Your predictions under Labour
 

So what are your predictions?

The Minimum Unit Price for Alcohol will be extended to England, and hiked for the whole of the UK "to help the Hospitality Sector".
Revaluation of all homes for Council Tax increases.
Congestion Charge extended to EV's.
A full roll-out of 20mph speed limits, LTN's and ULEZ.
Road Charging.
Parking Charges at work.
The removal of the Tax Freeze on fuel.
Hefty taxes and restrictions on vaping.
The continuation of the policy not to increase Personal Tax Allowances.
Disabled people pushed towards work and/or training.
Disability Payments changed from cash to coupons for devices and modifications.
Streamlining asylum applications by reducing checks.
Recognising Palestine.
A law protecting islam from blasphemy.
Building on Grey Land.
A tax designed to push people to spend rather than save.
A tax on internet usage.
Whatever the Unions demand.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

You are kidding yourself on if you think the Starmer government is in the pockets of trade unions.

Significant effort went into purging the party of any semblance of a left wing party. Despite the popularity - along the population at large - of some of the policies in previous manifestos.

I predict an extremely vanilla two years before being prodded into action by a slump in the polls. Whether that action is a lurch to the left or right is a toss of a coin.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

No

yes, or something similar

already happening

yes

yes or similar

yes or tax it

no

no, they’ll ban vaping and smoking

no

no

possibly

yes and approving all.

no

an absolute cert.

should do

tax savings? I could see that.

no

no

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Easy prediction and that is we won't have the daily psychodramas, arrogant entitlement to power and internecine warfare we had constantly under the Tories.

That just in itself is a improvement.

As for policies well nothing is working in this country so the only way is up.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

A load of we didn't say that, we offered nothing and a load of nothing is what you get.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

As he has concentrated on telling the voter what he's not going to do and not what he is going to do, It's difficult to predict. The question is, will he do very little or will he be Blair 2.0.

He can't do much different unless he hits the public with higher taxes, he's unlikely to grow the economy. So I guess he's either going to have a short honeymoon period until those that voted for him realise, or he's going to get radical. He doesn't seem like the radical type, he's Mr cautious but it depends on who he has advising him. (Maybe Blair!!!!)

* Give the Welsh Assembly more powers.

He can then distance himself from them and the shambles they have been responsible for over the past 25 years. (I refuse to call that town hall council a government)

* Some spite taxes on those in the middle earning a good wage to appease those that suffer from envy.

They know they can't tax the rich, so better off workers are an easy target as the are generally despised by those on benefits, low paid, part-time or pensioners.

* Further privatisation of the NHS by stealth with PFI type deals like the last Labour government.

What they have said about increasing the contracting of NHS patients to private hospitals would have resulted in screams of "Privatisation of the NHS" if the Conservatives had proposed the same.

* Building their 40 new hospitals will most likely be some sort of PFI deal with the private sector. The Conservatives couldn't afford it, but perhaps he's going to screw those in the middle enough to pay for it.

* GB Energy or whatever it's called is just another deal to throw money at the private sector. Even if does reduce energy bills it will have been funded by the extra tax collected from the worker.

* Abolish the 40 & 45% tax relief on pension contributions, and reduce the annual allowance from £60k back to £40k. (Envy tax)

* Abolish the 25% tax free amount that you can take from your pension pot after 55 year of age. (I could foresee an election and a Labour government later this year, so even though I didn't really need the money when I combined my private pensions in April this year I took my 25%)

All in all personally I find it depressing, I'm less than 2 years off 60 which is when I plan to retire or partially retire. So from a personal point of view I'm hoping he ignores his advisors and follows his gut instinct, which means he will probably procrastinates for at least a year and then do very little.

I just wonder how long it will take for the centre-left to realise, or should I say admit, that things are no better.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Very few carrots. Just bigger and better sticks plus a lode of woke nonsense.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Sounds good to me.

Bring on those hidden tax rises for those that are bleeding us dry.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

They have no money to do anything, so it’ll be token gestures in the culture war.

And tax rises.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

I don't expect a lot of drama, as there is a huge mess to sort out.

