Restructure anyone?
 

I have spoken to three ex-collegues who work for ntl this week, all apart from one were on the lookout for a job.

Apparently there is yet another restructure in their department, and some of the senior managers were having interviews after applying for their own jobs today. Apparently they will find out before the end of the week who doesn't have a job when the music stops.

I was very surprised to find that one of the Telewest senior guys seems to be taking control, its a good thing in Engineering/networks as he is very experienced. I had the fortune of working with him very closely many years ago in the cable industry (I used to sit next to him) before CableTel, United Artists etc existed. He is a professional guy and a real engineer. He should be able to sort out the wheat from the chaf when it comes to some of the engineers, unlike many before him. I was pleased to hear he already has some cards marked for some who he has dealt with in the past at Telewest and have survived at the expense of many good engineers in ntl.

Lets hope he makes some improvements.

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

Yes i had read up on this guy,(if it is the same one) and thought the same, it's about time someone in a senior position really knows about the Engineering/network side of life. Up till now all or most of these positions have been taken by ex bankers financiers ect, there only goal has been the restructures and the eventual merger of Telewest and NTL. I believe that this has been the focus for the past few years, concequently the real knowledge and and drive to run the company, I.E to make it work has not really happened.

Most of the management is again going through the mill of having to reapply or wait to see what restructures that are happening will affect them. So basically everthing is up in the air again.

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

Well hardly suprising after a merger isn't it?

Yep we are now down to HoDs level of division. Then after they've been appointed (should be by the end of this week) there will be a long hard look at the way the field forces are structured.

You can expect the 90days announcement around June I'd say.

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I was told yesterday that my old boss a HOD based in South Wales (running a national group) has been successful in keeping his job after an interview early last week. If the successful candidate had been chosen by the usual ntl method he would of probably been out of a job. Certainly the decision to keep him and not the other candidate is a positive step for the company, and possibly because the Telewest people seem to have some power in decisions about technical positions. lets hope its a sign that they are at last making decisions based on ability and its not a one-off fluke like the way things happened in the past.

I think your right about the 90 days, since having two guys ask me about jobs where I now work, another sent me a text asking the same. I thought at least two of these guys were in fairly safe positions, but it looks like people are starting to worry.

The bad thing about many redundancies before was not just the terrible situation for those affected, but the decision taken on who was kept and who was offloaded was a joke. I always said that if I named the top 10 useless people that I came across in ntl when I left nearly 5 years ago, at least 50% of them are still in a job there and a few have been promoted to the level of their imcompetence.:rolleyes:

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

The above is very true. I was reshuffled out a year ago. There was nothing for me with five years experience in all aspects of the industry, yet the same old useless incompetents are still there screwing up calls day after day.

The company never did want anyone with any initiative...too much trouble. Only subservient yes-men are wanted, anyone else is "managed out of the business" - as I was!

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Most of Networks 1st line management (i.e reporting to HODs) were placed on 90days notice as of yesterday.

The structure under the HODs has, in the main, been sorted out so there will be quite a few redundancies in this round.

Then it's the field guys etc. By my watch will be around July time.

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

All those who are under threat need to look at it positively. There really is life outside ntl. I'm testament to it. :)

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

:tu:


And me :D

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

There are a few in the group affected though, who will be very worried. Some of the people affected have got to positions they have no hope of achieving again if judged on skills and ability.

I'm afraid ntl was very much a company where the weak people stuck together in tribes, to back stab the good guys. Redundancies are never easy to swallow for those affected, but this time around it seems like decisions are being made for the good of the company at the expense of the hangers on.:tu:

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

I met up with a few ntl network guys on Friday night, they indicated that service technicians and even network are likely to be outsourced before very long. Apparently it was on the cards and almost implemented but held off because of the (then) impending merger.

The next level down from the HODs in some departments have already been given the nod if they have a job or not. (I also met one of them Friday night) he says there is a family tree out with 7 regional HODs TBA, apparently there are currently 15.

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

Stupid idea outsourcing the network techs, I can think of the odd cableco who tried to cut down their network tech numbers and rather rapidly reversed it.

