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-   -   Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797] (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/showthread.php?t=33628733)

warescouse 07-06-2008 01:42

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AlexanderHanff (Post 34569873)

In the above link and in others I have seen lately they are still touting "Phorm has agreements to begin trials with two other major ISP's (Carphone Warehouse and Virgin Media). The BBC among others also stated similar in their recent report.

The big question is: why are not Virgin Media 'clarifying' the issue with these reports if they are, as they have recently stated, still only evaluating the situation. Either these sites have got it badly wrong and you would expect VM to be quick to correct this as a 'good' ISP to their worried and concerned customers, or is somebody is telling pork pies?

mark777 07-06-2008 01:51

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by warescouse (Post 34569888)
In the above link and in others I have seen lately they are still touting "Phorm has agreements to begin trials with two other major ISP's (Carphone Warehouse and Virgin Media). The BBC among others also stated similar in their recent report.

The big question is: why are not Virgin Media 'clarifying' the issue with these reports if they are, as they have recently stated, still only evaluating the situation. Either these sites have got it badly wrong and you would expect VM to be quick to correct this as a 'good' ISP to their worried and concerned customers, or is somebody is telling pork pies?

I strongly suspect that VM have pulled a stunt. A 'tip off' to the Guardian by an inside source that they will shortly be dropping Phorm.

That's bought them several weeks from being under the cosh. They are just hoping to get to the end of the BT trials so they can see which way the wind is blowing.

Not a bad strategy, considering it's the one adopted by HMG.

warescouse 07-06-2008 02:02

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by mark777 (Post 34569899)
I strongly suspect that VM have pulled a stunt. A 'tip off' to the Guardian by an inside source that they will shortly be dropping Phorm.

That's bought them several weeks from being under the cosh. They are just hoping to get to the end of the BT trials so they can see which way the wind is blowing.

Not a bad strategy, considering it's the one adopted by HMG.

If this was the case, sadly for VM, I see delays for the trials as rewrite after rewrite must be taking place to get around the obstacles we see and hear daily such as 'cookie vulnerabilities' pointed out recently.

Lets face it. If BT / Phorm get this trial badly wrong with the world watching, I imagine heads will definitely roll and those heads will want to ensure the system is watertight from a hackers point of view. It has taken Microsoft years attempting to do this and they are still learning and falling as new vulnerabilities are found. Is is seven or eight windows critical updates this Tuesday ;)

Re "Not a bad strategy, considering it's the one adopted by HMG"

How does it go? "You can fool some of the people some of the time but not all of the people all of the time".

labougie 07-06-2008 02:13

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
GET REAL - profit is the ONLY thing that MATTERS!

OK, boring, I won't keep saying it, but it's appallingly germane to this particular case

warescouse 07-06-2008 02:20

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by labougie (Post 34569909)
GET REAL - profit is the ONLY thing that MATTERS!

OK, boring, I won't keep saying it, but it's appallingly germane to this particular case

I seen this as a reference tonight. I am sure the poster wouldn't mind me using it.
http://www.aclu.org/pizza/

mark777 07-06-2008 02:23

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by labougie (Post 34569909)
GET REAL - profit is the ONLY thing that MATTERS!

OK, boring, I won't keep saying it, but it's appallingly germane to this particular case

We heard you the first time. Most people posting to this thread are well aware that the way to defeat these grubby companies is by hitting their profits and our best way of doing that is by putting them on the wrong side of the law.

Any idea what else we should do?

Privacy_Matters 07-06-2008 02:55

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by warescouse (Post 34569912)
I seen this as a reference tonight. I am sure the poster wouldn't mind me using it.
http://www.aclu.org/pizza/

Great vid and says alot. I have mailed them to see if they will allow it to be cross referenced to other sites - as the message is the same with phorm etgc.

mark777 07-06-2008 03:20

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
A thought for BT shareholders and perhaps something we can expand on at the demo.

Before the dot.com bubble burst at the turn of the decade, BT were a massive global telecommunications company.

Now they are not, due to wrong management decisions.

They seem to be putting a lot of eggs in the dot.com Mark 2 basket at the moment. Perhaps we could expand on this?

OldBear 07-06-2008 03:24

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AlexanderHanff (Post 34569873)

I love this bit:

Quote:

Phorm spokesman David Sawday referred questions to BT
WTG, Phorm; only a scumbag company passes the buck back to one of its own partners. :p: :p:

OB

btw, :welcome: No. 42 :td:

hoggie 07-06-2008 03:32

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
just found this BBC report

http://newsvote.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/7438578.stm

this Q&A is a good read
http://newsvote.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/7283333.stm

labougie 07-06-2008 03:32

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
Quote:

Any idea what else we should do?
My point is that there is sod-all you can do. What is about to be done to you has already been planned and agreed by so-called democratic governments in agreement with private corporations and the shift has been from the original perspective - in which we, the punters, used to elect governments to be trusted to handle the larger affairs we couldn't be fagged with or didn't know enough about, to a situation in which the government (in happy partnership with 'Private Enterprise') regards us as cannon fodder, to be used and manipulated as it sees fit. C'est ca. How do you propose we go back? Even if we could conceivably get a win out of this one, it still won't stop the way things are headed.

