias timewarrior2001 was arrested for being a suspected terrorist. Then the Police discover that he messages on Cable Forum. Since he's swapped messages with all those people the Police decide to bring in all the members of Cable Forum for questioning "just to be on the safe side".
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Maybe not, but they'd certainly start looking at everyone he'd communicated with to see what had passed between them. And then if anything didn't look right, they might start looking at others more closely, even bring them in, just to be on the safe side.
This is suspicion by association, and I'd consider it rather incompetent if the police did not examine closely the activities of associates of suspected terrorists.
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I agree. But there is a difference between "examining activities" and bringing them in for questioning simply because of their association with someone which is the point I'm trying to make.
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Originally Posted by ScaredWebWarrior
If they put Islam before justice or the safety of their (host) nation, then they have alienated themselves from us already.
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So does that make them "fair game"?
Or does it mean that we should rethink our policies to try and get them back onto *our* side?
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Originally Posted by timewarrior2001
isnt this the point, people are using the fact thats its Islam to intimidate others into keeping quiet or we'll call you racist?
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I thought it was that people were using the fact that someone being Islamic is seemingly enough to suspect them of being a potential terrorist...