Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Not really too much of an issue for the government with its large majority but draws attention to the topic it can do without given the billions spent on track and trace.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknew...cid=spartanntp

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Just how much of his own money has Rashford committed to his cause?

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

He's doing a lot of work to raise money for causes including donating money to multiple charities and promoting them to help them raise more money.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/11878...generous-acts/

And of course he contributes via his tax bill which as far as I'm aware he pays everything he's legally liable for on his wages.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

l award you whataboutery post of the day Sir..

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Does it come with a MBE.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

He donated in April (no precise figure was given, except it was ‘sizeable"), then later on that month he doubled that donation.

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...-a9475846.html

https://www.90min.com/posts/marcus-r...t-01e76bv6q9wz

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

A problem arises between children whose families are really in poverty and need the meal, those whose families are "negligent" and need the meal, those who don't need the meal and those who don't need the meal but families say they do. (Possibly other groups too.)

When there is billions of fraud over Covid schemes and other help systems so the "giver" has to pay for monitoring and detection it really doesn't help.

If those getting help was really limited to those needing it and no fraud there would be enough to go round and support even more.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

My former next door neighbours were at the shop at 7 am every morning buying cigs and booze,also cannabis from a local dealer, never paid rent or bills, they had 5 kids who lived on cheap pizza's from aldi and nad no change of clothes,they created their own poverty and the children suffered for it.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Not sure what that's an argument for or against? :confused:

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

They shouldn't have scrapped the previous arrangements.:rolleyes:
I remember at Primary school we didn't have school dinners, free or otherwise. Somehow parents managed.
They already receive the money to feed them in benefits and tax credits etc.
Children skipping breakfast isn't just a UK thing, and isn't just a poverty thing.
Link

If it was about money, the figures between groups would be more uniform and consistent.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

How old are you? I'm 68 and I had school dinners at primary school. Also when my mother was widowed when I was 13 I got free school dinners.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

I went home for lunch every day,thankfuly it was a long walk home or i would have ended up as fat as a barrel,my mum didn't do small portions.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Younger than that. It was more a case of being small village primary schools, although I don't remember there being school meals at infant school in Hackney. It was only at secondary school stage that school dinners were provided, and that was probably just because we had to be bussed in, and it would take too long to bus us back home and then return to school.
I don't think the reasons for school dinners has ever been about helping the parents out financially.
At one secondary school we were just fed a roll in the Library. The school was in the process of being built, and they only had facilities for the initial year students(aged 12/13), and that was probably just to serve people at the associated theatre.

Does the parent get extra money for when they don't yet go to school or get suspended when they do?
Coming from a disorganised home is a far bigger factor than money.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

I have a couple of questions on your end statement. A far bigger factor in what? What's the definition of a disorganised home and what's the statistical evidence for it?

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

If only I had posted an example link? Oh, wait a minute, I did.
Children skipping breakfast is usually ALSO labelled as being a financial issue. That is the connection.
When did they scrap the previous system of providing free school meals during holiday time?

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Yes, and that’s the uncomfortable to truth for all good-doers.

Children are always used at pawns by the ‘wets’ of our society. What we need to do is to reinforce parental responsibility.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

And you do that by punishing the children?? They're the ones that are hungry.

And even if some parents do what you suggest, the majority don't and do everything they can for their children.

So you'd punish the majority for the actions of a minority?

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

The only way of protecting the children would be to remove them from the parents at birth.
The majority cope perfectly well, because they behave themselves.
All too often even with moderate spenders, when you look at examples of their finances, the parents are spending some of the money they get for the kids, on themselves.

Labour chucked a whole load of money into tax credits and that hasn't worked. Strange that they never introduced anything.

School meals were never about helping out financially. It was purely a practical matter of having to bus kids longer distances.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

And surely that's a problem of the way the system works and the government should fix that, not a reason not to do it at all?

