Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Christ. Do we have to read an advert for Phorm every time we complain about it?
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
In short they sent you the usual pointless, inaccurate, cut and paste waffle. If they can't do better than that there is little hope for them.:D |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
Two opposing sentences in the same paragraph with makes a total nonsense of their entire Privacy Claims. If a UID is Unique then it does identify the Surfer, especially if that cookie is not deleted till the intended expiration date! Combinations of advertising categories will be unique to this Surfer, even if not thing else is harvested, which I doubt. --------------- Webwise places a common cookie in web browsers - a small computer code with a unique, randomly generated number on it. Webwise doesn't capture or store any customer's personal details, only anonymous information about advertising categories that may be of interest to them. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
In light of that, I'm now officially leaving VM. Looking at Be, and it's looking good.
Do I need a MAC key while changing from cable to ADSL? |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
While on the subject of Webwise, I notice that the Phorm site is still talking about TalkTalk starting to use Webwise in the summer of 2008.
There is still nothing about Webwise on the TalkTalk site. Their Privacy Statement says little that could indicate a 3rd party like Webwise being used. Does anyone know where TalkTalk customers 'hang out'? I have not noticed anyone on any of the Phorm-aware forums mentioning that they use TalkTalk. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
The way PhilJ's reply from VM reads it's as if they're already using it.
I realise it looks like the standard cut and paste reply, but it seems a long way from the "we're only looking at it" responses a few of us got from them early on. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
The only advantage to having a MAC code is that you do not have to wait for the current ADSL to be removed from your line before you can ask for a new supplier. At worst, that means being without ADSL for a week (10 working days but usually supplied quicker.) |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Have just emailed VM back and told them
Dont believe them not convinced Ashamed of them getting into bed with this mob I expect the instructions in my letter to Data Controller to be carried out. Philj now where is Richard Branson's email address? |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
I tried to do mine back to back, and with hind sight I think allowing a small overlap would have been a smarter plan. If you want a drop in replacement for your cable modem, I can recommend the DrayTek Vigor 110 (...provided your router supports PPPoE). |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
I think my contract expires at the end of the month - I simply plan not to renew
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
I have done a lot of editing on Wikipedia over the past couple of years. The normal rule applies - be bold and put in your changes and see what happens. But always to remember to follow Wikipedia policies and you will soon get put in your place if you start stating strong points of view or claims not backed up by authoritative references. I suspect a simple paragraph stating they have recently been involved in Phorm/Webwise and a link to the Phorm article will be enough, anything more will probably get stamped on. I know, I have been through all that, you soon find your place there... |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
Quote:
I have selected this paragraph to talk about from your link phormwatch many thanks for the link. Highlights by me. I have placed in Bold my main gripe... It is not "we must not be rushed" I feel this should be "we will not be profiled at the expence of privacy, human rights and copyright infringement from websites we visit." In the real world retail we give them as much or as little informatioin as we want no retail shop sends anyone around the store following every customers jotting down notes of everything we look at, touch, or buy. Not always many of us still only give out as much or little as we wish. If it was surrenders anyone downloading copyrighted files would get a notices direct from the authorities not via their ISPs. BT, TalkTalk and Virgin Media have already caused the ripples we used to trust them now I certainly don't hence why I moved to a smaller ISP that answered my questions promptly with answers that gave me hope there are still some who are not out to rip of the customers. There will never be any trust from Internet users who have come into contact with Kents previous rootkit targeted advertisements, none of my data will ever be profiled by his company or anyother company like his. Interception will not enrich the internet, advertisments will not enrich the surfing for me I block them. Quote:
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Well then. I'll be contacting them as soon as possible.
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
They cant auto renew anything without your signature.
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
That's what I thought - surely if I haven't signed anything they can't claim that it's valid?
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Talk Talk forum here
http://www.talktalkmembers.com/forum...?t=740&page=18 |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
If you look on the left hand side it should say:- "The Webwise feature is not available at this time." The opt-in and opt-out are on separate pages OPT-IN = http://www.webwise.com/privacy/opt/in.html OPT-OUT = http://www.webwise.com/privacy/opt/out.html Bypassing the homepage and using either these links works for me (I'm not with one of the Phorm Three) The opt-out link deletes the UID cookie and creates the opt-out cookie "OPTED_OUT=YES". Quote:
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
more from the PR guys ---------- Post added at 22:34 ---------- Previous post was at 22:32 ---------- Quote:
I signed once for BB wich was fitted 20th July 2000 once 12 months are up they auto renew but monthly or mine was unless T&C have changed to extend it to 12 months again as some of BT's do. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
Not now Phorm have changed it to check referrer - unless someone finds a browser/ add-on flaw that allows them to spoof the browser's referrer - it used to be possible to spoof referrer using Flash, but that was fixed in recent versions. Having read R.Clayton's analysis, I've an idea or two about other potential issues, but we won't know unless or until Phorm goes live so I'm in no hurry to find out if I'm right. And given all the delays, they've had plently of time to review their code and fix any other oversights. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
Content: 7oKkf/UOR/+7bpcdPKXaMg|| I'm a BT customer. ---------- Post added at 23:27 ---------- Previous post was at 23:19 ---------- Quote:
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
Code:
Request #286 However, if I use Safari as a browser, I do get an a.webwise.net cookie for opted in but a .webwise.net cookie for opted out. And I am not on the phorming three either. Conclusion: Not all browsers are equal, even when you spoof them to be an accepted browser through the useragent. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
http://www.shirky.com/writings/semantic_syllogism.html http://www.shirky.com/writings/ontology_overrated.html Quote:
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
Most contracts have some clause which includes an 'auto renewal'. It protects users from being disconnected on the last day and having to pay for reconnection. Usually the renewal will be on a much shorter notice period, like one month. BT however works in 12/18 month contracts and charges for any unused portion if you ignore the need to give a minimum one months notice before the end of the contract if you don't want the auto renewal on original contract terms. If you read the small print on BT's special deals, there is a right mix of 1/12/18 month contracts for packages that 'renew' and look very similar. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
Quote:
I've previously noticed that error too - there's a div ID= uslocalselect on the web page, but no element called uklocalselect so the script below fails. Code:
var res = '<a href="/privacy/policy/index.html" onClick="return setLocale(\'us\');"><img src="/images/flag-us-' + usstat + '.gif" name="Image98" width="23" height="15" border="0" id="Image98" onMouseOver="MM_swapImage(\'Image98\',\'\',\'/images/flag-us-on.gif\',1)" onMouseOut="MM_swapImgRestore()"></a>'; |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
Code:
Forbidden |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
you can take that one stage further, what about keeping search engine URL's with the search data in them? peter ---------- Post added at 08:50 ---------- Previous post was at 08:40 ---------- Quote:
in my house / networks all of the following are banned search engine browser addins (spyware), social networking sites (virus and security risk),nice big hosts file to block majority of ads, and only me and the wife have unfiltered web access peter |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
you are taking things out of context like phorm and BT we all know we can't block ALL advertising , but we can serverly limit the amount we are exposed to as it is wasted screen space and bandwidth to most of us the google pay per click argument is irrelevant as google only serve adverts on the own and affiliate sites the same with their tracking only works in those sites. phorm spies on everything as it is imbedded in your (suposedly unmonitored) pipe to the net we agree that there needs to be investment in core internet infrastructure by the ISP as the current infrastructure was not designed to handle the vast array of sevices, content and sheer volume it has to cope with these days. but Talk Talk for instance offering a £299 laptop and reduced broadband line rental to try and get customers is not the way to generate the income required, the sums just do not add up, as we have said all along the likes of BE, Zen and co offer UK call centres, no gimicks, no discounts, no long term contracts and they make a reasonable profit and provide excellent quality of service so it can be done. the likes of BT, VM and TT etc all try to lock you into multiple services on long contracts and have to realise poeple are getting wise to these smokescreens and tricks as to privacy