I can't think of any that have outsourced entirely though. Presumably ntl is a cableco that doesn't like the 'cable' part of its' description and just wishes that data went between itself and its' customers by magic.

The biggest cable company in the world, Comcast, has *thousands* of network techs, not outsourced. No outsourcing in any of the North American cablecos as far as I'm aware. I think they have a point.

Would have thought the high standard of outsourced group IT would have offered some insight into why this wasn't the greatest idea. Although someone at Manpower / IBM has probably managed to find some 'stats' to massage and present that make it look as though outsourcing is the second coming, and we know how much your ntl love their stats.

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

how would you outsorce network and service do you mean make them all redundant and start them back under new contract if your position is redundant then the jobs gone if thats the case then they will do it by bit by bit instead of on mass chip away at it bit by bit i remember a department in ntl that had four people working for it they made them redundant and gave the work to the contractors they were told that they were not cost effective but it costs more money with contractors they in my opinion got away with it as the lads took the money and ran because they werent unionised ntl get a way with a lot.

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There aren't *that* many network techs you know, and service techs are already in some areas outsourced. I can remember an outsourced service tech resolving an issue I had with telephone service.

What about the headend bods I wonder?

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

One of the guys out Friday is a Headend tech, it sounds like they will be the same. I dont know how it will work, I wonder if they will appear to carry out the same job only working for an outsource company.

One of the managers was saying that he couldn't see how they can make any big cuts after this one. He said all they have done is made people redundant and spent nothing on the network for 5 years.

They were also discussing the fact that they dont think there will be as many cuts in the latest restructure as senior management would like, and the main reason is probably because job roles between the two companies vary a fair bit. They are waiting to see a rumoured change to contracts, as it is thought they will try to align the job responsibilies to bring Telewest and ntl jobs inot line with one another, some seem to think cuts would then be easier to make.

One of the managers affected told me he felt his group had only kept their job this time around because there due to the different company structures were no roles in Telewest (they have all the power this time) that were similar to take over responsibilty.

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

A lot of the voice switch engineers in Cable & Wireless got outsourced to Nortel Networks soon after C&W sold off "Consumerco" to Ntl. Some did alright out of the move but others haven't had a proper pay rise for 5 years, only 1 off bonus payments, plus they had to change pension plans etc :erm:

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

I dont understand outsourcing it suppoesdbly saves cash but when you have agency staff and contractors it costs a lot of ÃƒÆ’Ã¢â‚¬Å¡Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â£ÃƒÆ ’‚£.

Agency staff = less cash to the worker but more cash to the agency then a direct employee would cost.

Contractors = more cash per hour, alot more but they dont have to be employed x amount of hours per week just pay for work rendered.

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By outsourcing to a third party they pass on the responsibility for paying National Insurance and Pension provision which, they say, saves them a lot of money. It removes them from any social obligations and looks good on paper for the shareholders :td:

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Indeed. Also, things like benefits (very good at ntl), holiday an sick pay etc etc. Outsourcing gets rid of most of the cost and all of the hassle of these type of things.

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Alan Grant, the hateful SOB than ran COBI, is now a Director of Cobra, the main contractor in the South (funny old game!)
Rumour is that Service will be outsourced to Cobra,
Networks, now they have been moved under Networks will remain "In-House"

Also, the agreement to rebrand under Virgin states the Consumer arm? Does that mean the core of ntl will remain ntl, as opposed to Virgin??

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Makes sense, get some paper walls up between the consumer / retail and those actually providing the services in the stylie of BT Openreach / Retail. Pre-emptive action as Ofcom are somewhat compelled, even with the old boys' network, to take a good look at this new company and rate it for Significant Market Power with a view to regulating it, mandating access to networks, etc.

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

Yes, I found AGs move to Cobra most amusing, Personally I don't rate them.

We have to wait and see what Model is followed, TW outsource their Civils and cabling operations in a Turnkey contract. Fujitsu in the North and Avonline in the South West (and possibly some others) they have few civils inspectors called network consultants or somthing or other.

ntls on the other hand have a large civils and cabling dept, I've never worked out why as they haven't built anything of any note since 2000.

