Ntl Ts
 

I work in a call center and just had a call from a fustrated user who has just spent nearly 1.5hours on the phone to TS as she couldnt get her work laptop to connect over her cable modem.


the problem took me approx 2 mins to resolve...she told me that NTL had said that her work laptop wouldnt work on there modem because she couldnt get into the "system" icon in properties all i did was get her to stop using the proxy server.

Can some one explain to me how in 1.5 hours they decided that the modem wouldnt install, she wouldnt be able to use the laptiop, and that she wasnt connected to the web, when a simple ipconfig showed that she was.

Is this the level of service i can expect from NTL TS? as of yet i have never plucked up the currage to call them my self, as i hate nothing more than talking to idiots who think they know more than me on the phone.....and i know what its like working on a helpdesk when the customer thinks that they know more than you ;)

If it wasnt for the fact that i just got phone and TV on ntl i would go for DSL straight away, as the poor service in more than one area is really starting to surprise me.

Re: Ntl Ts
 

I would say that in my experience, no, it isn't the level of tech support you'd expect all the time. Having said that, the frontline help is abysmal. They seem to have a set of fixes to try then that's it, and they appear to have no personal knowledge whatsoever.

When you get to the proper tech support guys, then you can drop on a bad one, but there are good tech's as well. And that's the problem. NTL seem to have no coherent level of service. It seems it's down to the individual that you are put through to. If they are knowledgeable and willing to help, well it's all smiles, but if not then you're in trouble.

Re: Ntl Ts
 

sounds like where we work Stuart lol

Re: Ntl Ts
 

:LOL: That reminds me of my little run in with Luton TS...

http://forum.nthellworld.co.uk/showthread.php?t=7453

Re: Ntl Ts
 

I should know really shouldnt i....the reason they are called call centres is because all they are there for is logging calls.#


nice one with the UPS lol looks like im going to get a second tel line and get 2mb dsl a drop the cable down to a 128 service as a failover. cant be arsed with this any more.

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

Someone hit on the point that these guys are call front line support. This is fine but there doesn't appear any structured 2nd line support.

By that, I'm getting used to the fact that no matter which company I call with a technical issue these days, I have to be taken through the same script that the little old lady down the street gets too. That's fine, it's a waste of my time and theirs, but it's fine because they don't know what my level of knowledge is.

But most companies, when you have exhausted the list in script one, pass you through to someone who has expert knowledge and can operate independently of what's printed on the screen for him to read.

Now ntl do have these people, but getting through to them is a blinking nightmare. The script is written in such a way (either that or the people on the front line adlib) so that it must be your computer that's at fault, or the UPS as mentioned earlier, or a martain aircraft on your roof....anything except their problem.

I do try to avoid calling BB TS if I can, becuase I have no intention of having a heart attack from the stress they cause me based on the times when I have called in the past.

The last three times I had to call:

1. Network was not connecting to anything, but all lights were. 85 minute call queue. Response, no network problem, was my firewall. I disabled the firewall, they said it wasn't good enough becuase even if the firewall was switched off, then it was still active. Was told there was nothing they could do unless I uninstalled my firewall.

Actual problem....there was a problem at the Luton UBR.

2. Overall reporting that browsing was always sluggish in evenings. Was advised to call local faults department as there was nothing they could do in Swansea, the problem was an oversub'd UBR. Called Luton faults, they said I should not have called them, and before I could say another word, was put back in the 55min call queue to Swansea. Gave up.

3. Another attempt at reporting overall sluggishness. Was asked if I had installled any software lately. Said that this was an overall problem, not a single incident. Was asked if I had installed any software lately (!) said no, only the latest Windows updates. Ahh, said the TS. That's the problem. Could I uninstall it...but it's a major security update I said. Oh only temporarily he said....but if this is the problem, then it will be sluggish again, what will you do then I asked...er, came the reply, don't know yet.