Tax thresholds won't change - this will impact pensioners and would be the same had the Tories got back in.

Much will be expected from the Covid corruption Tsar claiming funds back, but this will take years.

The low and middle earners cannot be taxed more as this would be self defeating. Ultra wealthy may find they are taxed more, along with those who make money from property, again this will only affect a few.

I have already received a leaflet from Labour outlining their first steps. None of which are hugely contentious or massively ambitious.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

That's exactly how Blair reduced waiting lists, and I don't recall there being a huge outcry at the time.

The trust where I live has been using private hospitals ever since then, I had an NHS op in one a couple of years ago, because my wait was about to breach their target time. It frees up NHS capacity to concentrate on the more complex cases that can't be done in the private sector.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

I have no idea on what's to come or how they're going to sort things out. But for me to feel cautiously optimistic is at least a step in the right direction.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

The new MP for Leicester NW is a friend and colleague. Also a bonus that the former MP lost his deposit. :rofl:

---------- Post added at 09:54 ---------- Previous post was at 09:37 ----------

As the private surgeon who operated on a friend pointed out, they are chasing the same nurses as the NHS and costs constrain what they can pay.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

ID cards is one to watch. Last Labour government wanted them and it could help with immigration which is one area Labour will be going all out to combat.

Although as soon as I type that they're on tv denying it.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Personally l have a strong hunch we will be hearing a lot more of ID cards.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Your summary its so true.:D

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Yes it might do away with the confusion about what ID to use to vote..

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Well it was one Blair’s policies, and we’re now in his 4th term.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Most people have ID of one sort or another, so a central (Simple) ID card doesnt seem that bad an idea. What I disagree with is the various proposals to store all sorts of personal information on them. Thats a fraudsters dream when people lose them (or the get stolen). Photo, name & DOB are pretty much all you really need.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

The proposed information on the cards were your photo and your date of birth. That is less information that is on a Driving Licence. What was supposed to happen though, was a link to more information on a "protected" database, run by a private company. That's what made a lot of people object to them.

And having to pay for them of course. The Passport fee increased to cover the cost of issuing one at the same time. When the ID card scheme was scrapped, the fee didn't go down (of course).

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Well it seems they have been ruled out anyway.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c87rgj4e0rzo

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

You seem to be constrained by the thinking that we have been conditioned by for decades namely, the only people you can tax (at the higher rates) are the PAYE masses. These poor smucks have been taxed to the hilt by the last Government and yet there is no debate about the other, more appropriate, sources of taxation that could be leveraged with a little creative thinking.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

I'm not constrained, those who decide how people are taxed are the ones who are constrained. Taxing those on PAYE is easy, it's lazy, it's taken at source, the profit can't be hidden in overheads so there's no way for the person to avoid paying it as they never get their hands on it to start with.

I don't think taxing wealth is fair either, if person A earns a £100 and invests it, and person B earns a £100 and spends it on drink and drugs, I don't see why person A should be penalised with a wealth tax because they are saving for the future.

I have been forced into PAYE, because one of my contracts was placed inside IR35 as a result of a blanket assessment of all contractors by a jealous and lazy civil servant. This means to satisfy HMRC I'm now being employed via a fictitious umbrella company to which I am paying fees. I'm paying employee and employer NI, Apprenticeship levy and I'm not able to claim any expenses.

As a result of the IR35 blanket decision, the end client has lost a lot of very difficult to replace resources, some have reduced the days working for the client and the day rate costs for those that have renegotiated have increased with projects delayed or in some cases scrapped.

I said no thanks to the renewal, and then they wanted to negotiate so I screwed them for a large increase to cover the PAYE costs, so they are paying more money and they are getting a lot less for it.

The contract is soon up for renewal, and I have made them aware that I will only agree a contract with a reduced number of days as I have one customer with work outside IR35 who wants to increase the work that I am undertaking for them.

The government and HMRC have been screwing small businesses by forcing them into PAYE, yes there was abuse of the system in many cases, but I would have been quite happy to provide the evidence to HMRC that I was providing a service via my company.

The last Conservative government hit small businesses as they are also an easy target and I certainly don't see Labour doing any different.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

You said that "They know they can't tax the rich" and you are just wrong. They can tax the rich* but (currently) are choosing not to.

