Virgin conception' first for UK
 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/4228992.stm

Scary science!!

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

mad mad story IMHO so wrong just so wrong.

Mind you some women would argue the upside of this is getting rid of men but I say who is gonna put the shelves up ;)

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

I remember from my Biology course at Uni that eggs and sperm do not have a full complement of genes so I don't know how this would go for actually growing an embryo from the egg? :confused:

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

And don't we bloody know it. Still the Y chromosome is deteriorating at quite a significant rate so men will die out and be extinct anyway, and women will have to kill spiders themselves, and carry their own shopping.

Quite what they are trying to achieve, I don't know. Cloning (especially without sperm) would never be broadly legal, nevermind accepted. They have even done the whole process through to birth and beyond in mice, and produced "abnormal development".

EDIT: meant detrioating, not disappearing. :doh:

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

In our house it's usually me anyway. :D

However, for research purposes it could be ok provided that was as far as it went. The prospect of a person being developed this way needs a lot more time for attitues to be able to cope.

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

And to think that on first read, I thought this was a new business venture for Richard Branson... Hang on, it could be.. It would fit into the name..

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

You know damm fine, flower, that I carry all my own shopping :knock: and kill at the bloody daddy-long-legs that invade my house :erm: so less of your cheek ;)

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

I put myself forward as first employee!! :D ;)

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

IIRC eggs and sperm both have one copy of each chromosome pair ( ie one has the left sock the other has the right), so I guess they could either add the chromosomes from another egg, or get the egg to duplicate its own to get the 'full set'. given the whole x/y thing though you would only be able to produce female clones i guess

EDIT:
helps if I read the article :)

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

I don't see what was so wrong with the original idea of a man and a woman coming together to make a child :shrug:

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

Literally

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

I don't like the sound of it at all.... :erm:

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

Hey, hey! :D

As a 'bit of a nutter' (I am a bit of a quasi-Raelian nutter, but don't hold it against me), I'm not bothered by cloning - if fact, I think it's a great idea. Not because we don't have enough kids in the world, but for various other reasons.

I still like a good s***, though, when I can get one. :erm: :D

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

Ask those who can't (for whatever reason) have children, but want offspring who are biologically related to them (ie not adopted).

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

I was waiting for someone to say that!

This is humans tampering with a power we don't yet fully understand, however this is easily forgotten (if it's even realised) in today's "I want so I'll have" culture.

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

I suppose even if you went away from religius or moral reasons, there is allways nature, "evolution by natural selection";)

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

Bah, no one has said if a baby could be produced by this method. IF it could it would be a clone. Evolution halts and end of story.

This is almost as bad a the daily mail claiming that replacing the mitocondria from another mother was a form of lesbian reproduction.

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

So is all medicine.

Your point is...?

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

Evidently beyond your grasp....

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

Ah, reasoned debate... :rolleyes:

You made a vague statement, seeming based on the "man was not meant to know" principle and assumed that I would go "oh, well Russ says so, therefore it must be right!"

Sorry, not going to work.

If you have a point to make, please, make it.

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

Ah, reasoned debate? Sorry my bad, what I meant was 'pressumption debate' :rolleyes:

Bad analogy on your part really - I was talking about the power of creating life. Sustaining life (ie medicine) is a different matter.

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

We ,as a race, try things. We make mistakes. Hopefully we learn from those mistakes.

I do agree on the second point though, Russ. We do want things NOW, and don't seem to worry too much about the future consequences.

I think part of the problem is people tend to assume they have a RIGHT to a baby. It's not a right, it's a privilige. Although I can understand that is hard for people to understand.

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

I just don't agree that one of the things we should 'try' is to harness to power of created life.

:clap:

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

It's not so much a 'I want so I'll have' thing as an 'I need with all my soul' thing. People (especially women) can suddenly find that a switch has been thrown in their heads and then they absolutely must have a child.....It's not rational, it's nature.

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

Now that point *is* beyond me since I have no idea what you're talking about.

Hmm, so what about IVF?
__________________

Good point.

