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-   -   U.S Election 2016 (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/showthread.php?t=33702280)

Mr K 13-01-2017 18:17
Re: US Election 2016
 
You realise you're going to have to keep making excuses for the Donald for the next 4 years Mick? That's if he, and we, last that long ...
If you manage that you'll have my utter respect ;)

Damien 13-01-2017 18:31
Re: US Election 2016
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mick (Post 35880507)
Barack Obama is considered a crap President, that's why Trump essentially won, because they (Americans) did not want another four years of Obama, and this was highly likely with Hillary Clinton.
Obama is leaving with one of the highest approval ratings of a President leaving office. http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epo...oval-1044.html

By contrast here is Trumps:
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epo...able-5493.html

You can't really judge how a President will be viewed by history as soon as they leave. Bush declined a lot since, Reagan improved etc. However at the moment Obama isn't widely considered a crap President.

TheDaddy 13-01-2017 18:44
Re: US Election 2016
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mick (Post 35880507)
No rule or law says he has to put them in a blind trust and if I had a Billion Dollar empire, I would not just skip my kids and neither would a lot of other people.
You would if you'd given your word, well I would at any rate but then again I'm probably to honest to be a politician

Quote:
Also, you missed the bit where a Business Ethics Committee person is to be appointed on to the Trump Staff team who will ensure no Conflict of Interest occurs.
That's okay then, if he's on the team he or she defiantly won't be a friend or crony

Quote:
:wavey: I am Still here.
:wavey:

Mick 13-01-2017 19:04
Re: US Election 2016
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35880516)
Obama is leaving with one of the highest approval ratings of a President leaving office. http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epo...oval-1044.html

By contrast here is Trumps:
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epo...able-5493.html

You can't really judge how a President will be viewed by history as soon as they leave. Bush declined a lot since, Reagan improved etc. However at the moment Obama isn't widely considered a crap President.
LOL are you being serious ? I and many others judge on Policies not approval ratings.

So yes I can judge and he is crap, many of my US friends think he IS crap and cannot wait to see the back of him.

So who do you blame for ISIS ? Who do you blame for the very large debt he has amassed ? Who do you blame for the rise in mass homelessness especially among young people ? Who do you blame for the absolute rise in costs to Obamacare ?

For all those, I blame Obama. Thus, I judge him as a crap President.

Damien 13-01-2017 20:49
Re: US Election 2016
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mick (Post 35880524)
LOL are you being serious ? I and many others judge on Policies not approval ratings.

So yes I can judge and he is crap, many of my US friends think he IS crap and cannot wait to see the back of him.

So who do you blame for ISIS ? Who do you blame for the very large debt he has amassed ? Who do you blame for the rise in mass homelessness especially among young people ? Who do you blame for the absolute rise in costs to Obamacare ?

For all those, I blame Obama. Thus, I judge him as a crap President.
I am not saying you're wrong for thinking he is a crap President, I obviously disagree but I can understand others think differently. I am saying that in general he is not regarded as a crap President.

As for your questions I think his biggest mistake was his handling of Syria. However the economy he inherited was terrible, months after the collapse of the banking system. The first effects of that were reported under his watch, a few months into he Presidency but the global collapse of the banking system is not the fault of the guy who arrived a few months after. The deficit has decreased since 2009 but it's higher than 2008.

I think it's very unfair to blame the massive deficit reported in 2009 on Obama. Also the debt. The debt naturally increases so long as you have a deficit. You therefore judge politicians performance on that metric by the deficit not the debt. It's as stupid as the people who say debt was increased under the Tories, of course it has, that's the nature of a deficit.

Maggy 13-01-2017 23:08
Re: US Election 2016
 
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-38581768

Quote:
Economists and economics reporters do like their charts and graphs.
And if they were all forced to pick just one with which to tell the story of the Obama presidency, many would plump for the bar chart of "non-farm payrolls".
The non-farm payrolls report is simply the official measure of how many jobs the US economy has added (or lost) in the previous month.
The release of this job tally, which happens at the same time, on the same day (the first Friday) of every single month, is one of the constants in the working life of a Wall Street economist or reporter.
Many feel they measure out their lives with non-farm payroll reports.
800,000 per month
But you can reasonably measure out the Obama presidency with them as well.

Hugh 13-01-2017 23:21
Re: US Election 2016
 
BBC News. That’s another beauty,

Totally made up facts by sleazebag political operatives - FAKE NEWS! Russia says nothing exists. Probably...

SAD!

adzii_nufc 14-01-2017 00:24
Re: US Election 2016
 
I could imagine it's easy to keep a high approval rating if you just blame your opposite when you botch something, case in point, the time the Obama administration decided to keep the plutonium it'd previously agreed to rid itself of when dismantling nukes alongside Russia. Of course as said, they backtracked, decided on a 'cheaper' route that was actually keeping the plutonium and knowing fine well it could again be used for WMD's. Then when Russia called foul and stopped their half of the deal completely, Western Media conveniently spun it as Russia starting a second cold war :rolleyes: leading to ''Oh those Pesky Russians!'' When the entire breakdown was manufactured from the bloody US. You know, the land of the free, except when we drug them with LSD and let the CIA take over the papers. Project MK Ultra and Operation Mockingbird for those unaware of the past doings of the agency that apparently serves the best interests. The completely 100% trustworthy country it is. Instead of labeling both the US and Russia as the lying sods they both are. It's like watching two brothers bickering when they're both as bad as each other.