Also the government have been in power for 10 years. Almost all the children this impacts have only lived under this government. I don't see what Labour did or didn't do before that impacts what we should do now during a worldwide pandemic.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Labour had 13 years and were more than happy to chuck around money, and having to borrow from 2002 onwards to fund it.
The Tax credits system DID give parents a lot more money. That was it's intention.:rolleyes: Giving them more money DIDN'T WORK (allegedly).
Those previously on benefits to one degree or another, will have had little impact on their income, so bogus argument about the pandemic. The arguments ARE NOT just about those affected. The whinging is about long-term ongoing spending, not just a temporary measure.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

The vote was for a temporary measure.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

It's an absolute disgrace for any child to be hungry in this country.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

The whinging has being going on for YEARS, it's not just something that has started "overnight".:rolleyes:

Link
Nothing to do with the pandemic. It's just being used as an excuse.
They get money SPECIFICALLY for the children, what they actually spend it on is another matter. They've had increases and it supposedly hasn't solved anything, so chucking more money at them, isn't going to work either.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

If the parents don't spend it on the children then it's right to feed the chldren directly. You shoudn't allow children to starve because of their parents' failings.

---------- Post added at 22:40 ---------- Previous post was at 22:38 ----------

:clap:

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Then the additional money given to the parents should be taken off them. They can't be expected to "have their cake and eat it".
Either the parents are responsible, or the kids should be taken off them at birth.
They are never going to learn to be responsible, if you keep chucking money at them when they AREN'T being responsible. You can't reward irresponsibility and then expect it to reduce.:rolleyes:

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

No one's talking about rewarding irresponsibility. We're just saying children shouldn't be punished for their parents' mistakes by starving. This is not a controversial opinion.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Would it be controversial to reduce the money given to dysfunctional parents and give it directly to the provider of the meals for the hungry/starving children.

Cut out the cretin in the middle

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Probably not, until it was revealed Serco were valuing a couple of tins of beans and some chips and a loaf (including postage and packing) at £5/day

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Much as I laud the principle,how would it work in practice? If some parents felt they would lose out financially by their chidren having free meals, then they could force their children to avoid the free meals.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Yes they are, by throwing more money at them, or by reducing their existing costs, so they have more money for themselves.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

How is it reducing their existing costs if they're not actually feeding their children properly anyway?

---------- Post added at 09:36 ---------- Previous post was at 09:28 ----------

I think the Conservatives have made the wrong call politically on this - 71% support Marcus Rashford. They're gifting their opponents seats at the next election.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...als-drive.html

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

The thing is we all know the government will do the right thing and do a U-turn - hopefully sooner rather than later.

All the usual suspects on here who think this government can do no wrong really should be hanging their heads in shame. Yes, there are bad parents out there but punishing their children seems so so wrong. I hope none of you ever find yourselves on your uppers or that it never happens to anyone you know or love. If it did, I'm sure you'd really enjoy someone on the internet telling you how bad a parent you are and your children going hungry is 100% your fault.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

1) are they not feeding their children 100% of the time?
2) Not 100% of those getting the help will be not feeding their children.
3) is there actually any genuine evidence that they are not feeding their children purely because of money. Or is it just evidence of chaotic parenting. There maybe examples involving drink and/or drugs, but the children should be removed from them. The extra money they get for the children is supporting their habit. You can't get addicted to drink, drugs, or nicotine without having the money to buy them in the first place.


Just another load of nonsense that seeks to just throws money at things, rather than address the true underlying problem(s).

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Nailed it. :clap:

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Didn't realise it all started in 2010 or 2019.:rolleyes: Benefits and Tax credits are much more generous than in the past. Yet Labour didn't introduce anything before 1997, and throwing money at the alleged problem definitely hasn't solved anything. Everything becomes "Oh, the school will deal with that, or the government will deal with that".

So many other examples out there of where people are never held responsible for their actions, so never act responsibly about them. There has to be a consequence to a bad action, or the bad actions will continue indefinitely.