You're right, I *do* find that hard to understand.

How exactly is having babies *not* a right?

I've not heard of any cases of someone being *denied* the right to have babies, not even people who have eg congenital diseases, except in certain totalitarian regimes.

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

Ivf still the womans egg donor sperm still hers carried by her but not a biological freak.

Is the world not over populated enough without the impossible becoming possible?Mother nature will win out in the end,us humans think we are so important but we are nothing just well trained monkeys who think we know it all
__________________

Its ment to be something that happens through procreation if it happens it happens.You have argued about those who cant have babies,here is a radical idea,Ban abortion Ban IVF allow only naturely born babies into the world.Ill get my flame proof coat

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

And what about babies who are conceived with donated eggs or donated sperm, but still biologically related to one parent?

Who says that it's "meant" to happen that way?

Just because it does in the majority of cases doesn't mean that other methods are somehow "not meant" to happen.

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

Oh come on m8 thats a bit thin,procreation has been done like this for millions of years,Man just likes to think he is God some men more than others

surely you cant contest that man is making a serious mess of things with its interference with nature?

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

It sounds like this research is more to do with getting stem cells rather than creating fully developed clones.

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

It's not a want Russ, it's a need, an overwhelming urge. I appreciate you (as a man) will not understand that. You were priviledged enough to become a father when you hadn't even wanted or planned it. There are people that are depserate for children who have no option but to rely on science rather than nature. Spare a thought for those for a minute.

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

And for "millions of years" humans were living in caves and eating raw meat and not using computers and... it's not a valid argument against this.

Please, don't drag religion into this.

I'm not contesting any such thing.

And bringing in other examples of "man making a serious mess of things..." is also not an argument against this.

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

yes it is

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

It's a bit early for Panto Season. How about some reasonable discussion instead?

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

Im sorry Graham but I do not accept your dismissal of what ive said

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

Oh well, so much for that... :rolleyes:

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

And this should prevent us from researching.... why?

Mistakes are made and are learnt from, this is the nature of research.

The world is over populated but that will not change with this research or any other. It's the human instinct to reproduce. That's an arguement for morality and politics.

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

It would be nice if this thread could proceed in a gentlemanly manner gents!

Speaking as the OP that is... ;)

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

It is :confused: I suggest you look at some other forums.

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

You said it all there human instinct,Instincts are animal ,surely then as a race that puts itself above animals we cant use animal instincts as a reason to mess with nature, this is a contradiction in itself

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

I wasn't actually speaking to you my friend. :hugs: You are always a gent... :tu:

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

Animal instincts are reason for USING technology to advance aspects of human life.

This is research, as in finding out things, it would be human instinct use the technology for something, say reproduction (which in this case it will not).

A mother who cannot have a child wants a child (an instinct) therefore goes for IVF treatment (a technology constructed through research) and boom you have a baby concieved by means not availiable to primitive humans.

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

No, most governments will *not* deny people the "right" to have a baby. Maybe Right was the wrong word, as it implies a legal right, which is something I did not mean to imply.


However, people do seem to assume that because they want a baby, they should have one.

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

The present evolution is sort of making the saying 'A child is a gift not a right' something of a hollow premise.What with surrogacy,test tube babies,IVF and the lengths and distances(never mind the financial implications) that some men and women are prepared to go through it is sometimes forgotten that children have rights too.

Mainly the right to be born for their own sakes and not to satisfy someone's selfish wants and desires.

I think too often the question that gets forgotten is 'Why do you want a child?'

Frankly the answer has got to be more than because I physically can't have one.After all there are far too many orphaned children already in this world,some of whom are damaged physically and mentally who never get a chance of a loving family because they are too old,too damaged and not of the same flesh.

If you truly want to care for someone why do they have to be of your DNA?Why not just love a child because they need love,not because they have your eyes? :(

Re: Virgin conception' first for UK
 

I think so, but thanks for explaining.

Well, yes, that I can agree with. As I may have (facetiously) mentioned before, there should be a proper examination for people who want to be parents, and *not* just the "practical"! :disturbd: