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1andrew1 20-05-2025 11:24
Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Down to fourth place in the polls.

Quote:
A new voting intention poll has placed the Conservative Party in fourth place behind the Liberal Democrats, with Reform UK still in front with a clear lead.

According to the YouGov poll for Sky News/The Times, Nigel Farage‘s Reform are up to 29 per cent, with Labour trailing on 22 per cent after dropping a point.

The Lib Dems are third on 17 per cent, with the Conservatives down to 16 per cent after slumping another two points.

The survey looks set to increase pressure on Kemi Badenoch, the Tory leader, after her party’s historically poor performance at the local elections.
https://www.politics.co.uk/news/2025...dems-new-poll/

papa smurf 20-05-2025 11:43
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Reform in first place quite the achievement
Nigel Farage‘s Reform are up to 29 per cent, with Labour trailing on 22 per cent after dropping a point.

The Lib Dems are third on 17 per cent, with the Conservatives down to 16 per cent after slumping another two points.

Sephiroth 20-05-2025 13:16
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Labour on (a lowly) 22% is more than they deserve.

Russ 20-05-2025 13:20
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1andrew1 (Post 36196848)
Let's see if we can get them down to 6th to 7th.

papa smurf 20-05-2025 13:24
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sephiroth (Post 36196856)
Labour on (a lowly) 22% is more than they deserve.
Lets see if we can get them down to 6th or 7th

1andrew1 20-05-2025 13:34
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Russ (Post 36196857)
Let's see if we can get them down to 6th to 7th.
I expect once they acknowledge and get a new leader, the Conservatives will reclaim 3rd place.

Badenoch is a dream come true for Reform UK and Labour but she won't be there at the next election.

Sephiroth 20-05-2025 13:47
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1andrew1 (Post 36196859)
I expect once they acknowledge and get a new leader, the Conservatives will reclaim 3rd place.

Badenoch is a dream come true for Reform UK and Labour but she won't be there at the next election.
Not sure about that, but I know what you mean.

My party leader has chosen a front bench of professional back-stabbers; in other words, previous leadership contenders whom she is keen not to have them plotting here downfall. But plotting her downfall, they are; that's what our politicians are generally like.

Although she might not be there at the next election, (or even if she is still there), a front bench cleanout is required and new blood brought in from the back benches, carefully introduced as to there credentials and with sensible, achievable policies to offer.

I think this is too much to hope for.

Russ 20-05-2025 15:09
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1andrew1 (Post 36196859)
I expect once they acknowledge and get a new leader, the Conservatives will reclaim 3rd place.

Badenoch is a dream come true for Reform UK and Labour but she won't be there at the next election.
At the rate the Tories are joining Farage’s loopy lot there won’t be a Conservative Party at the next election.

Sephiroth 20-05-2025 15:14
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Russ (Post 36196861)
At the rate the Tories are joining Farage’s loopy lot there won’t be a Conservative Party at the next election.
Yes - a possibility for all intents and purposes.

But Reform isn't as loopy as you as you like to think. Farage needs to consolidate by coming up with workable policies that people can see as achievable. If he can't do that, then we'll be even more sunk at the next GE.

Conservatives need to shape up along the lines I've already described.

Russ 20-05-2025 15:39
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sephiroth (Post 36196862)

But Reform isn't as loopy as you as you like to think.
Oh I’m not so sure. In his haste to be seen as a legitimate party he recruited more than the average number of fruitcakes to join his ranks, later weeding some of them out by claiming to have “improved” (also known as ‘created’) the party vetting process.

Sephiroth 20-05-2025 15:49
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Russ (Post 36196863)
Oh I’m not so sure. In his haste to be seen as a legitimate party he recruited more than the average number of fruitcakes to join his ranks, later weeding some of them out by claiming to have “improved” (also known as ‘created’) the party vetting process.
That is indeed a possibility - basically prejudiced people (some might call far right-wing). I expect Farage to ensure that candidates selected for the GE are probably clean. That's some task but may well be necessary.

Essentially, the people being polled sign up to Farage's message in the context of a pox on the other parties. The nearer we get to the GE, the public will want to be confidant that the 'fruitcakes' do not rule the party.

Me? I'm a paid up Conservative and my party's upper echelon fall into a different sort of 'fruitcake' category.

As for Labour, bustards doesn't cover it.

1andrew1 20-05-2025 15:54
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sephiroth (Post 36196860)
Not sure about that, but I know what you mean.

My party leader has chosen a front bench of professional back-stabbers; in other words, previous leadership contenders whom she is keen not to have them plotting here downfall. But plotting her downfall, they are; that's what our politicians are generally like.

Although she might not be there at the next election, (or even if she is still there), a front bench cleanout is required and new blood brought in from the back benches, carefully introduced as to there credentials and with sensible, achievable policies to offer.