Your example of taxing wealth is flawed in so many ways. First, you need to define "earn". If you have £1 million invested in company shares and you get regular dividends, you are not "earning" this money as most people would define the term. In fact, your capital earned it, you did not.

As for your IR35 story, you are are just peeved that you are paying more tax, just like a PAYE employee would be which is what IR35 was all about:



* just to be clear, this covers those whose net worth is > £5 million before people conflate "rich" with the middle income tax payers

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

He's got a point.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

To you maybe. Most people would not discuss the term Wealth tax in the same sentence as "if person A earns a £100 and invests it"

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

To start with, HMRC state that IR35 should be an individual assessment and they make it clear that it should not be a blanket decision by an organisation. The client should not be completing an assessment without input from the individual involved. My assessment contains incorrect information, because the individual who completed the assessment made no contact with me to obtain the answers given. The answers to the questions in the CEST tool were chosen to influence the outcome by an individual who had no details of what work my company was actually undertaking.

I was not acting as an employee, I invoiced the client for the services on a day-rate basis that my limited company was undertaking for them. I set the business up specifically so I could offer engineering services which I intend to run part time into early retirement. I made the mistake of signing a contract with one client that contracted my business for a large number of days.

It's a bad situation all round, because I am constantly having to say no to the client when I am asked to do something that would involve a cost to myself or use of facilities owned or paid for by my business. The client as a result is getting less for their money.

Yes, HMRC is collecting a hell of a lot more money in tax off me, but as I have substantially increased the day rate to cover the increased costs I actually have more money in my pocket. Also I don't have any overhead costs involved with this client, and I now sit back and laugh when it takes months to obtain small items that required urgently when I was obtaining them next day and swallowing the cost in my business.

I had been working on the development of a piece of equipment which I intended to hand the design to the client (I'm an engineer not so much a money grabber). Instead I have a third party company that has seen it recently and have asked about purchasing my prototype and the rights to the design. I'm most likely going to sell it to them and let them sell the product to the client.

No one has won, in fact the taxpayer has lost as they are the ones paying for it. My beef is not so much the extra tax I'm paying as I have said it's been offset with the extra costs I'm charging, it's that I have been forced to be an employee of a fictitious company as a means of collecting it.

Without knowing the details you couldn't begin to understand how unworkable the situation is on a daily basis, especially when it's fairly urgent and important.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Sorry, I agree with others , if I’ve worked to earn the money and already paid tax/NI then if I choose to invest it why exactly should I be taxed again ?

I’m getting very tired of HMRC spanking me at every opportunity not even interest on my savings is safe

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

I never gave interest on savings a thought until I became self employed. (Not that I had much savings to consider). I have been taxed on mine since I have had to complete a self assessment each year, but I expect many who point the finger at the rich are on PAYE themselves and don't declare the interest they have earned.

Perhaps they should go after those on PAYE who don't complete a self assessment or fail to declare their savings interest to make it fair.;)

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Because you want things like the NHS, schools, roads defence etc...

If not from here it has to come room somewhere else. Where do you suggest? Income tax, vat, council tax? You'll pay one way or another.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Maybe they should.

---------- Post added at 17:09 ---------- Previous post was at 17:02 ----------

All of which are in a right state, because the money they take is not spent wisely, because it’s not theirs, it’s ours.

If the existing tax and spend was managed correctly, we probably wouldn’t need to increase tax or tax people multiple times…………but that’s probably a different discussion.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

A few things are happening now:

• Looks like they might release a load of prisoners with more than half their sentence remaining to free up space
• Ban on wind farms revoked - they'll also take the power away from local councils to decide if they're built
• A load of new town developments which were on hold will be built
• They've overruled a few councils' decisions not to build data centres and given approval themselves

The main trend so far is a very aggressive approach forcing things to be built.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Are you aware if bullets 2 & 4 are applicable to Wales, we also have a ban by Welsh Labour on building any roads.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Raise the price of tax on alcohol ? Raise fuel duty ? Introduce fines for people who deliberately fail to attend drs appointments? Go after large companies who are avoiding paying tax. Stop wasting so much of the public coffers on nonsense projects (like HS2)

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Not sure. Maybe not then. Also not sure about Scotland.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

The planning system is devolved, but I think 2 and 4 align with Scottish Government positions.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

The detail for Wales is never clear.

There's currently a windfarm proposal locally, so I'm guessing the rules of the last government didn't apply to Wales.

https://mynydd-llanhilleth.co.uk/wp-...eaflet-eng.pdf

We used to look out of the window at work in the Blackwood area in South Wales. I can't remember if it was five or six we could see, but it was surprising how often none of them were turning and usually less than half were turning.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

You misunderstand my point. I am not suggesting taxing your money twice and again, this point does not apply to 95+% of the population unless your net worth is in the tens of £millions :)

If you have large amounts of capital, assets, etc. that increase in value or generate income then you should pay tax on these increases at the rate everyone else does. Why should a multi millionaire/billionaire have an effective tax rate of a fraction of, for example, a nurse or care worker.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Release a load of prisoners ?
I guess it didnt take long for madness to kick in.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

It does not take earning tens of millions to get you taxed twice.

You could be earning 35k per year and get RSU’s in a startup and you’re getting hit for tax on the RSU’s NI AND employers NI

To answer your question re millionaire vs nurse
The millionaire has zero personal tax allowance and pays tax on every penny of their paye income at varying rates (so that’s 45% on 850k of their earnings)

A nurse earning £40k per year pays 0 zero tax on the first £12.5k and 20% on the rest


The millionaire has paid £382,500 JUST at the 45% level

Just how much do you want ????

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

This needs to be looked at sensibly.
In my opinion, only violent offenders definitely need a custodial sentence.

Then arguments can be made for those that cause damage, repeat offenders etc.

But a lot of people can be dealt without being jailed.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

I have asked one of my former school friends who's very left wing how much tax does he think is fair, but I have been unable to get an answer. I get the impression that he thinks that anyone earning more than him should be taxed until they earn the same as he does.

He's always obsessed with how much tax other people are paying. He started on about me and my work and not knowing anything about what I'm doing and he was making a lot of assumptions.

I told him that I don't work at that place these days, I started my own business. If the situation had been reversed and he had said the to me, I would have said something along the lines of "I hope that works out for you", but his angry reply was "I hope you are paying the correct amount of tax". I explained that that was between me, my accountant and HMRC which seemed to anger him more. I suppose he doesn't personally know anyone who is rich, so someone earning more than him is his nearest target.

I do have a good memory though, I don't suppose he remembers boasting about taking his sleeping bag into work when he worked in nationalised industry, and I don't suppose he considered it as ripping off the tax payer either.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Don't care get a good accountant worth every penny :cool:

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

I have done, and I'm glad I did.

I put money away every month last year for what I estimated I would owe HMRC. I was pleasantly surprised when I got nearly £2k appear in my bank account as a refund from HMRC.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

You really are not listening here. I am not talking about PAYE earnings which a lot of high net worth individuals do not receive in meaningful terms. I know about RSU's, I get them and I pay an effective tax rate of over 50% on them. Again, I am not talking about the people who receive taxed at source income.

Here's an article that covers this problem: https://www.lse.ac.uk/research/resea...ich-really-pay

This survey was done in 2015-2016. The wealth inequality has increases markedly since then. So back to my point:

The fact that you return back to the PAYE use case means you are not looking at those who generate their wealth through other means, exactly as intended.

I will leave this point with you, again from the article above:

and lastly, Rishi Sunak paid effective tax rate of 23% on £2.2m income in 2023, roughly the same as an average nurse earning £37,000. You would find this perfectly acceptable I presume?

Labour should commission a root & branch reform of the tax system for high net worth individuals and large corporates to make the playing field a bit more level.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Forget taxing the rich, it's never going to happen.

The only way to guarantee that the tax can be collected is by taking it at source, which is what PAYE does. It's far easier for the rich to be portable, hit them with big tax increases and they will be off to somewhere that's less of a communist state just like they did in the 1970s.

The only guaranteed way of raising more tax is to screw those in the middle, who are generally the ones that have taken risks to have that success.

My wife would pay tax twice on the money she earns abroad if she brought it into this country.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

I think the issue is one of perspective

Someone on 30k per year looks at someone on 60k per year and says, they earn twice what I do, they can afford to pay a bit more tax , they can change their lifestyle. Someone on 60k looks at someone on a 100k per year and thinks the same. The issue is that people always think that the ring above should pay more and if required adjust their lifestyle to fit without needing to make a change themselves

Going back to PAYE and RSU and I agree that this is personal, not general

I was given a block of RSU’s and I also went into an agreement whereby I purchased an amount of RSU’s per month with money I had already paid tax on.

Company gets bought and taken private the RSU’s are converted into cash equities which vest/are paid out at the same time as RSU’s would have vested. Cash equities are paid as PAYE which i pay tax at 45%, NI and employers NI


Hardly seems fair does it ?

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Exactly what they want you to think. Their work is done ...

A point to ponder:


---------- Post added at 21:00 ---------- Previous post was at 20:51 ----------

Yes, I agree it is not fair. I don't like paying 50+% tax rate when those with more money than they can spend, pay a fraction of this. The irony here is that they would not even notice the sums that that should be paying.

Don't forget, the country has been groomed for decades to think the ultra wealthy are beyond reach and can raise revenue from the country with a minimal tax burden while the vast majority of the population pay tax rates far in excess of these.

The funniest part of this whole circus is when those who are paying the 30% or 40% tax rate where they have no choice, at the same time, call those who think the ultra-wealthy should pay more crazy :erm: Who are really the crazy ones? :)

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Like I said the view of who is ultra wealthy is entirely relative someone on minimum wage probably views someone on 50k as being ultra wealthy,someone who earns 50k sees someone on 150k as being ultra wealthy etc etc and each person in the lower bracket expects the person in the next bracket up to make the sacrifice.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

I disagree. I am being very objective and definitive. In my examples, I would draw the line at maybe £5 to £10 million net worth. There is no confusion.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

To clarify my statement is how I believe that the general public view ‘ultra wealthy’ not you specifically

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Agreed and therein lies the problem ... exactly as designed :)

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

it's not about "what they want me think", it's about common sense and practicality. taxing the rich didn't work in the 1970s, and people are more portable these days so it will be less likely to work.

I'm not envious or even the bit interested how much someone else earns or has in the bank, what house they live in, what car they drive or how many helicopters they own, I'm only interested in how much I'm being screwed.

The answer to reducing my tax to a fair level where I'm not having over 60% taken off me isn't to chase a unicorn tax.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Just to clarify the 60% figure - are you stating that if you earned, say, £150k, you would have tax (including NI (employer & employee)) deductions of £90k?

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Again, you preach the line again: "taxing the rich does not work". That is what they want you to say and you duly oblige :)

However the most ironic part is that you do not mind how many helicopters they own, how many mansions they have, etc. yet you whinge about paying too much tax. Spoiler alert: if they paid more tax (much smaller, as a percentage, than you do), you would not have to pay so much.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

That's not exactly what I am getting at.

I'm not going to quote figures because that's my business, but as an example:

I am paid weekly on the contract that is inside IR35, so it's quite easy for me to break down the costs on a weekly basis.

If I work 4 days instead of 5, the PAYE deductions mean that the difference in my pocket is that I lose is within a few pounds equivalent to a third of a days pay. Working that fifth day gives the taxman 66% of it.

If I work 3 days instead of 5, for those 2 days I haven't worked I lose the equivalent of two thirds of a days pay.

Hence why I have discussed with the client that if they want me to renew the contract I will only renew the contract with less days. Losing two thirds of a days pay and having two days off is a no brainer.

---------- Post added at 10:24 ---------- Previous post was at 10:20 ----------

Tax from the rich that can't be collected is not going to reduce tax for anyone else. Labour tried it in the 1970s and it was a disaster, it's nothing but a soundbite to rile up the jealous in our society.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

https://www.unbiased.co.uk/discover/...gally-avoid-it

No, not exactly, as above it’s a stealth band.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

I'm already taking the pension contributions into consideration, but once you max out on the upper limit there's no savings.

