Down's syndrome recreated in mice
 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/4268226.stm

I can't see how this research could have been done without using animals...:scratch:

Re: Down's syndrome recreated in mice
 

True this research relied on animals. Now I'm not anti animal research, but realistically how ethical is it to inject material from one species into another. It strikes me that in the name of science things get more and more blurred every day. Dr Frankenstein springs to mind.

Re: Down's syndrome recreated in mice
 

I dare say the the ALF, and virtually all of the moderate left onwards really got their knickers in a twist.

I'm not in huge favour of endless medicine to prolong human life as far as possible (I think we are too preoccupied with cheating death as it is), but anything which gives babies the best possible chance at life & growing up really gets my vote. A bit :tu: :tu: from me.

Re: Down's syndrome recreated in mice
 

Once we leave out ALL the religious objections, animal rights people, and anyone else who objects to doctors/scientists improving the quality of life, ending suffering from ailments now, and in the future, then I for one am convinced every human being on this planet will benefit.
I speak as a parent who knows science, not faith, is responsible for keeping my special needs son alive!

Re: Down's syndrome recreated in mice
 

I agree that animals needed to be used in this case, but don't favour the 'this is one up on those animal rights people' attitude :(

Re: Down's syndrome recreated in mice
 

I wasn't.I was just merely observing that they don't have all the answers either.I've heard so many times that all experiments on animals are unnecessary which has led me to wonder if they even listen to the scientist's point of view that SOME animal experimentation cannot be done any other way except on human guinea pigs...Which would open a whole new can of worms.

Agreed not all animal experiments are necessary(I don't need an animal to be tested on to know I shouldn't get shampoo in my eyes)but some are, as proven here.

It would be nice to have a reasoned debate about it BUT I've never seen any such debate do anything but descend into flame wars because some people cannot stand back and debate it rationally and with the minimum of emotion. :erm:

Re: Down's syndrome recreated in mice
 

Good cool post Incognitas:tu:

Agreed, if we could somehow remove the "blinkers" we are wearing, and see what people are ill with, and seek new,improved ways to help them, even as you suggest, by allowing experiments on people, perhaps the very people who are ill, obviously seeking and getting full permission first, and only from the ill person concerned, not well meaning relatives.
For example, my sons condition, hydracephalus (water on the brain), was incurable, untill this:

For approximately, the last three years, Drs. Spitz and Nulsen have been successfully utilizing a valve designed by Mr. John Holter [a father of a hydrocephalus child in need of such a device]. Their results have not been published at this time, but certainly appear to be encouraging. . . Summary: 1. Fifty cases having ventriculo-venous shunts are reported. Follow-up periods ranged from two to eighteen months with 86 per-cent functioning well . . . 3. Sixty percent of the patients showed demonstrable physical or mental improvement following the shunt. In a paper delivered to the American Academy of Pediatrics meeting in New York City on October 9, 1956, Dr. E. B. Spitz reported on the first installations of the Silasticreg. tubes and valve designed by John Holter. During the 8 months following the first installation of this valve in February 1956, the same technique was employed in 68 cases. His procedure was successful in decompressing the brain in 57 cases, a feat he had previously achieved by other means in only 16 out of 122 cases. . . Holter valves are now being installed at a rate of more than 1200 a year. With about 4 million babies born per year in this country and an incidence of hydrocephalus in infants estimated at 1 in 500 per year among infants born in the United States.

Mr John Holter, mentioned as the father in this, had a son who had this illness, and by doing something that most readers of this board will consider barbaric, experimented on his own son, and in doing so, saved his sons life, and whos legacy now saves so many lives around the world.