Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I don't know what to think about Phorm. I didn't object to WGA and haven't suffered any ill-effects so far from allowing it onto the system. I think that's my own practical yardstick. I'm not particularly worried by Internet privacy providing nothing affects everyday life, which it hasn't so far. This has been the attitude for around eight years now, so perhaps that's a reasonable trial.

Did anyone read the interview in The Register linked to in an earlier post? A reasonable case is put for not worrying about Phorm. It even seems to present some reasons why it might be good to accept it. I'm undecided.

Edit: Sorry, see link in post 2184.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

The "it doesn't affect me" argument has an easy response:

"In Germany, they came first for the Communists, And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Communist;
And then they came for the trade unionists, And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a trade unionist;
And then they came for the Jews, And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Jew;
And then . . . they came for me . . .
And by that time there was no one left to speak up."

Or for those who like Bill Hicks (who I'm sure would have some lovely words about this sort of scheme, after all he did tell anyone who worked in marketing or advertising that they were Satan's little helpers, the ruiner of all things good and should kill themselves)

"Go back to bed America, your goverment is in control. Here, here's American Gladiators. Watch this, shut up, go back to bed America, here is American Gladiators, here is 56 channels of it! Watch these pituitary retards bang their [ahem] skulls together and congratulate you on the living in the land of freedom. Here you go America - you are free to do what well tell you! You are free to do what we tell you!"

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

No disrespect intended Mart44, but this is exactly what they want you to think.

- from amateria's post (#2213);

"I agree with previous posters that routine inspection of communications is the thin end of a wedge that makes even more malign forms of surveillance easier - both technically, because the systems are sitting there in the ISPs, and because there is a risk that people become desensitised to the violation of their privacy. It seems to me that here are no "safeguards" against this, other than to uphold our right to privacy as a matter of principle."

(my bold emphasis added)

The abolition of individual privacy will only succeed if it's done incrementally, and that is precisely what's happening here.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Um - because WGA (an utterly different thing altogether) was OK, then a system that intercepts all your internet browsing with incredible potential for abuse should be fine? That's a bit like saying, I've been eating apples for some time now so I think smoking will do me no harm.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I think that's a little emotive. I thought the issue was targeted advertising rather than World domination in a physical sense. I'm not sure a parallel can be drawn with that.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Hi everyone
Hope you are all looking forward to the weekend - looks like a bit of rain.

Re: MI Info, we have to say we are a little confused here when it comes to your endorsement. If you take a look at the site and their terms and privacy policy you will see that Mi-Info collects and stores your personal data.

Not to mention the fact the release is misleading, suggesting (wrongly) that Phorm sells or passes on customer data.

Our ISP partners have not sold and will never sell your data. No data leaves the ISP network and no PII data is stored by Phorm's technology. We do not tie into the ISP's authentication server or any other information the ISP holds on their subscribers.

For the record, once again, we do not store personal data or any information on which sites a user has visited. Nor do we store any personally identifiable information such as IP addresses etc (unlike Mi-Info) and we do not pass on any information (unlike Mi-Info).

Unlike Mi-Info, Webwise users are anonymous to the system – the technology observes anonymous behaviours and draws a conclusion about the advertising category that's most relevant. All the data leading to that conclusion is then deleted by the time each page is loaded.

Webwise is far more secure simply because it does not store any data and therefore it cannot be lost. As always for more information, especially on the new levels of privacy and security that Webwise sets, go to http://www.webwise.com or http://www.phorm.com

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Like Phorm, many thought it wasn't (or isn't).

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

As always, I can't, because I've blocked all connections to your domains (or the ones you're prepared to tell us about, at any rate.) Have a nice day. :dozey:

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Indeed - that was exactly my point.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

So by extension anything else people think may be bad will also not be bad?

Kind of a crying wolf logic.... there's probably a name for this logical fallacy, perhaps some philosophers on this board can name it. Interesting, though, to think that a lot of people out there might also draw this conclusion.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Kind of makes us sound like lab rats in a maze. But then I'm sure that's how Phorm sees us. Either that or cattle.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

"I thought the issue was targeted advertising rather than World domination in a physical sense."

Matt44, the issue for me is of interception of private correspondence, which is in violation of human rights to privacy and in breach of statutory protections of privacy in electronic communications.

Targeted advertising and whether there is consent to it is not a trivial issue (it entails consequences such as the potential theft of finite, paid-for bandwidth and CPU cycles as well as the risk of the inclusion of inappropriate content), but it is a side-issue in comparison with these fundamental human rights.

---------- Post added at 17:28 ---------- Previous post was at 17:27 ----------

Sorry, Mart44

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Thanks, I won't have anything to do with that either. Is there anything else thats dodgy, out there, that you would like to warn us about? Your contacts could be very useful in this regard.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

This issue isn't really targeted advertising per se. You can get that just by visiting a site with ads related to the site content. The crucial issue is opening the floodgates for ISPs (who should be neutral when it comes to carrying our data) to peruse all of our browsing habits and data for commercial purposes. Once we're happy to allow that, we may as well forget any rights to privacy, online and offline.

And before PhormPRBots say that no humans will look at the data, it's being intercepted and it's open to the potential of abuse, whatever they may say.

Besides, it's plain illegal, as well as rude, arrogant and intrusive.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Intercepting God's weather signals now as well?