So that's the problem with the nhs
 

Wales has too many hospitals and too many beds according to the Finance Minister Mark Drakeford.The former Labour first minister told the "For Wales, See Wales" podcast that Wales was "over hospitalised" and that more money should be spent on primary care.

Re: So that's the problem with the nhs
 

That is Dripford-speak for "We don't have enough doctors or nurses".

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How? Governments practically imported a nations worth of workers

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They must have all been scientists and engineers. :confused:

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Welsh government drives them out:(

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The workforce in the UK is 800,000 less than it was pre-pandemic. Early retirement, ageing population profile, etc.

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At 20mph, or 50mph on the motorways.

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They were words stupid words to use (he has form for that) but what he said has been completely taken out of context.

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Didn't think Mark ever thinks about context , just spouts rubbish.:D

Re: So that's the problem with the nhs
 

I don’t think anyone will accuse him of being the sharpest tool on the shed.

What he meant was Wales relies too much on sending people to hospital when they could be treated by primary care, GPs and alternative methods.

He kind of has a point but realistically what the whole country needs are better equipped hospitals.

Re: So that's the problem with the nhs
 

How would increasing primary care reduce the number of beds and the waiting lists?
Where would all the GPs required come from?
Wales has too many hospitals, says Drakeford

Longest hospital waiting lists still rising (Wales)
More evidence of specialist hospital care being required.

Re: So that's the problem with the nhs
 

You could make exactly the same point in respect of England, Scotland and Northern Ireland. We should be changing our emphasis to preventative methods and health care outside the hospital system wherever possible. The whole system needs streamlining. For example, if your GP says you need a scan, it should not be necessary to then go to the hospital for a second appointment with a hospital doctor or consultant. The appointment should be booked online by the GP, saving valuable hospital time.

It is not a valid excuse for the poor performance of the Welsh NHS compared with the other UK regions.

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Or just, that over the last 20 odd years labour haven't a clue:dunce:

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It would have been worse under the Tories.

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Really:confused:

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Don't spoil his fantasy :nono:

Re: So that's the problem with the nhs
 

Except it was not worse in England while they were in power. Where do you get these ideas from?

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From 2010 to 2024 whenever we’d criticise them on here the Tory fanboys would just give the stick answer of “it would be worse under Labour”. So I’m just trying that.

As for it not being worse in England over the same time, maybe take a look at waiting list levels for NHS England over that 14 year period.

The Tories do not have a good record of looking after the NHS.

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The money wasn’t there, Russ, as you know. The criticism I would level at the Conservatives is that they did not tackle the waste and bureaucracy in the NHS and the Civil Service generally. The money saved could have been diverted to the frontline. This is the one significant thing Reeves has correctly identified, though, and good on her for admitting it. But will she do anything to address it? I’m not holding my breath.

Anyway, whatever. The English NHS has been performing better than the Scots or the Welsh versions. It will be interesting to see the comparisons after 4.5years. Will we in England sink to the level we see in Wales?

Let’s hope not.

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If you posted links we might be able to

Re: So that's the problem with the nhs
 

Better?

https://www.cableforum.uk/board/atta...3&d=1737896854

https://www.cableforum.uk/board/atta...4&d=1737896854

https://www.nhsconfed.org/articles/key-statistics-nhs

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That's so true Russ. In Westminster, there's a whole tool cabinet :)

Re: So that's the problem with the nhs
 

IMHO the problem is the Doctors surgery's that are impossible to get through to and book an appointment..


So people go to A&E.


I mean everytime I phone I'm either told the queue is full and try later or I'm 30+ in the queue and press "8" to get a call back when you get to the right place in the queue

Re: So that's the problem with the nhs
 

I phone and normally get an appointment with in the same day. You get what you pay for:cool:

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Is that a rare thumbs-up for the Welsh Government then?

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Can’t be too bad then.

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Probably not, probably just private, which is what this last 14 years have been about, inherit a system that has total public support and incredibly high satisfaction and deprive it of money, staff and grind it into the ground so far people want to go private, based on recent history it'll work too

Re: So that's the problem with the nhs
 

I assume he meant a private doctor.

I can access appointments with various doctors via work schemes.
The problem with them is that you dont get NHS prescriptions, only private.

I can book appointments with my own doctor online, or ring them up.
Next day is generally rare, esp in the winter months, same week is often possible, tho sometimes its a phone appointment initially.

I can usually book face to face about 2/3 weeks ahead, which is fine for routine stuff. I have one this week that I booked 2 weeks ago.

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This logic holds absolutely no sense , if your condition was serious enough to warrant going to A&E then you would go to A&E in the first place. There are other services available

A&E purpose ? the clue is in the name….