Said I wasn't going to uninstall it, could I speak to someone else. They will tell you the same I have, he said. I don't care, I said, let me speak to them too please. Spoke to someone else, checked the settings, made a few changes, told me about the proxies, worked fine.

They do need to look at the script, but also some of the people working down there (I haven't called for about six months, maybe it's a bit better these days I don't know).

I do wonder what the criteria is for someone working in TS:

Q1. Have you ever used a computer?
A1. Yes.

Congratulations! When can you start?

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

I can assure you all that ntl Technical Support staff do not read from a script. All answers come from the agent's personal knowledge, which should be backed up by use of the Intranet. Unfortunately, some agents have a tendency to embellesh, and although all new agents are told in training not to say anything unless they're sure it's correct, there are plenty who go ahead and do it anyway. Oh, and 85 minutes queues are getting thankfully rare again.

It's just as frustrating for those of us who work there and do know what we're talking about, because we then have to bend over backwards to apologise to the customer who rings back to say he/she's just spent £40 at PC World to get his or her PC checked, only to be told it's not a PC issue. Having said that, it's not unusual for PC World to say that even when there is a PC issue...

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

Thanks Jimbo....I was quite careful to point out that not everyone who works there suffers from this problem, but it does appear from the outside there ntl has more than its fair share of people not able to do the job.

I do know there are people there who are very very capable, like the guy I ended up talking to regarding the proxies.

I know 85 mins is rare, the reason, I expect, that it was 85 mins was simply becuase there was a major problem.

I'm not having a go at you here, I guess you know that already, but the line you said about all answers coming from the TS' own personal knowledge did make me smile.

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

Yes, I agree. There is a training issue. :D :pp

Re: Ntl Ts
 

correct me if I am wrong but if your frustrated user could not get into the system icon either then perhaps ther are other issues with pc or user cannot follow simple commands.

you must be able to appreciate that technical support is a process of elimination and if an ntl TS guy/gal thought there was a particular problem with someone's PC and could not verify if that was in fact the cause or not, due to either system problems or user incompetence then what exactly are they to do especially after an hour and half going round in circles?

as i said correct me if i am wrong as obviuosly you know more about what happened on the call than I do

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

there are no scripts that you speak of at ntl tech support (i have friends who work there and no one works from scripts)

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

@ threadbare: There are no scripts. Ill confirm that.

Everything is done from memory or experience.

@ everyone in the thread: And to generalise that all the techs here are useless is quite insulting.

I work to fix every problem I get, and fix i'd say around 98% of them first time.

The other 2% are PC problems that cant be fixed (even tho the cust will always disagree "theres nothing wrong with my PC, PC world have looked at it!" or issues where the customer has limited knowledge of the PC or not at the computer and we are unable to carry out a fix.

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

Agreed.

Re: Ntl Ts
 

this is because the system is locked down so that the user cant get in there.... they have enough access to do what they need and if the NTL TS rep had done a simple ipconfig they would have seen that the laptop was connected to the net.

i am also a Tech services person (not ntl :D) i am shocked at the level of knowledge that people i work with i have let alone something as big as NTL, but people who fob of users with excuses like "its that last piece of software" "its your system" "itbecause your companys laptop isnt compatable wiwth our product" really should not be wasting peoples time on a help desk. if you dont know the solution say so. it make customers much more happy if you admit it and then go and find out and get back to them. ive been working in support since 1997 in enviroments from 10-10,000 users and nothing peeves me off more than people trying to fob people off because they cant be arsed to ask or find out.

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

I would never say that...would be saying that i am useless... :P im just saying that when you phone tech services you expect some small amount of tech and not to be fobbed off

and yes if i had the access at work i too would be able to resolve 95%+ of all issues i deal with.....but with my current crappy job with the comapny from hell i get to do about 25% fcf as i have the access rites of a dead hamster.