The salary sacrifice option is not open to everyone to take advantage, if you are working via an umbrella company you are generally provided with a list of those that are approved and I found that many on the list I was provided did not offer salary sacrifice. The only option you have then is the pay the pension contributions after paying 40% or 45% tax and claiming it back at the end of the year from HMRC. However, you have still lost out because you have paid employee and employer NI on that money.

I fully expect Labour to remove the higher rates of tax relief on pension contributions, it will send out a message to their core voters that they are punishing the "rich".

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

I have nothing to hide so will happily carry and ID card.

---------- Post added at 21:50 ---------- Previous post was at 21:40 ----------

They'll raise taxes in one way.


Screw the motorist, Their OK as they claim the money back and we pay for it.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Well the prisoner Release scheme went well. :erm:

Who would have guessed it, released criminals commiting crimes almost straight away. :dozey:


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnvdy22gje4o

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

They didn't have much choice with the prisoners. Prisons were overcrowded and weeks from being full.

They do need to reform the justice system and/or announce more prisons are to be built though. There is no point decrying the state of how prisons were left if you're not going to do anything about it long-term.

There is a story in The Times today actually about how bad things are: https://www.thetimes.com/article/edd...9898a43979374d

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

How about not putting people in prison for posting stuff on social media, for a start.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Are you still on probation? ;)

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

I don't think they should either (unless it's a direct incitement/threat) but that's a negligible amount of those sentenced to prison. We do not have enough space or need to add many more crimes that don't result in a custodial sentence.

The article above was before the riots for example and it was close to the point where the police were close to the point where they could no longer arrest people as they would have nowhere to put them.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Two Tier Keir is going to solve the NHS overload by killing as many pensioners as possible.

The silence here from those that wanted change is deafening.:rolleyes:

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

and solve the prison crisis by releasing the criminals so he can lock up texters

i think he's a dangerous idiot and a completly evil control freak.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

The hypocrisy of posters who supported the Tories, but ignore the fact that they had the same pledge in the 2017 manifesto and said nothing at the time, is stunning…

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

more trouble as lady whats her name getting clothing etc from a rich bloke


Sir Keir Starmer is facing an investigation over a possible breach of parliamentary rules after failing to declare that some of his wife's high-end clothes were bought for her by his biggest personal donor, Lord Alli.

https://news.sky.com/story/sir-keir-...sists-13215777

my prediction more sleaze

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

He needs to knock it off with these stupid donations. Buy your own damn clothes and tickets.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

The hypocrisy of the Labour supporters that carried out a report , that thousands of pensioners would die from this policy, but still implemented it……….is stunning.

The Tories didn’t do it.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

He's become adicted to having his nose in the trough,this "government of service" has quickly turned into a government of sleaze

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

still got my tag.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Who really expected there to be any change in the way we are governed?

Also it was so predictable that the last government wouldn't even let Labour get their feet under the table before accusing them of continuing with the same antics they have been up to in 14 years of being the people in charge.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Guilty is guilty no matter who is calling it out.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

330k excess deaths are believed to be attributable to the Tories austerity policies

If/when this policy gets 10% of that come back and let’s talk.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Source ?

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Even if you accept that nonsense, it says that Scotland's rate was more then twice that of England.

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Reasoning for calling it nonsense ? Apart from it doesn’t fit your narrative ?

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

No actual details given in the report. Are we really expected to believe that so many deaths resulted from "social isolation"
The death rate in that period was still LESS than that in 2008. The death rate for 2020 was LESS than for 2003.
Link
Drug deaths soared in that time period, especially in Scotland.

Link

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Aliens are “believed” to walk amongst us.

Labour are in power, what are they going to about it? ……not the aliens ……..

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Not sure Starmer (or a friendly donor of his) is capable of resurrecting 330,000 dead people. :D

Re: Your predictions under Labour
 

Well there arent actually 330,000 specific dead people to resurrect.
Its just a number someone thought might happen, not something that actually did happen.
Much like the current situation with the £300 fuel payment where 'x' number of people may die - they also may not, its just a theory & guesswork.