and how much you give up for a particular reason is a personal choice and should not be taken away from the individual by a company or government. phorm is removing ALL PERSONAL PRIVACY as you can't bypass it other than leaving your ISP and hoping the new one does not get bought out by a phormette ISP the ISP Partners of phorm need to completely change the model that phorm / BT Webwise is using, to give control of privacy back to the stakeholder / end user / client, but in doing this there will not be sufficient revenues for phorm to make a profit due to reduce data for them to sell (AAAWWWW SHAME) and no we are all realistic on here and realise phorm will not die, but hopefully go away and return with a more acceptable product that does not remove a person basic right to privacy if they wish to have any. peter ---------- Post added at 09:32 ---------- Previous post was at 09:24 ---------- Quote:
and my 9 an 15 year old daughters are banned from them , due to the above policy and the fact only my wife and i are admins on the PC's in the house all the computers in my house are clean and only have had viruseprotection alerts on my own PC due to some of the websites i visit to research things for work peter ---------- Post added at 09:41 ---------- Previous post was at 09:32 ---------- Quote:
my employers content monitoring systems monitor me at work or when i connect to services via the VPN to our offices. this is totally different to monitoring EVERYTHING AS PHORM / BT WEBWISE does. to that is a totally irrelevant argument also we have to agree to a monitoring policy as part of our employment contract, not have some change slipped into small print via a click on a website and the content is not routinely monitored this is relevant to the topic as it shows smoke and mirrors being deployed to try and confuse issues by pro-phorm community is not comparing like with like, to try and justify the spyware boxes ISP's and phorm are trying to foist on unsuspecting punters peter |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
I do seriously expect something like a rash of anti-google "research" results to appear and be published in the mainstream media. Even scare tactics like "google data leak" are not beyond the imagination. This will then be pointed to as some sort of twisted reasoning to make DPI wiretapping/interception look somehow better :( Do you remember the movie "Wag the Dog"? |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
The internet was around long before ISP`s were and the internet was not founded on advertising, its only greedy ISP(and it seems the government also)that wish to control the content of the internet, this is what it is all about. Is this where it is leading too. http://www.godlikeproductions.com/fo...sage559762/pg1 In this day and age where greed is abound, i will not rule anything in or out, with phorm`s kit inside the ISP the points above do not sound too far away, this and many other reasons, Phorm(and others)must be stopped |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
It's very simple. Just draw a diagram showing you, the isp, and the rest of the internet, including other websites, and also including the google search site and their webmail system, then insert the words "Google" or "Webwise" in the appropriate place on the diagram. Then see how much choice is left for the consumer. Webwise is between me and the rest of the internet. No bypass available. If my ISP adopt it, I go through the DPI kit on my way to the internet. No choice. opted in or opted out, it's between me and the internet. I have to go through that DPI kit and get intercepted, and probably profiled too (even if I can't be tracked - and quite frankly I don't trust them not to do that either) Google tracking only occurs when I use the google search engine (if I keep google cookies and a constant IP address). If I don't like gmail I don't have to correspond with anyone with a gmail address (except once to tell them so). But I CAN'T avoid Webwise/Phorm DPI. I can't get out of my "front door" without going through their kit. It's like they've built a porch over my front door. They own the porch. They decide what furniture is in the porch, They have hidden cameras and microphones in that porch. They strip search me as I go through it, and want to know who I am going to see, where I am going. And I don't like that. I wouldn't like it if they were honest. But they have phorm, previous, a record. So I like it even less. And it is just so they can make money, and probably also so the government can use the facility whenever they might feel like keeping an eye on me. I take that seriously. As a church pastor, I am a member of a people group that experience this sort of surveillance in various countries around the world ALREADY. I'd rather it didn't catch on here. It really is that simple. It's not the tracking, it's not the adverts, it's WHERE it's happening, it's HOW it's happening, it's the lack of genuine choice, and of course it's the multiple layers of illegality and the stealth that goes with criminal behaviour that we object to. As well as the corporate arrogance. Have we got that clear? Can we discuss the finer points of advertising and media elsewhere? Can we stick to the point? Thank you for listening. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Some news just in.
