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Originally Posted by Stephen
Thank you. The exact same point I was making.
All medications have side effects and can be deadly. People can be allergic to asprin or paracetamol even and can die from it too.
As for your response Mick, I've been in and out if hospital that often over the past 5 years that I have gotten to know quite a bit about drug reactions, allergies and what can happen. From bring advised on things and from asking many questions. I've been through 6 operations in the past 13 months, on and off different medications. Had allergic reaction to different antibiotics and other drugs. So I'm no armchair know it all. I have dealt with many consultants and doctors and other medical staff over numerous hospitals.
Proving that one thing caused that reaction can be hard. You trying to claim that covid-19 vaccines or any vaccines for that matter are 100% to blame in all cases is just wrong. I also never made a blanket claim of any kind, that was on you interpreting it incorrectly. Such things must be investigated and proven.
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In some cases it's clear cut but in others it's more open to debate. This is why we have qualified doctors assessing bodies after people die to try and understand the cause of death. I would assume there's a high chance they're not always right.
Reading the last few posts in this thread I don't think any of you are wrong, or that the incorrectness of any statements can't really be proven.
Everyone is different. Everyone's body reacts differently to any medicines or indeed anything else (some people could die if they eat a nut). Some people won't react at all to the vaccines (including an immune response providing the actual designed effect). Others will potentially go into shock and die within minutes whilst being healthy before. Others may develop side effects over time, but in those cases, it may not be clear cut that the vaccine is the cause. Covid itself has been known to cause heart issues which is one thing often slung at the vaccines.
It's difficult to prove the effects were down to the vaccines but it's unknown what the effects of them over even 5 years are as we haven't used them that long yet. So it's also hard to say for sure how safe they are. This doesn't mean that vaccinating wasn't the right thing to do.
Just because something is against the established narrative at the time, where full facts have not been proven, it doesn't mean they are wrong. Early in the pandemic everyone was on about how it came from bats or pangolins and those who mentioned a lab leak were dismissed as nutters. Now the lab leak theory has much more traction even though it's not proven. And there were people early on saying we'd be in lockdowns for ages when they said only a few weeks and there would be things like people fined for not wearing masks (long before this happened) and not getting vaccinated (this happened too) and again these were dismissed at the time for being nuts. I think there's a fair chance the vaccines, whilst safe for most people, could cause long term health issues in others, not because of anything being rushed, but because that is simply the situation. It's not medically comparable to them giving thalidomide to all those pregnant women years ago, but there are some parallels, they didn't know the other form did that and couldn't presumably separate it out before it caused a lot of damage.