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Old 04-09-2024, 17:34   #491
nomadking
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Re: [update] Grenfell Tower report published

By itself, it wasn't safe. They never claimed it should be used by itself. I'm taking about the info at the time, not stuff that got deleted/removed.

From 7 years ago In post #300.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadking View Post
Facts:- The manufacturers made claims that it could used above 18m. Suppliers reiterated that. It was even listed in the product selector part of the Royal Institute of British Architects (RIBA) website. The design of how the insulation was to be used was bad, regardless of what type was used. I looked at the plans. No fire barriers between the window frames and the insulation.

From the Celotex website.
Quote:
Suitable for use in warm steel frame constructions for ventilated facade applications, Celotex RS5000 can be used in buildings above 18 metres in height – a first for PIR insulation.
...
  • Has been tested to BS 8414-2:2005, meets the requirements in BR 135 and the first PIR insulation suitable for rainscreen cladding applications above 18 metres in height
  • Features Class O fire performance
On the face of it, no reason to suggest it was the wrong product to use.

It is only when you read in further in another document you get this.
Quote:
Specification clause
The rainscreen cladding insulation shall be Celotex
RS5000 ____mm thick, comprising a polyisocyanurate
(PIR) rigid foam insulation core featuring super low emissivity
textured aluminium foil facings on both sides and Class 0 fire
performance throughout the product in accordance with BS
476. RS5000 has been successfully tested to BS8414-2
and meets the performance criteria of BR135. RS5000
is A+ rated when compared to the BRE Green Guide and
is CFC/HCFC free with low GWP and zero ODP. RS5000
is manufactured in accordance with quality management
systems ISO 9001 and environmental management system
ISO 14001. All products must be installed in accordance
with instructions issued by Celotex
.
As for the suggestion of cost cutting being a factor, I also checked and compared prices. For one supplier as an example the FR5000 in the original plans would currently cost £755.32 for 23.04sq m but the RS5000 that was used(confirmed by the manufacturer) is £1282.65 for 23.04sq m. That is 70% more.
IIRC they even had example diagrams of panels where it was encased in non-flammable materials in order to prevent any spreading of fire.
Even a building of a mere 18m in height could've been destroyed by similar LEGAL materials.
IIRC the fire started below 18m, so more than one flat would've been affected whatever way you look at it. Other similar flammable insulation was LEGAL for use below 18m, and was originally in the plans.

Last edited by nomadking; 04-09-2024 at 17:37.
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