Regardless of extra money, feeding the children or whatever. the children will be suffering in many other ways. So WHAT THEN?

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

But this government that you seem to defend in any way you can has decided the best way to deal with the issue is to not throw money at it OR to do anything to try and address the underlying problem(s). I look forward to you whataboutism reply with lots of links, bold text, capitals and rolling eyes, but it won't change that the government have got this one wrong and should be ashamed.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

:clap:

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

l could have not said it better myself.:tu:

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

I'm not trying to defend the government, just pointing out the nonsense of it all, and that if it's supposed to be such a good idea, why hasn't it been done decades ago. I would've been saying the same things more than 10 years ago. My opinions didn't magically change in 2010, unlike for many people.:rolleyes: Benefit levels already include money for feeding the kids. As I have to keep pointing out, Labour did trying chucking money at the alleged problem, and it hasn't worked.

If you gave these parents £1m a day, they still wouldn't take responsibility for anything. They would just hand over some money to the kids and tell them to get something themselves. Any neglect usually goes way beyond not feeding them, and has many forms.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

'Starve a kid for a quid' is the latest Govt. slogan.....

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

This should not be a party political matter and 71% agreeing with Marcus Rashford suggests it's not.
No one's suggesting giving anyone £1m a day. We're just talking about feeding starving British kids living in a rich country that can well afford to do so.
That shouldn't negate from preventative measures being undertaken but savage cuts in local authority spending under the guise of austerity have put paid to many of these. You may not think you're defending the government but your omission of this crucial information and an urge to blame Labour who've not been in power since 2010 suggest otherwise.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-48105787

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

They were never going to win this or come out looking anything but a set of “see You next tuesdays”. Very poor really, pick your battles.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Meanwhile back in the HOC, taxpayers are subsidising MPs meals and they're getting a £3k pay rise. Sorted.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Is this a cynical "dead cat" to distract the public from the Coronavirus handling and lack of success in the Brexit talks?

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

No. People can be equally angry at their handling of Coronavirus and this.

They had a chance to get some credit, only had to be a short term commitment.

I understand why reasons for not backing it, but they’re not strong enough. They could have won a brilliant PR coup by suspending the MP food allowance And putting that towards this.

I despair sometimes.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Given that Marcus Rashford was awarded an MBE, you would think that the government would have the issue on their agenda.

They could have built on the goodwill generated by awarding the MBE by continuing with free school meals through the Civid crisis at little cost and considered making it permanent.

Put in the context of the Triple Lock of £1.5bn a year which is providing increases in pensions of two per cent more than inflation it's a bargain.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Yes but pensioners have a vote, children don't.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Tbf the mbe was a joke.

As if gongs needed devaluing there was a classic example.

The awards are truly broken and many recipients and their fans would do well to disregard their significance.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

The meals will be subsidised because they are unable to seek out cheaper options. Several years ago I worked in the Westminster area, and we were given Luncheon Vouchers because the company didn't have a subsidised canteen. Nothing unusual about subsidised company canteens.:rolleyes: Often the workforce has no choice because of the locality of the company, eg industrial estate.
The pay rise is NOT one they are awarding themselves, it's part of a system/formula to calculate them.

It is a totally bogus argument to ask for for those receiving free school meals because of covid. Those with free school meals are mostly going to be parents completely on benefits, whose income will be unaffected.:rolleyes:
Here's an example of the bogus arguments.
School meals: 'I remember going to bed with hunger pains'
Now let's pick apart the nonsense.
Single-parent, left to "fend for themselves". parent not doing shopping. So was money the actual issue?
Overall Schools meals had NOTHING to do with it.:mad:
Would small village primary schools of the time(30 years ago) have had school meals. Those living in villages would've had to spend the money on meals, instead of getting free school meals. Those of us in that situation could manage, if the parent(s) were bothered. Why the discrimination?

