[Pierre]

Originally Posted by Mr K

Yes, you're wrong (again).

I don’t think I am.

---------- Post added at 20:49 ---------- Previous post was at 20:38 ----------

Originally Posted by Chris

No, it went south because of the minerals deal. V1 of that deal was properly insane, but earlier this week both Ukraine and the US believed they had come up with something workable. The sticking point was whether it would be explicitly backed by the US military as a backstop. Trump believed the mere presence of American JCBs in Ukraine would deter Russia. Zelenskyy did not believe this was sufficient. The refusal of the Ukrainians to consider a ceasefire is connected to that aspect of the minerals deal. Even if the presence of US business interests was a deterrent - and it might have been, to some extent - they would not have arrived in Ukraine for some time. In the absence of a credible US security guarantee, a ceasefire is just a breather in which Putin can re-arm. At the moment, Russia has capacity to produce and procure weapons but it is losing materiel faster than it can renew it. If the fighting stops, Russia will be able to generate the mass for another go. And without US security guarantees, they would absolutely go for it.

I know.

Zelenskyy said Ukraine wants the war to end but must have security assurances along with any sort of ceasefire agreement.

So for the minerals he wanted certain assurances, as you say.

"Just ceasefire will never work," Zelenskyy said, adding that "25 times" Putin "broke his own signature," or violated his word on agreements.

Been down this road before, and I believe this is when it all kicked off with Trump saying that was Obama, Biden, Clinton………..

Then he said

” But he never broke to me," Mr. Trump said

So it would seem Trump was expecting a level of trust, not that he deserves it, that through interactions with previous administrations Zelenskyy was unwilling to give.

So, dummies out, you’re on your own.

Neither side look good in my opinion.