National Service in the British Military
 

BBC.co.uk article

So what does Cable Forum think to this one? Interested to hear some other's thoughts on this

I couldn't see this already posted, apologies if it is.

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

Well it should me mandatory, some of these chav's and thugs, would soon be put in their place, and find that a 6ft 5 drill Sargent wont be intimidated by them

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

We had YOPS (or was it YETIs?) serving with us. Most eventually signed-on at age 18, but one lad, the bane of his SNCO's life, just tore up his uniform and walked off the base.

Then there was YTS, followed by "volunteering" as a part of the Baccalaureate course. Most in our twins' year refused to work in Care Homes or Special Needs Schools, so ended-up Charity Chugging inside supermarkets (too cold and wet outside for the poor dears).

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

But what makes you think any of the 6’5” drill sergeants presently employed in the British Army have any interest in running a borstal for chavs? All of them are professional soldiers who have themselves become skilled at training professional soldiers for a professional army. The drill sergeants want to be there and the young men and women they train want to be there. Conscription is a whole other sort of operation that simply is not part of our national psyche, seeing as nobody here under about 80 years of age has done it. We introduced it at a time when we had no choice and then were able to continue it because the infrastructure for it was in place thanks to the war.

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

But some will find the army is for them.


I read a case many years ago about a guy who had 2 options prison or working with special need people, he thought the special needs was the better option, it was hard, but in the end he carried on as he found his vocation.

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

Charming and all that, but doesn’t answer my question.

No drill sergeant presently in the British Army signed up, or trained, for the task of beating recalcitrant young adults into *insert approved outcome here*. That is not what the army is for. Why should the army, or its drill sergeants, be expected to pick up a broken society’s crap?

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

Quoted for truth...

When I joined up in the '70s (1970s, for any smerterse out there), the point of Basic Training was to find out if you could adapt to being part of the Military, work as part of a team, and to start to shape your potential - however, you could drop out at any point if you realised this life wasn't for you (the drop out rate in Basic was around 10-20% of the intake). You then went on to trade training, and in my course of 20, only 12 completed it.

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

If not the armed forces , which is for one year seems to be a waste of everyone's time. Working each weekend for year in the fireservice or what ever certainly is. Hope I misheard that parents will be held responsible of their 18 year old not doing it. Crazy idea , if this is the extent of tories thinking . Monster raving looney looks good.

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

:tu:

---------- Post added at 17:17 ---------- Previous post was at 17:16 ----------

:clap::clap::clap:

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

But won't these be the age of normal recruits?


I get what you mean, but jobs change and people have to change with them.


I did in many jobs, but I was told adapt or quit.

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

If this is going to be voted for then maybe everybody should do it?

If this is about a fantastic opportunity to give back to the communities that raised us then I don't see why we artificial limit it to people who are 18 when we've all benefited from our country. Why limit the ability to 'give back' to those lucky kids who'll turn 18 in 2029?

It might look to them as if we're forcing them to do something we wouldn't do ourselves. We get compelled to do jury service so let's follow that model.

Every so often there will be a draw and if you're picked you need to do some community service for one weekend every month for a year. You're eligible from 18 to 75. Once you've done your year then that's you sorted for life.

If you don't you're fined and barred from public service jobs.

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

I am 100% against this

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

The point of national service is that you aren’t allowed to quit.

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

Brilliant idea…..

In one hand we were warned that we live in particularly difficult/dangerous times on the other hand let’s take £2.5bn and waste it an an attempt to satisfy a desperate attempt to incentivise older voters rather than where it’s supposedly needed.

I fully expect the next Tory party political broadcast to feature the theme music from the Hovis advert and a sepia cobbled street.

As a side note approx 31yrs ago I had my final interview at Fulford barracks York. Thankfully the officer interviewing me realised I had no interest whatsoever in joining and it was all the ruse of my arse of a step father. Bullet dodged possibly in more ways than one

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

Keep them in school until age 16 : massaging the youth unemployment figures.

Keep them in school, college or apprenticeships until age 18 : massaging the youth unemployment figures.

Keep them in school, college or apprenticeships until age 18, then oblige them to do a year's National Service : massaging the youth unemployment figures.

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

Get ALL 16 year olds to do 2yrs of Bad Lads Army, get Cpl. Nauyokas out of retirement !

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

There's 1.6 million of them - he might need a megaphone...

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

Idk… the cpl & sarge couldn’t half shout I think the RSM was even louder !

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

This is my thought exactly. I had to scroll a fair way before I found someone else thinking the same thing!

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

Its not going to happen, so this is all a bit of a meaningless discussion really.