Re: So that's the problem with the nhs
 

No it's getting what I pay for. ( DIRECTLY) :D

---------- Post added at 14:12 ---------- Previous post was at 14:03 ----------

The trouble with the UK is ,people want ," free" health care , free schooling, free support for heating bills ,free pensions, support in cash terms for everything. Along with no taxes
for them just everyone else.

Re: So that's the problem with the nhs
 

"Free" at the point of use (in healthcare) must be a preference over being bankrupted for healthcare (over 1.3 million US Citizens last year)?

https://www.expressnews.com/opinion/...p-20018041.php

btw, you'll be grateful for the NHS if you have an serious accident or a chronic condition - your Private Health won't cover you if you find yourself in the ICU...

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I am bemoaning the fact no-one wants to pay the price for them not the idea:dozey:

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We don’t want to pay the price because we already pay taxes.

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<cough cough>

https://www.cableforum.uk/board/show...t#post36179991

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Whoopsie….

Re: So that's the problem with the nhs
 

And I don't use it ! However via indirect tax mainly VAT pay for other people to. These who moan that they need ,want others to support them. Personally l strongly object to supporting those to lazy to look after themselves . If you want these services stop complaining about the tax you pay. Remember you will somehow end up doing so. Companies will pass the cost on. :shocked:

Re: So that's the problem with the nhs
 

I’ve never complained about the tax I pay (in fact, when I was contracting, I used an Umbrella Company so I paid my full tax, rather than minimising my tax/NI by paying myself a minimal salary and dividends - my choice, others are entitled to their choice).

Being part of society means (to me) contributing appropriately, if you can - not boasting about how you can avoid doing so…

Re: So that's the problem with the nhs
 

Exactly this! In 2020, my daughter had a condition where she had to go to Moorfields Eye Hospital, then to our local general hospital, then on to Great Ormond Street Hospital, all in the space of one week. She had MRI scans, ultrasound, a lumbar puncture and all the blood tests you could think of. She has been regularly going back to Great Ormond Street ever since.

It was a worrying time enough as it was but at least costs were not something we ever needed to think about. The admin went as far as name, date of birth, GP and address and that was it to get treatment at a world renowned children’s hospital

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The missus was called in to see her GP last week, She was asked to urgently write a letter to the Cardiac Unit to request they write a letter to the Diabetes Unit referring her to the Cardiac Unit. Nothing else was said at the appointment. The GP said that if they wrote the letter, it would affect their budget.

After the weekend, we got the first of 3 phone calls from the Practice, asking is the missus had received any mail from either the Cardiac or Diabetes Units. Nothing yet.

Admin gone mad?

Re: So that's the problem with the nhs
 

Society as you call it can take a.......................

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Well as you’ve previously said, as long as YOU are ok, sod anyone else.

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I assume when you have an accident you will tell the paramedics to "take a ……………….", to stay true to your, for lack of a better word, principles… :dozey:

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Yes fed up with beggers , junkies and drunks . People should really stop expecting to be wet nursed:shocked:

---------- Post added at 17:22 ---------- Previous post was at 17:15 ----------

Have no problem with the NHS or those that work in it. Not sure it should pander to whims of some people. As a concept it's great idea, lacks the finance and abuse of the system is a major problem. I choose to avoid using it, putting less pressure on it:rolleyes:

Re: So that's the problem with the nhs
 

My private scheme via work doesn't cover chronic conditions but may cover acute episodes resulting from a chronic condition.
Related to that is cover of chronic conditions where the patient will not or cannot take care of that condition in themselves. Is there any point where you delay or withdraw further treatment until they do? Is there a difference between those who will not and those who cannot? What about the person who generally does but then on one occasions does not and ends up needing treatment compared to the person who generally does not?
Examples : the diabetic who still eats Mars daily, refuses to take any exercise (even when that is provided free or discounted), refuses to monitor their condition all because the NHS will fix things up anyway. The diabetic who is normally careful but at a special occasion forgets, becomes hypoglycaemic and injures themselves. I am not having a go at diabetics but it is a chronic condition that does require the patient to be active in their treatment, other conditions like high blood pressure may also require non-clinical action.
Overall why should the NHS pick up the bill for people who willingly don't stay healthy? I do emphasise the "willingly", they know it's wrong but can't be bothered to correct their behaviour so they don't need treatment. I guess one issue is someone who "abuses" their body but ends up needing treatment for something unrelated. You can't refuse treatment for someone with a history of high blood sugar who was hit by a car!

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Tend to agree, smokers , fat people, drug addiction. Should bear the cost of their treatment. Add to that fertility treatment.look at the savings , time, monies beds etc. Seem to recall that car accident victims insurance paid some of the costs. If should.