Re: Ntl Ts
 

there is always going to be a small proportion who fob ppl off - these are most likely the ones with limited knowledge.

you have to be carefull with work laptops though as u dont want to cock up the setting they use for work. however I do not know what went on during the call. you seem to be in the best position to understand what the agent did or didn't do. From what you have said thus far - his/her knowledge was obviously limited. I would hope they are in the minority

Re: Ntl Ts
 

me too, me too

Re: Ntl Ts
 

In most companies they are in the mnority...it just always seems to be me they answer the phone to...LOL

Re: Ntl Ts
 

Perhaps they should change the phone prompts ?

" to speak to a tech support rep that knows what he is doing press 1 "
" to be told a load of steaming BS press 2 "
" to be put on hold for 27 minutes press 3 "

Re: Ntl Ts
 

"press 4 to have a huge hand come out of phone and repeatedly bang your head against wall press 5 or press to too have same effect from callmonkey " :P

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

or the ntl easter egg! press *#7 to be connected to Sky Sales, have all you incorrect bills refunded and a free BT line with ADSl instaled

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

*phones ntl and repeadtedly hammers the 7 key*

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

Sorry about the bad experiences. Just to put things into some perspective, the first time fix rate of the TSB overall is very high.

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

A claim like that always seems "iffy" to me. How do you know that it is very high?

Does the TS guy record whether it's a first time fix? If they do then don't you think that it is human nature to bull up your results? Can you see any TS guy putting down that he / she hasn't been able to supply a first time fix to any support requests? I can just picture a line of TS guys swapping their "unable to fix any problem" lists for their P45s.

If TS support guys don't work to a script then a lot of them must have a few "suggested" avenues for dealing with problems drummed into them during their induction and use these even when any customer with a slight smattering of knowledge knows that they don't have any bearing with their problem.

There are TS people with a very good knowledge of the subject but it's like playing Russian Roulette when you try to get through to them.

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

Good question. It is monitored based on stats. It is not a perfect system but it gives a ball park first time fix which is very high.

Re: Ntl Ts
 

Idiots? Thats a very strong, sweeping statement to make my friend. It must take a lot of 'currage' to say something like that....

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

Hi David. :wavey:

Out of interest, how are these FTF stats created? Who actually says they have fixed 95% (as an example) of their calls as a FTF?

I only ask as I remember having a similar meeting with Peter Savage (then MD of Southern Region), & him trying to convince me that 98% of installs went according to plan, :eek: when I challenged this, & asked who gave him these stats, he told me that it came direct from the installers. :rolleyes:

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

The answer to that is very dull statistical analysis, and to be honest, not something I'm sure I should be going into on this forum.

However I will tell you that the reporting method is rough at best and totally out of the control of the agents. That said, as a general indicator it is afaik reliable.

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

It is also a requirement of progression in the TSB to hit a certain FTF percentage based on this analysis.

Re: Ntl Ts
 

if you feel in any way intimedated by that comment you must be feeling guilty..... i am not saying that any one at NTL is an idiot just that i hate talking to idiots....

If you have a problem PM me.

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

Blame training as usual, nothing to do with the structure of first line support, disemination of information etc, no, must be training !

Well mattry I'm here to tell you once and for all that in this case you may be right ! ntl: dumped a lot of trainers three years ago including most of those in Swansea. Likewise the Buisness Internet Tech support trainer was not replaced when he left. Newport have a training team but not many of them come from a training background and I can tell you that the ability to use PowerPoint does NOT make you a trainer !

Having said that, if you are a high flying computer users with years of support would you work in a callcentre for £13K ??????? So the experience level of some of these guys is low and three weeks training is not enough.

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

and what is wrong with the data coming from installers? :rolleyes:

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

That would make it even more of an incentive for TSB staff to mis-report calls that they have handled if they were not very good at their job.