---------- Post added at 21:47 ---------- Previous post was at 21:35 ----------

It's quotas. The list is filled with people who are there just to fill the quotas.
How are those figures possible, when there is meant to be so much discrimination, that certain groups aren't allowed to achieve anything?:confused:

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

These are unprecedented times and with people being supposedly furloughed but actually fired or only receiving partial income now is not the time to be nit-picking about feeding children during school holidays.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

That is just the Trojan Horse of an excuse. In no way are any of the proposals targeted at those with a loss of income?
Not only did those already on benefits have an unaltered income, they will have received a council tax reduction of up to £150, and yet they are included.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

I think I saw the white flag of surrender when you threw your strawman in there "certain groups aren't allowed to achieve anything". ;)

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Isn't that what the people who constantly shout out about discrimination, are claiming? Isn't their mantra, that certain groups are prevented from fulfilling their full potential? Yes or No?
Either there is no discrimination as those groups are allowed to reach their full potential, or there are quotas and discrimination is used to award them. Which is it?

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

You said that certain groups aren't allowed to achieve anything. Judging by Marcus Rashford's footballing success, this is not the case. If you genuinely feel this is not the case, then by all means open a new thread on the matter but I'm not going to assist further in conveniently taking this thread off topic. ;)

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

You missed out the preceding phrase of "when is meant to be...", and that implies outside opinion, not my opinion.
The question was asked in this thread as to why did he get an MBE? He didn't get it for football. Perhaps my response would've been better placed responding to Julian's post.
I have a relative that was awarded an MBE for charitable services for children. The difference is that they did it for many years and without publicity, and not for "5 seconds" with a shedload of publicity.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Things would be much easier if not for fraud. Because of the fraudsters the system ends up costing more and the rules get more and more complex so many who need help miss out.

Then there is the "dignity" thing. When there were proposals that some benefit could be paid in vouchers - e.g. you can buy food/kid's clothes etc with them but not booze - there was big outcry that the system didn't trust recipients.

So while it is good to ensure that kid's aren't going hungry and maybe there does need to be some central support it does need to be focussed. And what about the others in the household? Those too young for school? Are the parents or other household members also going hungry? Maybe communities need (and often are) to play a bigger role, they often know the situations better than any bureaucrat and can be more responsive too. If you know someone is going hungry and can help, then help, don't simply complain that something needs to be done.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Yeah those pesky fraudsters with their iPhone 14s and their 96" TVs, smoking 80 fags a day... Same old, same old.....

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Benefit fraud being a tiny fraction of the tax gap. :)

And a tiny fraction of a private sector failing test and trace apparatus apparently.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

:tu:

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Although Fraud exists, it's low in regards to the overall system:
https://assets.publishing.service.go...-estimates.pdf

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

How many school dinners would £3bn buy

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

That's a false argument.

Fixing the reasons behind benefit overpayments and underpayments is something that is not simple or quick.

A temporary extension to free school meals while there is global pandemic is something that gives children the food they need and allows for a proper consideration of the issues once England is in a better position to have that discussion.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

It wasn't meant as an argument just considering if the gov sorted out these overpayments then there might be a future pot to pay for school meals,i was thinking of the future not now.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Ok, sorry in that case. It just seems for some to be the argument for the reason not to do anything now and that's the falsehood.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-54841316

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Good.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Just a shame he felt he had to wait to the US election result to hide the U turn. Even more of a shame for the kids in the October half term.

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

They've got there chips and turkey twizzlers back so you should be happy or at least less grumpy;)

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Mr K's been in chipper form since at least 4.40pm yesterday. ;)

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

Yes the World does have a little bit of hope now :)

Re: Tory MP quits government over refusal to extend free school meals
 

This is good news, though I suspect it's been done as he can't afford to have any more enemies than he needs to after his handling of the pandemic & a poll I posted says that if Brexit results in no deal, most of the public would blame Johnson.