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

Asked my 15 year old what she thought about this idea. Her response was ‘fruity’ and robust :rofl:

(that said, she volunteers every week as a Junior Cub Scout Leader already)

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

The thing that’s most irritating about this proposal is that it deliberately refuses to engage with the fact that a good number of young people do actually do useful community volunteering already. The proposal bluntly states that national service (the community rather than the military variant) must be in addition to whatever else the young person has got going on.

I’m not remotely bothered about the practicalities of that because as we all know, this will never happen. The thing that appalls me is the mean-spiritedness evident in the very idea. It really is just brazen in its nastiness towards one part of society in pursuit of the approval of another.

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

From a generation that never did national service and has bled the country dry. Left the young in debt, with no prospects, no housing, and stopped them pursuing careers in EU countries. As long as we have the Proms, Dad's Army powdered egg and rationing back, everything will be super.

Time for the young to have a revolution, or at least motivate them to vote.

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

On the volunteering front, my eldest took part in the National Citizenship Service program launched by the David Cameron government a while back (https://wearencs.com/) which was a weeks residential course which included life skills, teamwork, employment skills, etc. and a weeks volunteering (she worked at a women’s shelter) Locally, the course was co-sponsored by Watford FC.

The course was brilliantly run and she got a lot out of it, including a certificate ‘signed’ by Boris Johnson the day after he resigned.

Unfortunately, the funding has been cut by nearly 70% on the orders of the then Chancellor, one R. Sunak…

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

Interesting final line. During the second global disagreement with Germany, young lads not old enough to pass a driving test today were placed in bombers and flew overseas to bring fire from the skies. They were capable enough. They won a war.

I wonder if your point is more about today's young peoples' capacity or willing rather than their age. Perhaps then this is more about the values and standards in today's society? Perhaps if we look at it from that angle, we might argue that giving these young people, where society has become too lenient and too 'tolerant', where there are no boundaries or consequences for their actions even from their parents, might give them a place to grow and develop. Where they can build lasting comraderies and friendships. Where they might find a calling, or at the very least, something they can feel proud about and where acheivement (likely something they rarely experienced in school or at home) is rewarded and recognised.

Sometimes, people need to be pushed into something that is outside of their comfort zone at first, to actually reach their potential. Maybe this is that thing for many, many young people struggling to find a way in life, where the opportunities are harder to find, things cost far more than they did and thus their prospects are deminishing all the time.

Do you think this is an unrealistic scenario that a lot of young people face?

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

But there was an existential threat during WW2 - the only threat being addressed by the Tories’ proposal is them losing the election, so they’re going for the Boomer vote (most of whom haven’t served in any way, shape or form.).

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

The subject cropped up over lunch in the mess with a couple of them during my visit to Blandford today. The WO1 had a similar opinion to mine, that is that it would be better to give the option to youngsters who commit crime.

I told them I had a sigh of relief that I'm way to old, as discipline and me never got on.

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

This I just dont understand, how does this benefit "Boomers" :confused:

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

Welll...you might have a point. But young people these days want - indeed, demand - a choice. And Heinlein was right about conscription. I think he believed that any country which had to rely on conscription wasn't worth defending in the first place. That, in fact, was the point of Starship Troopers - the novel, not the film. Anyone serving did so because they wanted to (though at one point Rico couldn't for one moment recall why he'd signed up, and it wasn't when he took his licks - the Mobile Infantry was actually paying him a compliment of sorts, i.e. 'yes, you screwed up, but you might be salvageable, so we'll give you something you'll never forget', rather than kicking him out. Had Rico messed up as badly as he did in the film, he'd have been immediately discharged dishonourably and possibly charged with involuntary manslaughter).

Voluntarily, it might work. Might. As conscription, it can't work. I think Sunak has just lost the vote of anyone affected by this. And TBH, if I were in combat - a prospect more unlikely than me winning the National Lottery...especially as I don't play it - I wouldn't want some rookie backing me up. They won't either, and who could blame them?

I agree that the young need some discipline and boundaries. But this isn't the way (though I concede I don't really have an alternative).

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

It doesn’t benefit them, it motivates them to vote Conservative by playing up to (for some) their prejudices (teenagers are lazy), so bringing back National Service is a Shibboleth for some of that age cohort, even though it’s very unlikely that most of them even undertook it…

Re: National Service in the British Military
 

You know Heinlein's fascist Earth wasn't worth fighting for but Britain in WWII was, in fact this country was fighting against what that Earth became.

Your view of the young people involved isn't congruent with what happened post WWII either, for instance there were a number of National Service conscripts in the Gloucestershire Regiment at Imgin River and I doubt there was a single veteran who wasn't grateful some rookie was watching their back that day