Cable Forum

Cable Forum (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/index.php)
-   Current Affairs (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/forumdisplay.php?f=20)
-   -   Sign error on M42 motorway may mean speeding let-off (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/showthread.php?t=33692397)

Maggy 09-03-2013 10:36
Sign error on M42 motorway may mean speeding let-off
 
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21719322

Quote:
Thousands of motorway speeding convictions could be overturned because the font used to display the numbers on some variable speed limit signs may not have complied with traffic regulations.
The Crown Prosecution Service said the signs showed mph numbers taller and narrower than they should have been.
Quote:
Some lawyers and traffic consultants now want any penalties which were handed out over the course of the six years the signs were in place to be quashed, arguing they are not legally enforceable
This could be costly.:rolleyes:

martyh 09-03-2013 10:52
Re: Sign error on M42 motorway may mean speeding let-off
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maggy J (Post 35546185)
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21719322




This could be costly.:rolleyes:
Nah ,the signs have been granted authorisation and are back in use .As are the others on the M25


Why have the beeb reported on this now ? this was done a while back by the other news outlets when it may have been a problem but since then the signs have been given the go ahead in their existing form

mertle 09-03-2013 10:52
Re: Sign error on M42 motorway may mean speeding let-off
 
Compo will for sure but dont think its going be possible on those who may got banned. Another those who appeared in court told to take test again.

Another will those done those who decided over taking points went to those speeding things.

This could cost literally millions if not couple billion. We could be talking thousands of compensation in some cases.

Surely its just technecality or is these signs actually harder to see due to error.

martyh 09-03-2013 10:56
Re: Sign error on M42 motorway may mean speeding let-off
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mertle (Post 35546189)
Compo will for sure but dont think its going be possible on those who may got banned. Another those who appeared in court told to take test again.

Another will those done those who decided over taking points went to those speeding things.

This could cost literally millions if not couple billion. We could be talking thousands of compensation in some cases.

Surely its just technecality or is these signs actually harder to see due to error.
There won't be any compo or quashing of convictions as the sign font has not been changed .This is just lawyers trying to make a buck

mertle 09-03-2013 11:11
Re: Sign error on M42 motorway may mean speeding let-off
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by martyh (Post 35546191)
There won't be any compo or quashing of convictions as the sign font has not been changed .This is just lawyers trying to make a buck
thanks martyh your post was not there when typing takes me ages to right them through dislexia.:cry:

martyh 09-03-2013 11:20
Re: Sign error on M42 motorway may mean speeding let-off
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mertle (Post 35546196)
thanks martyh your post was not there when typing takes me ages to right them through dislexia.:cry:
The font used has been ok'd and authorisation given so all the cameras on the M42/M25 etc are back in use ,the reason i don't think there will any quashing of past convictions is because the font has not changed which means that the authorities think it is ok to use ,had they changed the font that would have been an admition they where wrong .I certainly couldn't see anything wrong with the signage it was perfectly clear

BenMcr 09-03-2013 11:29
Re: Sign error on M42 motorway may mean speeding let-off
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by martyh (Post 35546199)
The font used has been ok'd and authorisation given so all the cameras on the M42/M25 etc are back in use ,the reason i don't think there will any quashing of past convictions is because the font has not changed which means that the authorities think it is ok to use ,had they changed the font that would have been an admition they where wrong .I certainly couldn't see anything wrong with the signage it was perfectly clear
Although I do think this is a bit of lawyer hawking, this bit is the relevent section of the BBC article

Quote:
The regulations governing variable speed limit signs are set out in a government document called Traffic Signs Regulations and General Directions 2002.

If a sign fails to comply with the document's specification then it needs separate approval from the Department for Transport before it can be used as a means of enforcement.

That did not happen in this instance.
So the argument is that it's irrelevent whether they've been approved now with the same font, when the penalties were issued they weren't approved, so were technically unenforceable

---------- Post added at 11:29 ---------- Previous post was at 11:24 ----------

And as the Daily Mail reported back in December http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ing-signs.html

Quote:
It was decided to scrap all pending prosecutions, and also let off drivers caught after November 8 this year, when the issue came to light.

Only when the Secretary of State issued an ‘authorisation’ on November 27, which allowed a rule change to ensure the signs were legal, did prosecutions begin again.
They wouldn't have done that if it wasn't an issue

Dash: CF noob 09-03-2013 11:29
Re: Sign error on M42 motorway may mean speeding let-off
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenMcr (Post 35546203)

when the penalties were issued they weren't approved, so were technically unenforceable

Exactly

martyh 09-03-2013 11:58
Re: Sign error on M42 motorway may mean speeding let-off
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenMcr (Post 35546203)
Although I do think this is a bit of lawyer hawking, this bit is the relevent section of the BBC article

So the argument is that it's irrelevent whether they've been approved now with the same font, when the penalties were issued they weren't approved, so were technically unenforceable

---------- Post added at 11:29 ---------- Previous post was at 11:24 ----------

And as the Daily Mail reported back in December http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ing-signs.html



They wouldn't have done that if it wasn't an issue
The only issue was paperwork so i doubt very much there will be any back dated quashing of convictions or refunding fines/increased insurance premiums etc.At the end of the day those cameras on managed motorways are only active when a reduced speed is in force due an accident or congestion so anyone appealing for speeding in those conditions needs their car confiscating

mertle 09-03-2013 12:07
Re: Sign error on M42 motorway may mean speeding let-off
 
agree martyh think we got look it they still was breaking speed limit. Deserve penalty whether signs was an issue or not.

BenMcr 09-03-2013 12:12
Re: Sign error on M42 motorway may mean speeding let-off
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by martyh (Post 35546210)
The only issue was paperwork so i doubt very much there will be any back dated quashing of convictions or refunding fines/increased insurance premiums etc.
Wouldn't be so sure

http://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/nort...5578-22542593/

Quote:
THOUSANDS of motorists will have their speeding convictions quashed after it emerged an admin blunder meant police had no powers to prosecute them.
http://www.thisisdorset.co.uk/Dorset...#axzz2N2mxCNoZ

Quote:
Nearly £1.5 million has finally been repaid to motorists fined for speeding by a camera that operated illegally for a decade.
Quote:
When the camera was installed in 1997, a clerical error on the original paperwork meant a road used to mark out the 30mph zone it policed did not exist.

Sirius 09-03-2013 12:19
Re: Sign error on M42 motorway may mean speeding let-off
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by martyh (Post 35546188)
Nah ,the signs have been granted authorisation and are back in use .As are the others on the M25


Why have the beeb reported on this now ? this was done a while back by the other news outlets when it may have been a problem but since then the signs have been given the go ahead in their existing form
Is it a slow news day ?

Maggy 09-03-2013 13:53
Re: Sign error on M42 motorway may mean speeding let-off
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by martyh (Post 35546188)
Nah ,the signs have been granted authorisation and are back in use .As are the others on the M25


Why have the beeb reported on this now ? this was done a while back by the other news outlets when it may have been a problem but since then the signs have been given the go ahead in their existing form
Quote:
The BBC has spoken to one solicitor who is challenging a conviction for a client caught speeding on the M42 last April.
"Unfortunately the client received a six-month disqualification from driving," said Hojol Uddin.
"But then the cases that came in a week later, they all got off, they were completely in the clear - no further action was taken - so I think it's not equal," he said.
I suspect that's the reason why.:erm:

Pierre 09-03-2013 19:09
Re: Sign error on M42 motorway may mean speeding let-off
 
Well I received a NIP in November last year for doing 75 when the variable limit was 60. I sent it back but heard nothing since.


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 19:32.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
All Posts and Content are © Cable Forum