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**Chris** · 05-09-2014, 19:17

The Nationalist case is that the Westminster system of government is irredeemably corrupt and incapable of governing Scotland effectively, and that only a sovereign Scottish government could adequately perform the role.

They haven't demonstrated that Westminster is as bad as they say it is. Most of their complaints are severely over-egged and are the result of party politics, not systemic failure.

On the other side of the equation, they have proposed a Scottish government that is immediately tied to Westminster anyway, via currency union, replacing a system in which Scots are directly represented in the legislature sitting in the Palace of Westminster, with a system in which they have no representation at all in the place where the currency, and therefore the entire economic system, will be controlled.

They have also bleated constantly about an incident earlier this year during which a Russian navy cruiser anchored in the Moray Firth, resulting in a RN destroyer coming up from the south coast to intercept and escort (and taking 24 hours to arrive, which apparently is a travesty), while simultaneously proposing defence arrangements for Scotland that would guarantee Scotland's complete inability to respond to a similar future incident in any effective way at all.

The "positive vision" for Scotland's future has amounted to left-wing spending commitments, accompanied by only the vaguest hints as to how any of it will be funded, and a basic ignorance of what you can promise to be the constitutional foundations of a nation and what is actually just party politics, entirely reversible from one administration to the next, as circumstances and ideology dictate.

Had the Yes campaign bigged up the differences in Scottish civic outlook, rather than slandering the rest of the UK (i.e. England) at every turn, I might have had confidence that the referendum would give birth to a truly energised, positive, forward looking nation.

Had the Yes campaign taken a realistic view of this island's needs for integrated defences, rather than trying to grab the Faslane peace camp vote by monstering Trident at every opportunity (while, simultaneously trying to craw right back under the nuclear umbrella Trident helps to create), then I might have believed the referendum would result in a confident nation with a realistic, pragmatic understanding of the dangerous world we live in and a willingness to do what's necessary to safeguard its citizens at home and abroad.

And, had the Yes campaign shown even the slightest hint of understanding of the political and economic difficulties of currency union, and engaged constructively with the issue, as opposed to threatening to walk away from the national debt of the UK and make Scotland a pariah in the money markets, then I might have thought the referendum was capable of birthing a nation with an understanding of the global economy into which it would be born, and the responsibilities that stretch beyond its borders.

But none of that has happened. Hence, a great big NO THANKS from me.

05-09-2014, 19:17	#1909
Chris Trollsplatter Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: North of Watford Services: Humane elimination of all common Internet pests Posts: 38,199	Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK? The Nationalist case is that the Westminster system of government is irredeemably corrupt and incapable of governing Scotland effectively, and that only a sovereign Scottish government could adequately perform the role. They haven't demonstrated that Westminster is as bad as they say it is. Most of their complaints are severely over-egged and are the result of party politics, not systemic failure. On the other side of the equation, they have proposed a Scottish government that is immediately tied to Westminster anyway, via currency union, replacing a system in which Scots are directly represented in the legislature sitting in the Palace of Westminster, with a system in which they have no representation at all in the place where the currency, and therefore the entire economic system, will be controlled. They have also bleated constantly about an incident earlier this year during which a Russian navy cruiser anchored in the Moray Firth, resulting in a RN destroyer coming up from the south coast to intercept and escort (and taking 24 hours to arrive, which apparently is a travesty), while simultaneously proposing defence arrangements for Scotland that would guarantee Scotland's complete inability to respond to a similar future incident in any effective way at all. The "positive vision" for Scotland's future has amounted to left-wing spending commitments, accompanied by only the vaguest hints as to how any of it will be funded, and a basic ignorance of what you can promise to be the constitutional foundations of a nation and what is actually just party politics, entirely reversible from one administration to the next, as circumstances and ideology dictate. Had the Yes campaign bigged up the differences in Scottish civic outlook, rather than slandering the rest of the UK (i.e. England) at every turn, I might have had confidence that the referendum would give birth to a truly energised, positive, forward looking nation. Had the Yes campaign taken a realistic view of this island's needs for integrated defences, rather than trying to grab the Faslane peace camp vote by monstering Trident at every opportunity (while, simultaneously trying to craw right back under the nuclear umbrella Trident helps to create), then I might have believed the referendum would result in a confident nation with a realistic, pragmatic understanding of the dangerous world we live in and a willingness to do what's necessary to safeguard its citizens at home and abroad. And, had the Yes campaign shown even the slightest hint of understanding of the political and economic difficulties of currency union, and engaged constructively with the issue, as opposed to threatening to walk away from the national debt of the UK and make Scotland a pariah in the money markets, then I might have thought the referendum was capable of birthing a nation with an understanding of the global economy into which it would be born, and the responsibilities that stretch beyond its borders. But none of that has happened. Hence, a great big NO THANKS from me.