However it is a ntl guy who has got the Civils HOD job so who knows which way it's going to go.

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

I was made redundant in December from NTL. I am now contracting for NTL business installing routers and doing a very similar job to my old job. I was originally taken on as a trainer but have now been moved to this project instead. I still work out of the same office and talk to my old boss every day, Its a funny old world. :Yikes:

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

what i dont understand is how AG got the job with a contractor he was no good at ntl,you cant get rid of these people you would have to shoot them.

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

:tu:

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Doesn't say much for Cobra then does it?

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And, if my mates are anything to go by...more money too boot??
Network engineers made redundant, theen bought back @£32p/h!!!

---------- Post added at 18:58 ---------- Previous post was at 18:56 ----------

Because he made sure no-one could critisize Cobra for there shoddy work. If you bought up how poor they where in a meeting on on the forum, you where dragged to Manchester for re-education!!!:Yikes:

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

The ones who are no good generally get on very well.

I can think of one HOD who reputedly had a house built for him by contractors, one who resigned over malpractice after finally getting caught, and another who they eventualy got rid of was about as useful as chocolate fireguard, the last I heard of him he was a CEO of a cable company in Bemuda.

The old boys network is still very much alive and well in ntl, many of the clingers on have made contacts and moved. There still remains the really bad ones who are unemployable elsewhere.

I was glad to hear one senior engineering manager is finally out of his position, I remember one of the guys telling him over the phone to ping a device. He said "how do I do that" the answer was "from the DOS prompt..."
He said "how do I get a DOS prompt" !!!!!

He was the sort of "technical" manager who went around trying to tell everyone how good he was and how they should do their job, and how much more he knew than everyone else. In fact it was all a bulls**t to hide the fact that he was technically very weak.

ntl will never change.

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

womble how right you are we were in a meeting with AG and the question asked was what can we due to improve ntl well the first thing is to get a grip of the contractors on know we are not here to discuss that that was it matter closed they think the sun shines out of there backsides. Agender get the contractors more work= you can guess the rest.

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

I take it you are NOT talking about Tully?? I'm Just Mc guessing :)

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Yes i have personally seen 1 or 2 managers walking around with that worried look on there face.

I feel for the guys at the coal face whenever this happens. All this change does not help them to get on with the work they do.

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

The outsourcing debate is one that has run for ages. The biggest annoyance with it is it has proved to be the biggest problem, but they are still talking about it.

London Network Tech's. were outsourced years ago, then 2 years ago it was all brought back in house. Why I hear you ask, simple. They found that the Network in London was in a shambolic state and that they needed to spend 10 million on repairs and refits to bring it back to a reasonable standard.

They did a similar exercise a few years ago. They went to turf working in all other areas after it failed in monumental style in London. I know my old manager was talking to his counterpart in London and he was told "Turf work will kill the engineers". Didn't make a blind bit of difference for NTL, they went through with the turf work. How long did it last? 9 months total before they went back to the old way.

It's amazing that things are tried in other areas and found to fail in a spectacular way, but they STILL try it out in other areas.

NTL learn from past mistakes, Outsourcing is doomed to fail!!!

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

You have it spot on!

I never had any problems with Tully, he is a professional. He was my boss when I left but he wasn't the reason I left

The reason was the way ntl treated people, and most of the poor treatment was by human resources themselves.

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

Regarding outsourcing in a few companies I have worked for and where my sister works it does actually cost the company more but they do it more to make it look like they cutting jobs and to prevent a employee ran environment.

Workplaces dominated by agency staff tend to have less rights and less ways to appeal decisions as well as less favourable sick leave procedures. Apperently in the 70s when strikes were common agencies were very few and in the 80s they boomed when the strikes fell like a stone.

Re: Restructure anyone?
 

Can't really strike when your self employed!!
F*%k 'em, if they outsource me I will behave like a contractor................
run jumpers over the top, bust locks of cab doors, leave subs with no service (in my case thats 50 subs upwards :)!!! )
and basicly, if I'm not TOLD to do it, I wont!!!!!:Yikes: