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Sparkle · 25-01-2013, 21:48

What people don't seem to realise that it isn't just a few resistant strains, its everything thats been exposed to the antibiotics, which have steadfastly been developing resistance. There are thousands if not millions of types of bacteria that will become just as resistant as MRSA, its only a question of time.
What strikes me is how despite Darwinian education, people don't seem to understand the basic principles of life and evolution.

For those who don't know, its very simple. For every type of bacteria that exists, no two cells are exactly the same, there is a small variation between them all. If you introduce an antibiotic (ie. penicillin) that kills every single one of them, then success ! You've stopped the microbial evolution in its tracks - you could do this for a million years and the penicillin would still be as useful as it was when it was first discovered.

The problem is, people are ignorant of nature.

Big business was keen to capitalise on the money grabbing potential so they just mass produced this antibiotic and sold it to everyone and their uncle. No restrictions, just a free for all money grab - and we let them do it.

Now back to how this evolutionary process works, in the example above - bacterial evolution occurs whenever there are *any* bacterial survivors. At first they might be damaged, have incurred injury but have managed to survive the antibiotic by the skin of their teeth. Then they divide into millions once again, and when then encounter penicillin this next time most will be killed off as before - but only this time the bacteria are a *little* more resistant and again there are survivors. Through this process they are writing the code into their genes that helps ensure their survival against an aggressor, in this case an antibiotic.

If this process continues indefinitely then eventually *all* of these pathogens will be 100% resistant to any antibiotic - its pure mathematics and a lesson in inevitability, you can't win unless you deny the bacterial the conditions whereby it can use its most powerful weapon - evolution. Bacteria can effect an evolutionary step in 20 minutes, a human needs closer to 20 years ! We can't win those odds unless we combat bacterial evolution every step of the way.

The major problem is that most people don't have the intelligence or inclination to understand this process. The above is the reason why the doctor says "FINISH THE COURSE OF ANTIBIOTICS!" That thus increases the likelihood that there will be no trace or very little trace of the original strain before it can be passed on to someone else, where it begins life a little more resistant than its predecessor. But of course patients know better, they don't finish the course of antibiotics because they are "feeling better now". So they end up allowing the surviving bacteria to spread, in classic "I'm fine, screw everyone else." fashion.

Its gets worse too, its seems that once one type of bacteria develops a resistance to an antibiotic - it can and does pass that information onto other bacteria so that they become resistant too.
So whenever antibiotics are prescribed, not only do you have the near unstoppable evolutionary process that occurs by the target pathogen, but also the evolution of other bateria that simply get caught in the cross fire (antibiotics enter the entire body, not just the small area of infection), you also have the risk of various strains of completely different bacteria swapping notes on how to kill us.

In all fairness, of course we could never 100% mitigate the bacterial evolutionary process in a way that would prevent antibiotic resistance, but we could've slowed it down.
Instead of it taking 25 years for the original penicillin to become ineffective against some strains, we could've stretched that out to say 100 years - to give us more time to advance our medical knowdedge.
The only variants of penicillin that are all effective are the derivatives which have been developed, but we've reached the point of diminishing returns. Its as if bacteria have reached the stage where they are saying "Penicillin and a penicillin derivative, pah! Seen one we've seen 'em all !"

And now it seems that things are very 11th hour, antibiotics don't wipe out bugs any more - they are always survivors that in many cases just lie dormant and will eventually be spread - so evolution is on to us BIG time and total antibiotic resistance is now inevitable. So, imagine life without antibiotics. Think how we will manage, this is our world we've left for the next generation onwards. Just think how they will forever revere us for our carefree attitude to our health, to our planet, and well, towards everything in life really....NOT.

All in the name of big business, big business interested in short term capital gain but not concerned with the long term consequences.

25-01-2013, 21:48	#23
Sparkle cf.mega poster Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Open Prison, H.M.United Kingdom Posts: 1,037	Re: Antibiotic 'apocalypse' warning What people don't seem to realise that it isn't just a few resistant strains, its everything thats been exposed to the antibiotics, which have steadfastly been developing resistance. There are thousands if not millions of types of bacteria that will become just as resistant as MRSA, its only a question of time. What strikes me is how despite Darwinian education, people don't seem to understand the basic principles of life and evolution. For those who don't know, its very simple. For every type of bacteria that exists, no two cells are exactly the same, there is a small variation between them all. If you introduce an antibiotic (ie. penicillin) that kills every single one of them, then success ! You've stopped the microbial evolution in its tracks - you could do this for a million years and the penicillin would still be as useful as it was when it was first discovered. The problem is, people are ignorant of nature. Big business was keen to capitalise on the money grabbing potential so they just mass produced this antibiotic and sold it to everyone and their uncle. No restrictions, just a free for all money grab - and we let them do it. Now back to how this evolutionary process works, in the example above - bacterial evolution occurs whenever there are any bacterial survivors. At first they might be damaged, have incurred injury but have managed to survive the antibiotic by the skin of their teeth. Then they divide into millions once again, and when then encounter penicillin this next time most will be killed off as before - but only this time the bacteria are a little more resistant and again there are survivors. Through this process they are writing the code into their genes that helps ensure their survival against an aggressor, in this case an antibiotic. If this process continues indefinitely then eventually all of these pathogens will be 100% resistant to any antibiotic - its pure mathematics and a lesson in inevitability, you can't win unless you deny the bacterial the conditions whereby it can use its most powerful weapon - evolution. Bacteria can effect an evolutionary step in 20 minutes, a human needs closer to 20 years ! We can't win those odds unless we combat bacterial evolution every step of the way. The major problem is that most people don't have the intelligence or inclination to understand this process. The above is the reason why the doctor says "FINISH THE COURSE OF ANTIBIOTICS!" That thus increases the likelihood that there will be no trace or very little trace of the original strain before it can be passed on to someone else, where it begins life a little more resistant than its predecessor. But of course patients know better, they don't finish the course of antibiotics because they are "feeling better now". So they end up allowing the surviving bacteria to spread, in classic "I'm fine, screw everyone else." fashion. Its gets worse too, its seems that once one type of bacteria develops a resistance to an antibiotic - it can and does pass that information onto other bacteria so that they become resistant too. So whenever antibiotics are prescribed, not only do you have the near unstoppable evolutionary process that occurs by the target pathogen, but also the evolution of other bateria that simply get caught in the cross fire (antibiotics enter the entire body, not just the small area of infection), you also have the risk of various strains of completely different bacteria swapping notes on how to kill us. In all fairness, of course we could never 100% mitigate the bacterial evolutionary process in a way that would prevent antibiotic resistance, but we could've slowed it down. Instead of it taking 25 years for the original penicillin to become ineffective against some strains, we could've stretched that out to say 100 years - to give us more time to advance our medical knowdedge. The only variants of penicillin that are all effective are the derivatives which have been developed, but we've reached the point of diminishing returns. Its as if bacteria have reached the stage where they are saying "Penicillin and a penicillin derivative, pah! Seen one we've seen 'em all !" And now it seems that things are very 11th hour, antibiotics don't wipe out bugs any more - they are always survivors that in many cases just lie dormant and will eventually be spread - so evolution is on to us BIG time and total antibiotic resistance is now inevitable. So, imagine life without antibiotics. Think how we will manage, this is our world we've left for the next generation onwards. Just think how they will forever revere us for our carefree attitude to our health, to our planet, and well, towards everything in life really....NOT. All in the name of big business, big business interested in short term capital gain but not concerned with the long term consequences.