The Electronic Frontier Foundation (EFF), has released a tool known as 'Switzerland', currently an alpha version, for testing the neutrality of internet service providers (ISPs). The EFF says that Switzerland should be able to detect advertising injection systems like Phorm, anti-P2P tools from Sandvine and AudibleMagic and censorship systems like the Great Firewall of China, but is not limited to these detections as it can spot any packet modifications. here's the link to the full story |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
The Anti DPI for profit campaign encapsulated in a single post. Stripped of all the fluff and side tracks, this is the core of all our objections that our ISPs, advertisers, pro-phorm bloggers and many in government, just don't get. Christ, it's not THAT hard to understand...... is it? :banghead: |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
One of the great things about the internet is it is not Television, i can watch what i want and when i want, no advertisement, which is great. And yes i could live without TV/internet as i have done so before. Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
Any site that allows user input, whether search engine, networking site or forum is a security risk from malware and viruses. Any ad network can be infected by ads that download malware and viruses. Search engines have been used via redirects to the final destination or sending people to spoofed pages that looked like the original site. Banners have long been used to download malware and distributed via ad networks. Even 3rd party tracking scripts which have been used for years have become infected with malware. Any site visited should be considered a security risk. User input just increases the risk. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
And just to keep on topic I like the quote from the ACLU: "DPI allows ISPs to have access to all of your searches, friends and family, anything you read and email, any sites you visit and any comments you post. DPI is a virtual strip search for you and your computer." http://www.aclu.org/privacy/internet...s20080721.html |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
Quote:
If only BT would consider the opt-in model too. Maybe they are and that explains the delay. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
That is one of the best ways to describe DPI I wonder how Microsofts latest news of their future will fit in with DPI or more what more will it lay bare for DPI to strip off the bone.. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/7540282.stm IT technology is always changing yet looking at phorm it hasn't changed much it still sticks to root so still rootkit. still intercepts so not moved on much from early 2000. Also was illegal then and still illegal. How will it handle a total change of direction by Microsoft... |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
Firstly Phorm is illegal; there are no ifs or buts it is illegal under common/civil law and it is illegal under criminal law and no amount of pretty words is going to change that. As for your analogy above about a company reading emails that come in on their Exchange Server, you need to research this a little more because yes it is criminally illegal and yes there has been case law which found parties guilty and issued a criminal sentence as a result (See Demon Internet CEO case) and the decision -was- upheld on appeal AND the case was prosecuted as a violation of RIPA. You ask Peter where he was during the parliamentary debate on this issue, well surely if you had the all singing all dancing tracking world that you envision you would already know that. I was in the House of Lords discussing these issues with the Earl of Northesk and in communications with Baroness Miller whim both work in one of the Houses of Parliament. I suggest you make sure you get your Cheque and it clears from Phorm before typing more as their funds are dwindling and I hate for you not to be able to cover your mortgage should the cheque bounce. You seem to think this is a guaranteed scenario and that Phorm -will- win; I beg to differ. They have currently lost the battle in the US, lost the battle in Canada, lost the battle with the European Commission and really annoyed the South Koreans. They will lose the battle here in the UK too (in fact I would say they already have looking at their share price and the complete lack of confidence in their stock.) Alexander Hanff ---------- Post added at 13:51 ---------- Previous post was at 13:45 ---------- Quote:
Alexander Hanff ---------- Post added at 14:02 ---------- Previous post was at 13:51 ---------- Quote:
Alexander hanff |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
I've just started a Wikispace - primarily for quotations related to dpi, but also as a collaborative information tool.
It can be found here: http://nodpi.wikispaces.com/ I've sent out a few invites, but not many, since I don't have many email addresses. If you would like to become an editing member, send me a PM, and a reference from someone who is already a member. ---------- Post added at 14:07 ---------- Previous post was at 14:03 ---------- Quote:
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
Alexander Hanff |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Welcome back, Alex! Exams over? How did they go?