That's not to say he's the worst president ever or even getting into the current topic in the thread, just saying Obama has things in his favour that actually should've went against him. Then there's obviously plenty of people in Pakistan that would love a word with him rather than Donald Trump. They don't count though. Be interesting what opinion they'll hold on Trump in 4 years then. Anyone heard of plans to stop droning?

With regards to the middle east though he was merely continuing something that someone far worse started. Mr Bush take the stage.

RizzyKing 14-01-2017 01:09
Re: US Election 2016
 
Not a single one of my american friends including a few democrats feel obama has been either a good or effective president nearly all of them say he has made america more vulnerable not just because of his handling of foreign policy but his military cutbacks and base closures. I think like many older systems the approval rating system is way off the mark and no longer a true reflection of opinion.

Mick 14-01-2017 01:39
Re: US Election 2016
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RizzyKing (Post 35880557)
Not a single one of my american friends including a few democrats feel obama has been either a good or effective president nearly all of them say he has made america more vulnerable not just because of his handling of foreign policy but his military cutbacks and base closures. I think like many older systems the approval rating system is way off the mark and no longer a true reflection of opinion.
:clap:

Well, this is just it, most of my US friends voted ALL Democrat most of their lives and in 2008, 2012 and because of Obama's dreadful legacy and let's face it, his terrible Obamacare, it has been dreadful, in 2016 they have voted Republican this time round, because they did not want Crooked Hillary.

adzii_nufc 14-01-2017 01:47
Re: US Election 2016
 
I don't quite understand the Obamacare thing that much, I think I may have heard a misconception many years ago that it'd be like the NHS? Is that naff? What was it and what became of it?

Mick 14-01-2017 02:01
Re: US Election 2016
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by adzii_nufc (Post 35880560)
I don't quite understand the Obamacare thing that much, I think I may have heard a misconception many years ago that it'd be like the NHS? Is that naff? What was it and what became of it?
It's not quite the NHS and this where people over here get confused thinking it works the same way, it doesn't.

I explained it some time ago, will fetch that post and explain what it is in a brief summary.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mick (Post 35865926)
Free, universal healthcare does not exist in America.

Obamacare or (PPACA) Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act, most certainly is not free. It's not like the NHS is here, where you go to see a doctor, or go to hospital, get treated and don't pay anything.

In America, you need health insurance because if you get ill and what not and receive treatment, you have to pay for it, but health insurance normally covers this.

In a Nutshell, the Affordable Care Act in America, does the following:-
  • Offering Americans a number of new benefits, rights, and protections in regards to their healthcare
  • Setting up a Health Insurance Marketplace (HealthCare.Gov) where Americans can purchase federally regulated and subsidized Health Insurance during open enrollment.
  • Expanding Medicaid to all adults in many states.
  • Improving Medicare for seniors and those with long-term disabilities.
  • Expanding employer coverage to millions of employees.
  • Requiring most people to have coverage each month from 2014 in order to get an exemption, or pay a fee.
  • And introducing new taxes and tax breaks, among other provisions.

Source: http://obamacarefacts.com/whatis-obamacare/

Those on the poverty line, still have to pay it but they get help to do so via a range of benefits. If people don't pay it, a fee is still taken by the IRS (US Equivalent to UK's HMRC) So call it a kind of Tax if you want.

So when Trump talks about ending Obamacare, he is talking about repealing the act, because the Affordable care Act (but not really), has caused massive hikes in fees and costs for it. People have seen, year on year rise on it and the rises are huge this year, we would see large scale riots if they introduced something like that over here. You talking of four figure type sums and these are monthly upfront costs, you are talking thousands of dollars per month.

Damien 14-01-2017 07:20
Re: US Election 2016
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RizzyKing (Post 35880557)
Not a single one of my american friends including a few democrats feel obama has been either a good or effective president nearly all of them say he has made america more vulnerable not just because of his handling of foreign policy but his military cutbacks and base closures. I think like many older systems the approval rating system is way off the mark and no longer a true reflection of opinion.
It's more representative than what a collection of friends tells you.

martyh 14-01-2017 09:15
Re: US Election 2016
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RizzyKing (Post 35880557)
Not a single one of my american friends including a few democrats feel obama has been either a good or effective president nearly all of them say he has made america more vulnerable not just because of his handling of foreign policy but his military cutbacks and base closures. I think like many older systems the approval rating system is way off the mark and no longer a true reflection of opinion.
Or it could be that like most people you have friends that are like minded to yourself

---------- Post added at 09:15 ---------- Previous post was at 09:08 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by adzii_nufc (Post 35880560)
I don't quite understand the Obamacare thing that much, I think I may have heard a misconception many years ago that it'd be like the NHS? Is that naff? What was it and what became of it?
It's meant to expand healthcare to more people ,it hasn't worked as expected because of Democrat vs Republican politics .The Republican controlled congress has just voted to begin repealing Obamacare but haven't actually got a replacement yet and 22 million people will be left without health care

Pierre 14-01-2017 09:31
Re: US Election 2016
 
The "Red Line". In Syria is where he devalued America's international influence.


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