I think this is too much to hope for.
There's also the question of what the Conservative Party actually stands for in 2025. Some of its previous strengths have been trashed.
  • Efficiency through privatisation - this mantra worked well for it in the 1980s but some are now coming back to bite the Party (think Thames Water, British Steel, railways, nuclear power).
  • Party of sound governance and finance - high budget deficit, poor Brexit deal, rapid turnover of PMs, PPE scandal and bankrupt Conservative councils like Slough and Woking have put paid to this reputation.
  • Party of law and order - see Partygate, PPE scandal, BoJo keeping his mates like Chris Pincher and Owen Paterson in place despite their misdemeanours.
  • Party for business - poor Brexit deal, advocating for Brexit against British business' wishes, Liz Truss' calamity stint and the general economy. (They were unlucky with the inflation resulting from Ukraine invasion)
  • Party of low taxation - introduced highest tax burden since WW2. (Since higher under current government)

Russ 20-05-2025 16:03
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1andrew1 (Post 36196865)
There's also the question of what the Conservative Party actually stands for in 2025. Some of its previous strengths have been trashed.
  • Efficiency through privatisation - this mantra worked well for it in the 1980s but some are now coming back to bite the Party (think Thames Water, British Steel, railways, nuclear power).
  • Party of sound governance and finance - high budget deficit, poor Brexit deal, rapid turnover of PMs, PPE scandal and bankrupt Conservative councils like Slough and Woking have put paid to this reputation.
  • Party of law and order - see Partygate, PPE scandal, BoJo keeping his mates like Chris Pincher and Owen Paterson in place despite their misdemeanours.
  • Party for business - poor Brexit deal, advocating for Brexit against British business' wishes, Liz Truss' calamity stint and the general economy. (They were unlucky with the inflation resulting from Ukraine invasion)
  • Party of low taxation - introduced highest tax burden since WW2. (Since higher under current government)
Barring a miracle of Biblical proportions I genuinely (and happily) believe the Tories are a spent force who will not be taken seriously as a potential government for decades.

Bullshitting Boris truly left a lasting legacy but certainly not the one he hoped for.

Maggy 20-05-2025 17:59
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
How long were the Tories in power before Starmer was victorious?

thenry 20-05-2025 20:26
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
14 years wasn't it.. I think.

How many years was it with a condom on :shocked:

Sephiroth 20-05-2025 20:40
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by thenry (Post 36196879)
14 years wasn't it.. I think.

How many years was it with a condom on :shocked:
On what?

thenry 20-05-2025 22:15
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Well David was the dominant one. And Nick had cling film on. :shrug:

1andrew1 28-05-2025 09:41
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Sky News promoting its interview with Cummings with this prediction from him.
Quote:
Kemi Badenoch will be gone as Tory leader within a year - and there are plots already under way to oust her, Dominic Cummings has said.

The former Number 10 aide also claimed the Conservative Party "might be dead".
https://news.sky.com/story/nigel-far...-says-13375541

Russ 28-05-2025 10:49
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Quote:
The former Number 10 aide also claimed the Conservative Party "might be dead".
Ooooh don’t tease us like that!!

Damien 28-05-2025 11:07
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
I usually think you have to take the proclaimed death of one of the two main parties with a large pinch of salt. It's been said of both of them so many times over the years. Tories in '97, Labour in '10, but especially in '19 and now the Tories again.

What gives me some cause for doubt is that Reform does seem a real threat to them. They are not gaining at all from Labour's unpopularity, and Badenoch doesn't have a good read on the country outside of Twitter. Farage is much better at connecting with what people are feeling.

The other side of that is that Reform at the moment has less broad appeal. About 30% of Conservative voters are going for Labour over Reform in a hypothetical match-up. There is a reason why Labour are trying to position Reform front and centre over the Tories because, if the Tories got their act together, they're still a bigger electoral threat. Farage is a big turnoff for moderates and the centre ground. I am not sure of they are capable of broading that appeal in the way Cameron and Johnson did to win their elections.

Chris 28-05-2025 11:24
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Reform’s support is skin deep. It has councillors (and MPs) who don’t show up to work and who resign and swap parties. It is quite possible it could do very well in the next election but at some point it will do well enough that the spotlight is properly on them and that’s when it’ll go bad.

The Scottish Socialist Party was a thing at Holyrood - formed in 1998, got one seat in the first Scottish parliament, six seats in the second, and then utterly beclowned themselves with a series of stunts and pronouncements that would make a student activist blush. They lost all their seats in 2007 and gave up contesting Scottish elections prior to the 2021 vote.

Populists are great at pointing out problems and getting people angry enough at what’s wrong to support them on the basis that they made people agree with them that everything’s awful. Whether they are as good at implementing workable solutions, especially solutions that take time, cost money, don’t have universal support and which involve some people winning and some people losing, is another matter.

The Tories are the most successful political party in the world for good reason. They have a depth of support and a heritage. They may look awful now but they’ve looked awful before.

denphone 28-05-2025 16:56
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1andrew1 (Post 36197206)
Sky News promoting its interview with Cummings with this prediction from him.

https://news.sky.com/story/nigel-far...-says-13375541
Exaggerated media hyperbole as if my memory serves me right they were saying the same thing about the Labour party several years ago.