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
Alexander Hanff |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
:D El reg has hit the good one again
Campaigners celebrate Comcastration http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/08...cast_reaction/ Well we only need to follow either with our government leading or dragged behind with wrist slapped for failure.. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
Initially we had no way of connecting the box to the master socket and getting a slave terminal installed involved listed buildings permission...and so it dragged on for several months. They _were_ persistant, but I was patient and after 12 months they stopped asking :) After reading the PR man's postings I have come to the conclusion that Ad people talk a different language completely to the one I am familiar with. I believe it has to do with the focus of your intent. As a techie, my language is usually straightfoward and (hopefully) succinct which reflects my intentions. My observations of ad-people-speak is that their language is evasive, manipulative and wordy to the point of obfuscation, which I believe is a measure of _their_ intentions. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
forget BE here they keep telling me they can only offer 1.5mbit d/l I question that seeing I am on 8mbit which actually gives me 7.6mbit and has done for many years, they said it is the info they got from you know who.
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
I hope you all will help contribute to the nodpi wiki page. http://nodpi.wikispaces.com/
Please send in any quotes to my phormwatch address or edit the pages yourselves. You can add anything you want, not just quotes. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
@ Mr Hannff
PIA still MIA !!! Any news on this ? Any news on the case file handed into the police ? |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
Alexander Hanff |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
>So, hows about some clarification - are you going to accuse your Staff of >incompetently drafting an incorrect mail, or would you care to confirm you >have implemented Phorm? Nothing has been implemented on the network. I'll feed back the wording to the customer care team - it could have been better. <Name Removed> -- <Name Removed> Senior Product Manager Product Management, Virgin Media This is as good as it gets from VM |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
Take care they tell you to dispose of the modem in a eviromentle friendly way then threaten to charge you for it after so keep the modem if thye will not supply an address to sent it to like they didn't for me. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
I asked when I spoke to them and they said that they wouldn't be requiring the modem back. It'll join the pile of other VM and NTL modems lying around in the house.. I've got 3 or 4 from previous tenants.
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Do we have a definite number for the number of people affected or the number of page interceptions which occured during the 2007 covert trials? I need a counterfactual quote to:
"BT can confirm that we conducted a very small scale technical test of a prototype advertising platform on one exchange in June 2007. The test was specifically conducted to evaluate the functional and technical performance of the platform. Absolutely no personally identifiable information was processed, stored or disclosed during this trial. As with all Service Providers, it is important for BT to ensure that, before any potential new technologies are employed, they are robust and fit for purpose." - Adam Liversage, Chief Press Officer of BT ---------- Post added at 19:31 ---------- Previous post was at 19:28 ---------- http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/08...imping_letter/ http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post...le-ms-aol.html |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Where do I find your "Tube Leaflet" Phormwatch?
I have a trip to make next week and may be in the general vacinity :D Hank ---------- Post added at 20:30 ---------- Previous post was at 20:29 ---------- Alexander - You have a PM :) |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
http://www.inphormationdesk.org/Phor...Phormwatch.pdf http://www.inphormationdesk.org/Phor...Phormwatch.pdf |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
I think it's been up there since around March, not long after the 'deal' (in whatever form it was) was made between Phorm and the big 3. The page has changed a bit here and there over time though. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Ta,
did nt know about this lark till I read it on here. ba88888s Phil |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
The 2006 report also makes the same statement (believe it mentions 350,000 users). Earl of Northesk in the interview with Alex mentions he believes it was 160,000 based on information he has. It was not small scale by any measure, neither was the 2006 trial. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Thanks Pete, but I need a quote and a source.