I'm afraid that we, as the half-way intelligent and aware, have been comprehensively sidelined by the overwhelming might of Rupert Murdoch, his minions and his imitators, who have created a scenario whereby anyone who questions the idea of economic success (at any price) is automatically a subversive. Which of course all of you guys are. Not to mention...............

mark777 07-06-2008 04:06

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by OldBear (Post 34569931)
{snip}
WTG, Phorm; only a scumbag company passes the buck back to one of its own partners. :p: :p:
{snip}

It buys them a bit of time to have a group hug and come up with a bit of spin.

---------- Post added at 03:06 ---------- Previous post was at 02:34 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by labougie (Post 34569934)
My point is that there is sod-all you can do. What is about to be done to you has already been planned and agreed by so-called democratic governments in agreement with private corporations and the shift has been from the original perspective - in which we, the punters, used to elect governments to be trusted to handle the larger affairs we couldn't be fagged with or didn't know enough about, to a situation in which the government (in happy partnership with 'Private Enterprise') regards us as cannon fodder, to be used and manipulated as it sees fit. C'est ca. How do you propose we go back? Even if we could conceivably get a win out of this one, it still won't stop the way things are headed.

I think i'm probably broadly in agreement with you. We no longer elect the government we want, we get rid of governments we have had enough of. Roughly every 15 years or so. During the first 10 of those 15 years they get away with murder.

We probably can't change the situation. One generation at least has grown up with an 'edutainment' rather than an education and most of them seem to think they went to school with Buffy the Vampire Slayer.

I don't like the situation, but I do think this is one we can win. I think our MP's are largely a waste of space, but we may get something out of Europe. Maybe it will ultimately depend upon the Congress in the US. God help the 'Phormed' BT subscriber who visits a US web site if they decide it's illegal. A free night flight and an orange boiler-suit for them.

Sadly, the reason I think we can win it is because we can embarress a shaky government that is coming up to it's natural (15 year) lifespan and they are worried about what Europe and the US might do. Not forgetting a whole wodge of useless MP's who will start to worry about their seats.

But if the Yanks decide it's super we'll get it anyway.

Just my thoughts as someone who has never written to his MP or logged into a forum until I heard of Phorm. I always vote though.

labougie 07-06-2008 05:11

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
Quote:

Sadly, the reason I think we can win it is because we can embarress a shaky government that is coming up to it's natural (15 year) lifespan and they are worried about what Europe and the US might do. Not forgetting a whole wodge of useless MP's who will start to worry about their seats.
The big problem about disenfranchisement is that you begin to believe that ANY change will be for the better, as you seem to do. Unfortunately, the only alternative in our current case will be even worse. Our electoral system comes more and more to reflect the American, where not a gnat's cocklorum separates one from the other, and where a televisual presence will ultimately decide. Both alternatives are indivisibly wedded to big business and if business wants targetted advertising through whatever means are available, legal or not, then they will most certainly get it - personal privacy never stood a snowball's chance in hell. Especially if government gets access to all the information as well - a no-brainer. If you think that Cameron will be more careful of civil liberties that Brown, you should think again. We've all been shafted, and it happened with the Ronnie/Margaret/Greed is Good syndrome. That was when money became god and the devil take the hindmost. Hi, hindmost!

popper 07-06-2008 05:22

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
we could do with an ISP/Phorm and the Phormettes version of this information video if the artists amoung the readers here can make the time to do it and upload it to Youtube phorm section.

thanks to Nicholas Bohm for the link on the cypto list
http://www.aclu.org/pizza/

AlexanderHanff 07-06-2008 05:29

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
Labougie, you can continue to do that but apathy doesn't rule here and I won't be giving up. The only reason any of this crap has happened in the first place is because of the complete apathy of the general population, but I disagree with you completely in that I believe if that apathy can be dissolved then the people can definitely get those rights back.

When passion swells in the general populace because they have had enough and don't want to take this crap any more, then no government or corporation in the land will stop it.

You believe what you like, but frankly I find your comments an offence to people who do give a flying unmentionable and an illustration of part of the problem, not part of the solution. Attitudes like yours are exactly why we are in the situation we are in the first place in my opinion. Instead of being such a pessimist how about becoming pro-active and trying to do something and make a difference instead of just sitting there talking defeatist rubbish.

Seriously, why some people even bother to post if all they are intent on doing is trying to dampen morale, is beyond me.

Alexander Hanff


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