1andrew1 10-06-2025 18:18
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Quote:
Tories secured most donations of any UK party in first quarter of 2025, data shows

The Conservatives raked in more donations than any other big UK political party in the first three months of 2025 as backers returned to the fray, while Nigel Farage’s Reform UK failed to secure big-ticket supporters.

The Tories received more than £3.3mn in donations in the first quarter, the Electoral Commission said on Tuesday. In the same period, the governing Labour party received £2.3mn, while Reform and the Liberal Democrats received just £1.5mn.

Kemi Badenoch’s party received its single biggest donation of £1mn from gaming entrepreneur and new donor Jeremy Elliott San in February, according to figures published by the UK elections watchdog.

Media reports suggest he donated a further £1mn ahead of the local elections in England in May, though data for that period has yet to be published.

The rise in donations for the Conservatives reflects enduring support for one of the most successful political parties in the democratic world, from both new and historic backers.
https://www.ft.com/content/f97d0740-...b-7578f1a1904b

Hugh 10-06-2025 19:02
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Un-paywalled version

https://archive.ph/1twxo

Hugh 04-08-2025 13:02
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
https://www.theguardian.com/politics...-tory-failures

Quote:
Truss accuses Badenoch of not telling truth about Tory failures

The Conservative leader, Kemi Badenoch, is not telling the truth about the “real failures of 14 years of Conservative government”, the former Conservative prime minister Liz Truss has said.

Writing in the Telegraph, Truss said: “In a recent speech Kemi said: ‘From now on, we are going to be telling the British people the truth even when it is difficult to hear.’ If she’s not willing to tell the truth to her own supporters, the Conservative party is in serious trouble.”

Truss’s comments came after Badenoch’s own Telegraph article in which she claimed the current Labour government was failing to heed the warnings of the disastrous mini-budget that defined Truss’s short-lived premiership.

The former prime minister has been fighting a desperate battle to rewrite the narrative around her 45 days in office in 2022. She released a memoir and embarked on a campaign tour that allowed her to talk up her record and offer her views on the political landscape in the UK and US.

In her Telegraph article, she claimed her mini-budget would have helped the UK escape a “doom-loop” of low growth and high taxes. “Yet, it was sabotaged by the Bank of England and the Treasury – which didn’t want to be challenged and wanted to cover up their failings – and Conservative MPs who either didn’t believe in supply-side economics or cravenly wanted preferment under a Sunak premiership.”

But Truss has faced an uphill battle – not least when she was mocked by the campaign group Led By Donkeys, which unfurled a banner during one of her appearances bearing the phrase: “I crashed the economy.” It also included a picture of a lettuce – a reference to a Daily Star livestream stunt that sought to determine whether Truss’s battle to survive in No 10 could last longer than a 60p iceberg lettuce from Tesco.

Illustrating her criticism of the current Labour government, Badenoch invoked Truss’s failures in No 10. “Picture the scene: a new prime minister and chancellor spending billions without also making the necessary savings to offset their splurge and balance the books. The markets react adversely, interest rates spike and the cost of living gets worse with prices soaring.

“For all their mocking of Liz Truss, Keir Starmer and Rachel Reeves have not learnt the lessons of the mini-budget and are making even bigger mistakes,” she wrote in the Telegraph on Saturday.

Hitting back, Truss wrote: “She is wrong. Labour is doing the opposite of the mini-budget, which is why the country is headed for disaster.”

And listing several policy recommendations that place her close to the US president, Donald Trump, politically, Truss added: “It is disappointing that, instead of serious thinking like this, Kemi Badenoch is instead repeating spurious narratives. I suspect she is doing this to divert from the real failures of 14 years of Conservative government in which her supporters are particularly implicated.”

Sephiroth 04-08-2025 16:07
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Truss has her reputation to protect. There is no doubt, that her measures were intended to stimulate economic growth; as in her heart was in the right place. But she wasn't in her right mind when she announced £45bn of unfunded tax reductions without consulting the relevant regulators (OBR/BoE).

Quote:
Writing in the Telegraph, Truss said: “In a recent speech Kemi said: ‘From now on, we are going to be telling the British people the truth even when it is difficult to hear.’ If she’s not willing to tell the truth to her own supporters, the Conservative party is in serious trouble.”
BI hope that Kemi's words were sincere and not the usual weasel words that all politicians use in one scenario or another. So, in that regard, not only is Truss right, but the Conservative Party IS in serious trouble. Very serious trouble. Kemi's front bench is infested with those who caused the past Tory failure. What's worse, people at large know this and say this.

Kemi needs to meet me for a curry and implement my advice which starts with a front bench clear-out and the introduction of the 2024 intake. Also she realistically needs to acknowledge that a large proportion of Reform UK are natural Conservatives and to win them back, an accommodation with Reform UK is necessary.

1andrew1 04-08-2025 16:56
Re: Conservative Party's chronicles
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 36200430)
Her lack of self-awareness is the casualty here.


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