Cash and the cashless society
 

I'm surprised that there isn't a discussion about our attitudes to cash and the move towards a cashless society, both in terms of more businesses refusing cash and bank branch/ATM closures making it harder to get access to cash.

Therefore, what are people's views of the move to a cashless society and are we having to start to accept that in the digital, online world that cash is a relic from the past?

Also, what are the pros and cons for all of us in a world where cash is slowly starting to become less and less welcome?

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

With cashless, it is perfectly possible for your every purchase and money movement to be known to those who have access to the systems. The DWP has announced that it will be demanding that banks inform them of how much is sitting in accounts that could exceed the maximum allowed for certain State Benefits.

I drilled holes into my contactless card to stop it acting as such, basically cutting the aerial. It is not a chore for me to enter the PIN each time, but would block anyone stealing it and then using it before I had it blocked by the bank.

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

You know you can do your banking at the majority of Post Offices these days, paying in, withdrawing etc. I use my Post Office for this quite a bit as its closer than anything else plus they are often open as the shop that hosts it is so till 10pm most nights around here.

I use my card for most things, keep very little cash now, its only the chippy, kebab house, haircut and car park in town that I frequently use cash for. Suites me fine, I spend far less using my card than I do with cash as I look down my statement and realise where I am wasting my money at times!

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

Cash is making a bit of comeback due to cost of living. It's easier to budget with cash. I prefer to use cash over card even though it's easier to just tap a card and go.

Banks are closing but cashpoints are still popping up and has to be within a certain distance like 3 miles or something or other, so that's still helpful.

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

I keep sufficient cash in my wallet to cover the debit card if it doesn't go through at the supermarket. Not being able to pay would be embarrassing and occasionally the banks have had a meltdown on debit cards.

The only cash transaction these days is to buy the daily paper at the newsagent.

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

You can get cashback from pretty much any supermarket, and many other shops as well.

I rarely use cash, I have about £80 in my wallet from last summer, it was £100 but I used £20 as a gift for someone at christmas.

Everything I buy is pretty much paid for by card, and/or gift card/voucher.

[ I get a lot of gift cards and vouchers at a discount, either via work, or Jam Doughnut ].

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

Well it's nice to hear that romance is still alive you ol' charmer. I hope the wife didn't squander your benevolence on herself. :D

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

She's saving it for his birthday :)

Yes thats 1 bad thing.. I like getting stuff and not have it able to be tracked by anyone!

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

My local chippy wants cash only

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

Without cash it would be possible for a controlling agency to stop someone from trading. It would be sold as a benefit e.g. someone sent to prison could only deal in prison scrip, link to age system could stop juniors buying products they shouldn't. But there would be no guarantee a future government would target "you".

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

All you have to do is look at what China has done and could do. Do you believe that couldn't be done here? Think about it.

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

I don't worry too much about tracking. I don't think the Government would be competent enough to amalgamate all this data, let alone do anything useful with it even if they did. It's going to be a lot of data all siloed off in different systems.

I find contactless extremely useful. I don't even use my card that much, just Apple Pay on my phone. It's quick and easy.

The biggest problem at the moment would be people who struggle to get bank accounts or are otherwise vulnerable and don't have access to a card. Homeless people and those with mental health problems.

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

Companies love people like you. You mainly use Apple Pay what do you think Apple does with that infomation now? Your buying habits are sold on to other companies, would it be that hard for the Government to get that information also?

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

Our Government ? :rofl:
They couldnt get it unless Apple printed it, and mailed it to them.
Even then, they'd probably file it in the wrong draw, and eventually lose it.

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

What do you think Apple does with that information?

Apple is not selling what you buy to third parties. Why would they? First of all, it would be a major scandal and breach of data protection laws for peanuts worth of money for a company like Apple. Especially since their privacy policy explicitly states they don't store it.

Secondly, the data is worth more for them to keep to themselves. Facebook and Google don't 'sell your data', they use it to sell advertising. If they sell your data they can only sell it once. However, if they sell access to your eyeballs because only THEY have the reach to advertise product X to demographic Y then they make a business the size of Google on that.

Finally, it's not even technically how Apple Pay works. They're just a conduit between your card, the payment-processing network, and your bank. When you pay for something that transaction isn't going via Apple's servers, it's going via Mastercard/Visa/Amex just like if you were to use a contactless card. If you go into Apple Wallet and look at the transactions they like that information is coming directly from your bank which is why it doesn't always work well.

And as for the Government getting that information. How specifically would they get it? Do they send a request to the bank for your transaction history? That would work but it won't scale. They would need to automate it. That means each bank, which will have different databases and store it all differently, would need to write code to upload transactions daily/weekly to the Government. The Government would need to write code to receive that information and then store what amounts to a HUGE amount of data.

That's quite an undertaking and it won't go unnoticed. (Theoretically GCHQ could put a tap on the payment networks themselves I guess).

If the Government suspects you of something they can get your transaction information but that's different from a national database of everyone's purchases.

Besides, as with all these things, if the Government ever takes an interest in you specifically then you're screwed anyway. Paying in cash and turning off location history on your phone isn't going to stump them.

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

I think you over estimate our Government/security services ;)

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

Yes but my guess is that many of these cashpoints charge a fee.

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

https://www.fca.org.uk/data/access-c...age-uk-2022-q2

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

I would think that people needing a cash point could travel that far :erm:

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

I've not lifted cash for a long time now. I've always used my debit card to pay in shops and spend my momey and continue to do so via my contact less card. Its just a lot simpler and easier. So is Google pay. Don't even need my wallet on me.

All that unnecessary weight of change jingling in my pocket. No need for that.

Also had online banking for over 23 years. Just makes life easier.

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

Bought a 70p scone from Thomas's today. Was in a dilemma whether it was a cheeky to pay by card, or use my emergency £10 note. I used the note and got lots of change. Not sure whether it was the right choice, been bothering me all day. Scone was good though.

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

More and more businesses would force you to pay by card for that 70p transaction and very recently, this happened to me, and for that very amount. I refused to pay by card and left the item on the counter, politely telling the lady behind the counter that I would never return. She said that if she had her way, she would have allowed payment in cash and she was happy to direct me to another shop which took cash. I mentioned it in the shop she directed me to, and the comment I received was "interesting..."

I wonder how much revenue and profit businesses which refuse cash are losing, both from the charges they pay for every card transaction to any actual reduction in people coming through the door.

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

I bagged up £320 worth of coins yesterday. All gathered during the pandemic. Santander will only let me deposit a couple of bags per day. So I may open an account with Metro as they allow you to deposit as many coins as you like, unbagged and straight into a sorting machine.

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

Usually it's only the ones outside newsagents and the stand alone ones. Real banks machines never charge.

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

My local shop refuses to allow you to pay with card unless the total is at least £2.00.

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

My local (literally next door) I can pay for any amount no matter how small (never tested how small but used for a £1 transaction) with card and I can get cash back if I need cash.

The shop at the top of the street must be £5 min transaction and no cash back.

Guess which is the busiest shop?

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

I use the self-service tills at Asda. Just throw in a handful of coins, they'll take what they need and give you the rest back.

Not £320 though. How the heck did you collect that during the pandemic?

Re: Cash and the cashless society
 

Notes only from cash machines, and then shops giving coin change, but not accepting it. It builds up quickly, so the total over 3 years is not that bad.

I wonder if the cost for them is too high to make it worthwhile if your total is low?