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

Thing is, it's not the original agent who reports whether it was fixed first time or not - it's based on whether the same customer calls back with the same/a similar problem within a certain time. That's a bit of a simplification, but it's the basic premise. This makes the statistic relatively reliable (though not 100%).

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

FTF is not reported by agents.

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

If the agent handling the call doesn't report it then who does? To me it is a simple matter of a customer calling up with a problem and speaings to an agent about that problem. The agent then tries to sort the problem out and either succeeds or fails. As this agent is the only person who knows what the call was about, what solutions were offered and whether they solved the problem, he /she is the only person who can report on the matter. Who else can decide if it was a FTF? Is a poor agent likely to say that he / she has failed to solve any problems?

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

ianathuth - It is a statistical analysis. it is not based on agent reporting. All the agent has to do is log the call (the content of the log is not looked at when judging FTF), which is compulsory for every single call.

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

Every call is logged by the phone system, which knows how many calls each agent has answered. Agents are required to leave a note (known as an ISE) in the system for every call answered, although some lee-way is given for calls which have been routed to TSB incorrectly (and thus the customer has no Internet account in the system), where the line goes dead before the customer's details can be taken, etc. An agent who does not leave notes will soon be found out. It is assumed all calls are fixed first time, unless the customer then calls back within a certain period with the same problem. In this case, the 2nd agent should add his/her notes to the existing ISE, which will mean the call is known not to have been fixed first time.

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

:confused: You must be joking! How the hell can a company give statistics of the number of calls that resulted in a first time fix if they do not look at the details of the call or the solution? Only the agent taking the call can possibly know whether his / her solution has solved the problem. What magical thing happens to enable NTL to deduce that the solution offered is a first time fix? I would love to know how this all works. :confused:

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

I'm sorry you think I'm joking. I don't want to divulge exact details as I'm unsure of the precise reporting process and don't want to give inaccurate information.

The FTF is based on call driver statistics not fix notes.

Re: Ntl Ts
 

perosnally i cant see why that would make tech feel guilty?
and would agree with Tech when he/she says its quite a sweeping statement u make there......

also agree with yourself when u say that your not calling anyone at ntl an idiot.......
although in the context of the post....thats what seems to be implied.....

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

A very big assumption with no scientific or logical basis. I have called on several occasions about problems, sometimes twice in the same day regarding the same problem and have found that the first agent has put no notes on the system about the first call, being talked through the same process by the second agent as the first despite me telling him that we had already tried that earlier in the day.

How many customers in the past have tried to call TSB and got fed up with the queue and looked elsewhere for a solution (this site or dotcom in its day to name a couple), particularly when their first call didn't solve the problem. Using what Jimbo said, this would be regarded as a FTF even though it wasn't.

How would calls be classed that were insoluble by TSB? By that I mean calls such as "I have a problem with my email" made during the very lengthy period that email has been a problem. The TSB guy replies that they know that there is a problem with email that will be fixed at some unknown time in the future so the caller doesn't bother to call back. According to what Jimbo said that would have been classed as a FTF as the caller didn't call back although we all know that it wasn't fixed.

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

well of course that is a fix! the caller is made aware of problems which will be resolved by ntl's engineers. there is no need for them to call back as the problem is being dealt with. the agent has 'fixed' the problem by informing the customer that the engineers are dealing. no the tech hasnt gone out to fix the mail servers themselves at this is not at all feasable. job done

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

Nothing, unless you believe that 98% of installs go according to plan. :rolleyes: ;)

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

It's no one's fault but ntl's that they don't pay a decent wage.

Re: Ntl Tech Support
 

Things have changed since I was there then - one guy on my team regularly left nothing in the way of notes on calls he didn't feel comfortable with, such as ones when he was getting close to his break and OOOOOPS - he accidentally hung up on them etc....

He only lasted 8 months but left on an unrelated matter - good to see NTL have taken steps to ensure this won't happen, as you say.

Re: Ntl Ts
 

*shrugs* think what you want :)