[ianch99]

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

.... by people who cannot say what Israel's response should have been.

I've told you, others have told you. New pair of reading glasses needed?

---------- Post added at 10:30 ---------- Previous post was at 10:17 ----------

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

You really disappoint me (in this topic), John.

There is nothing good about what is happening. But you mentioned the key words: 'American Politics'. There's Iranian politics, Russian politics, Israeli politics, Saudi politics, Qatari politics; all in the mix.

At the core of this lies Israel and its existence. Israel (government) has made serious mistakes in their treatment of Palestinians which, I agree, is designed to frustrate a 2-state solution. That design is entirely political due to the Likud-Ultra coalition. Getting them out, is down to the Israeli population and I'm not optimistic given the number of Ultras in the population.

In the light of what I've just written, we seem to converge. But we then diverge as to how Israel should have reacted to the Hamas butchery. And none of you can properly address my question:

Should Israel have done nothing in retaliation for the Hamas atrocities? That would have been the only way of avoiding the civilian casualties.

By accident or design, you have focused on the primary reason lying at the core of this conflict and that is the extreme demands of the Ultra-Zionist factions that have had hands on the levers of power over the decades. It is their religious zealotry that has perverted the agenda in the pursuit of the dream of their biblical Greater Israel. A land cleansed, to the best of their ability, of Arabs.

Einstein was offered the presidency of Israel in 1948 but refused it:

Why Did Einstein Refuse the Presidency of Israel?

His words were prescient:

David Ben-Gurion, the first Prime Minister of Israel, met with Einstein in Princeton, hoping to convince the venerable scientist to be the president of Israel. Einstein refused, and the quotes below might give us clues on why he refused.

In a Dec. 4, 1948, letter to The New York Times, Einstein, along with 28 other prominent members of the Jewish community, wrote that the then-current Israeli political party, the Freedom Party, led by Menachem Begin, was “a political party closely akin in its organization, methods, political philosophy and social appeal to the Nazi and Fascist parties.”

“It is inconceivable that those who oppose fascism throughout the world, if correctly informed as to Mr. Begin’s political record and perspectives, could add their names and support to the movement he represents,” the letter continued.

Referring to the massacre of Arabs by Jews in the village of Deir Yassin, the letter said “the [Jewish] terrorists, far from being ashamed of their act, were proud of this massacre, publicized it widely. … The Deir Yassin incident exemplifies the character and actions of the Freedom Party.”

Further describing the Freedom Party, the letter stated it includes “an admixture of ultranationalism, religious mysticism, and racial superiority” and that it bore the “unmistakable stamp of a Fascist party for whom terrorism (against Jews, Arabs, and British alike), and misrepresentation are means, and a ‘Leader State’ is the goal.”

The letter ended by saying that America should turn its back on Begin and not support “this latest manifestation of fascism.”

But there’s much more. Ten years prior to this letter, Einstein declared at New York's Commodore Hotel that a Jewish state with borders and an army to protect those borders ran counter to “the essential nature of Judaism.” Also, in 1946 he told the Anglo-American Committee of Inquiry on the Palestinian issue, “I cannot understand why it [a Jewish State] is needed. It is connected with narrow-minded and economic obstacles. I believe it is bad.”

In a 1938 speech, Einstein said, “I should much rather see reasonable agreement with the Arabs on the basis of living together in peace than the creation of a Jewish state.”

And in a quote dating back to the late 1920s Einstein declared, “Should we be unable to find a way to honest cooperation and honest pacts with the Arabs, then we have learned absolutely nothing during our two thousand years of suffering and deserve all that will come to us.”