I read the leaked document, but that only refers specifically to the 2006 trials, whereas the quote pertains to the 2007 trials. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
In April they were talking about a partnership with Phorm, and an imminent launch (VM's own website, not Phorm). So take what they are saying at the moment with a pinch of salt. They are waiting to see how BT's misery pans out. In the meantime, notes on moving from cable to a Phorm free ISP are here. ---------- Post added at 21:16 ---------- Previous post was at 21:15 ---------- Quote:
Would I leave you unquoted? :) Watch this post bwana... Quote 1) The Reg article mentioning the hundreds of thousands figure from the annual report. BT's 'illegal' 2007 Phorm trial profiled tens of thousands Quote 2) Phorm Annual Report April 24 "In Q4 of 2006, we conducted a live user trial of PageSense with a UK ISP, and we are about to start a larger trial of ProxySense with a test base of several hundred thousand users." Kent Ertugrul Chief Executive Officer 23 April 2007 Quote 3) Wikileaked BT report into the 2006 trial (site currently down?) "Phase 2 testing will also validate the features and performance of the 121Media Media Planning tool. The test will also run on a much larger userbased (approx 350,000) and statistically useful numbers will provide more information on the commercial model" (page 5/52) Quote 4) Wikileaked BT report into the 2006 trial (site currently down?) (same quote as above repeated) (page 42/52) Quote 5) Wikileaked BT report into the 2006 trial (site currently down?) "A second phase Pilot deployment will be undertaken with a larger userbase" (page 5/52) (ie, greater than 18,000 in the first trial) more coming... or there would be if I could find the EoN transcripts... he corrects Alistair at one point and says words to the effect, "my information is 160,000", I'll see if I can find it in the audio (unless someone can direct me to a transcript). |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
lol ;)
Perfect! Thanks Pete! |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Hello,
I have BT as my provider and i am not happy at all with this plan to implement Webwise/webstupid. I have written my MP, the people in the EU, BT and have voiced my opinions on the BT beta forum. Even though i live in England and have a GB passport i am American at heart as i lived in Santa Cruz, California for the great majority of my life so far. Santa Cruz is by far the most liberal of counties in the union apart from San Fransisco. Not that smoking marijuana has anything to do with Phorm but i helped canvass for prop 215 when it first came out so this will give you an idea of my political stance on ones right to privacy, hopefully. As it turns out i may have been part of this trial since my father had BT at the time of the trials but BT will not tell us who was and who was not in the trial. Knowing that i could have been spied upon does not make me a happy bunny at all and i am doing all i can to get the word out that BT is making plans to spy on people on a massive scale. I only have a few more months left with BT and even if they do not get this thing going i am going to leave since they did conduct secret trials on people. BT sucks and i hope they crash and burn along with their stocks. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Hey ximp! Welcome to the forum.
We share your anger. :) ---------- Post added at 21:35 ---------- Previous post was at 21:27 ---------- Pete- Yo! Stop! It's cool, man. The quotes about what they were going to do can't be used, since they've since stated that the trial was in fact much smaller than originally intended. I have used the Register quote. That'll do fine. Thanks! |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
I see that the Beta.BT forum is down yet again, maybe it has got a touch of PHORMITIS.
Colin |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2008/08/25.pnghttps://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2008/08/26.png |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
Quote:
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
Black for printing 2-up landscape 2-sided on A4 paper and then guillotining into two A5 flyers (probably the most useful format): http://www.inphormationdesk.org/Phorm_Flyer_A5.pdf Black for printing 2-sided on A5 paper: http://www.inphormationdesk.org/Phorm_Flyer_A5.pdf Original navy A4 with optional House of Commons and BT addresses on the back: http://www.inphormationdesk.org/Phorm_Flyer.pdf Special edition for MPs, navy A4 : http://www.inphormationdesk.org/Phorm_Flyer_MP.pdf Feel free to use - also please let me have any corrections and suggestions, and let me know if any other points of contact should be listed. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
EoN: The first part of the question again? I've forgotten. AH: Given the possibility of the quantity of the people involved in the trials? EoN: Yes yes the gravity of it. Erm, it is extreemely serious in my view, erm, and I despair that, that erm, the authorities are AH: Passing the buck? EoN: Well, its not only passing the buck, erm, they're being dismissive of it, erm sure its a bit like a hot potato so the Home Office passes it to the ICO, the ICO passes it to SOCA and round and round the mulberry bush we go. So in that sense there is a degree of passing the buck but I think there's a more serious issue. It is that the presumption that appears to exist that, erm, despite affecting according to press reports 130,000. I've heard as many as 160,000. Not all of them will be as disgruntled as each other, but never the less a fair proportion of them will and this is potentially a criminal offence. Erm, erm, and for the authorities (whomever it may be) to treat it so dismissively, is the dismissiveness I find so objectionable. Edit; Madslug beat me to it! :) (thanks!) |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
"Chief Executive Officer's Report The Company has built on its existing PageSense platform to create a new server-based architecture called ProxySense. In Q4 of 2006, we conducted a live user trial of PageSense with a UK ISP, and we are about to start a larger trial of ProxySense with a test base of several hundred thousand users" http://www.phorm.com/reports/Annual_Report_2006.pdf |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
Quote:
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
Colin |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Bwahaha. Maybe they thought the forum was getting out of control, so they took it down.
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
On a related note. The PSInet server, seemingly hosted in a block assigned to One Voice Technologies, is still alive and kicking out BT Webwise pages;
https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2008/08/52.gif Obviously, no one told it that BT Webwise was supposed to be hosted in the UK. Actually, supposed to be hosted inside BT rather than Gyron Internet, if truth be told. Put the IP and hostname into your hosts file to confirm. Beware, any interaction with webwise.bt.com is not handled by BT, and if you make the above changes to your host file, the site you visit will be served from the USA (outside UK/EU data protection laws). Clear any BT.com cookies beforehand. Whois OrgName: Performance Systems International Inc. OrgID: PSI Address: 1015 31st St NW City: Washington StateProv: DC PostalCode: 20007 Country: US |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
gnilddif |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
maybe the kitchen got to hot for BT to handle :) after all the truth is coming out the onger it goes on the more we seem to find out..
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
There certainly was an increasingly significant quantity of intensely anti-BT sentiment expressed on many threads in several topic areas within the forums, and maybe they thought that this was the only way to get rid of it, rather than censor it piece by piece. Whatever the reason - a desperate effort at censorship or a massive hardware/software failure - it doesn't look good for BT, who claim that Phorm/Webwise is fit for purpose in their hands. If they can't keep the hardware/software that runs the forums running smoothly, then how can they be trusted to maintain scrupulously and securely the Phorm-provided servers and software? gnilddif |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
The servers are giving me different times on their clocks, so my guess is that the actual site is hosted on the 2nd server, and in UK as per IP address. www.phorm.com and webwise.bt.com are giving me clock times which suggest they are on the same server. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
They have spoken of replacing the Beta forums with the same software used on the Business platform forums - but like the Webwise trials - no clear idea when. No customer announcements about the failed forums - as usual. There is this, although I can't see how that would affect the bt.com end of things, and anyway it's well after 4.00am Planned Outages: We will be carrying out planned works on the BT Yahoo! Broadband platform from 02:00 to 04:00 on Tuesday 5th August. This is to perform essential network maintenance. During this time, customers may be unable to access the Buy to Click for up to 2 hours. We apologise for any inconvenience this may cause. Anyway - why bother telling customers? What do they matter? As long as they keep paying their direct debits, what else matters? BT stopped talking to or listening to their customers a long time ago. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
If the time reported by two sites is consistently a few seconds or more out you can safely assume they are separate servers. (Unless it's due to some funky proxying) If the time reported by two sites is generally the same to within a second, it may or may not be the same server. It could be two servers both synchronised to the same ntp network or time scale. *I know this is a big assumption. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
9.48am Tuesday BT forum still out from here
Philj going to drop a copy of the flyer off at my Doc's surgery this morning for him to look at |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
[QUOTE=philj;34615020]9.48am Tuesday BT forum still out from here
BT Forums appear to be back up & I didn't have to wade through treacle to get there? |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
BT are locking threads again on the forums, may be time to have a trawl through and see if they have been sanitising things and removing posts that are to near to the truth
copyright thread has been locked peter |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
That's hilarious!
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
It beggars belief that they are so paranoid that they can't allow us to discuss copyright law. |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
bet i get no reply peter |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
|
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
Quote:
peter |
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
I suggest that when this is over, and Phorm is a stinking pile of burning heap in the ground, we all show up at the ICO's office to demand his resignation.
|
All times are GMT +1. The time now is 20:24. |
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.