Ticket office closures
 

I'm also surprised that there seems to be no discussion on this issue - the highly contensious plans to effectively make ticket offices part of history in England.

More than 600,000 people responded to the consultation to close ticket offices in almost every England railway station, including some major stations such as Manchester Piccadilly and at least one London station.

They claim that this is about saving money and that ticket office staff will be redeployed onto the concourse but, like with banking, it is part of an overall ploy to force people to self serve or go online and as with banking, some will be unable to do so, for many different reasons.

Plus the closure of ticket offices will mean that many disabled people will no longer be able to access the railways for many different reasons.

What do people think of the plan to close almost every ticket office in England? Will it happen as planned and if it goes ahead, will it result in fewer people using the railway?

Re: Ticket office closures
 

I think people use certain methods of travel that makes the most sense.

I only ever use the train to go to London.

On the odd occasion I have used a local train/ local stations, there haven’t been any ticket offices anyway, not for years and years. You either use a machine on the platform, or you pay the conductor on the train.

I don’t think closing ticket offices is a major issue, as long as there is staff on site to assist those require assistance.

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A big if given their penchant for cost cutting measures.

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And in how many places are there going to be no staff outside of certain hours, and how many places have been like that for decades? Or are we expected to swallow the drivel from the unions AND the media.

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It is a little bizarre. You don't go to a ticket office to buy a bus or plane ticket - why should you for a train?

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Unless you’re boarding a driverless bus, every vehicle has a staffed ticket office. I used that ticket office to get into town only yesterday, because the ticketing options offered by both companies serving the route are so opaque it’s just quicker to ask the driver, and there is no cost-effective ‘any operator’ ticket for a simple return journey.

It’s also pretty much impossible to remove humans from the process of checking in for a flight because checked baggage has to go somewhere, so there will always have to be someone staffing check-in and taking money, even if only excess baggage charges.

Which pretty well illustrates the point - the systems require humans to make them work safely and effectively, and always will, no matter how seamless online ticketing becomes (and it is far from seamless on the railways). Even on the Glasgow subway there are an insane number of ticket options for a service that just goes round and round in circles through a mere 15 stops. You really do have to sit down with your calendar and a calculator to work out which one is more cost effective.

I visited a staffed ticket office at one of those 15 stops yesterday and had a nice chat with the man there in order to work out what to buy for our new student. It turns out you can charge up a Young Scot ID card with subway credit to spend on a per-journey basis, but you can’t charge it up with a season ticket, for which you either purchase a plastic card from the ticket man, or else go online and set up an account and get a free one with your photo on it - which clearly costs them more, so they are obviously very keen to push people online. One you have your subway photocard you can buy a weekly, monthly, six monthly or annual travel pass at the ticket office by presenting the card to charge it up … but if you want a 10-week season ticket (most useful to students) then oh, no, he can’t sell you that one, that’s online only. The whole thing is nuts, and while the pricing and incentives are obviously designed to push you to transact online, they are so opaque that perversely they also increase the likelihood that you’re going to want to actually ask a human employee for advice at some point.

Re: Ticket office closures
 

It worked for London's Tube network as there is a relatively simple pricing structure. This is not the case for National Rail so it's not a practical proposal as things stand.

Simplify the pricing structure and have staff on hand to assist customers in person or on the smaller stations via something like Facetime via a kiosk and there are genuine savings to be made. But not without doing the groundwork first or the reduced sales and confusion will outweigh the reduced costs.

Re: Ticket office closures
 

I havent bought a train ticket, or bus ticket, from a 'ticket office' for well over 20 years.

Not that use either very often, but when I do, I just book train tickets online.
Our Local buses (and Tram) all use contactless, tap on, tap off, for national buses, I also just book online.

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That's good, but online - and self service in general - doesn't work for everyone, and for a whole number of different reasons. Those who cannot self serve should not be left behind, as I fear will be the case should this happen.

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I can't see this proposal being taken forwards in its entirety judging by the unhappy responses from Conservative MPs.

Ticketing needs to be simplified and support for unmanned stations needs to be implemented before going down this route on the scale announced.

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What scale? How many stations are going to be completely unmanned?

Re: Ticket office closures
 

Unless Andrew works for the Rail Delivery Group, not sure why you are asking him?

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This is a good example of a mindset in this country where we, individually, decide we don't need or use something and so don't fight or complain when it goes. Good examples of this are corner shops, policemen on the beat, libraries, rural bus & train routes, playing fields, and so on.

However, they do have value and will be missed when they are gone. Older people who are not tech savvy, people who have sight issues and tourists that are unable to read English will all struggle to varying degrees. You then add the complex ticketing system we have to a machine that may not be user friendly, not to mention if they are broken, and it is clear you still need the human element.

This is all about the money, nothing else. Money that goes, ironically, in large part to a lot of nationalised EU rail companies :D

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Im not entirely sure this is the case here bearing in mind that more than 600,000 responded to the consultation.

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Tedious that people are constantly giving the false impression that each and every rail station if going to be completely unmanned 24/7.
The Rail Delivery Group will be the ones that know the levels and times of demand for anything.

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And I am sure they will be completely customer-focused in their outcomes…

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And you think that this number of people, whatever they said, will change the outcome in a material way? They might but I doubt it.

The only way to stop this happening is to change to a society that puts people ahead of shareholder profits. This means that ... Seph, look away now .. we should never vote the Conservative Party into power ever again.

Re: Ticket office closures
 

I don’t recollect things being hunky dory when it was nationalised.

It’s nothing to do with ‘shareholder profits’. More like part of the modernisation programme that will deliver that stash of cash to RMT members when the current railway disputes are finally over.

---------- Post added at 15:36 ---------- Previous post was at 15:34 ----------

Are they now?

Re: Ticket office closures
 

No, they don't get enough freedom to be that way at the moment.

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Good point :p:

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It’s not that good …

Re: Ticket office closures
 

As I’ve said earlier. I don’t know what magical part of the country we’re talking about where these ticket offices exist.

But up here in West Yorkshire (apart from Leeds and possibly a handful of other stations I don’t know about) there hasn’t been a ticket office for well over a decade, probably two.

As long as there is a guard on the train (and in that argument I am on the side of the Rail unions) then you don’t need ticket offices.

Re: Ticket office closures
 

Here are the proposed closures in West Yorkshire

Bingley
Bradford Forster Square
Cross Gates
Garforth
Guiseley
Halifax
Hebden Bridge
Horsforth
Ilkley
Keighley
Leeds Travel Centre
Menston
New Pudsey
Shipley
Todmorden
Wakefield Westgate

https://www.examinerlive.co.uk/news/...fices-27272127

Re: Ticket office closures
 

Useful, thank you.

Well, a sensible person would say. Keep Bradford & Wakefield. (& Leeds if that is actually Leeds Train Station)

None of those other stations need ticket offices, as long as the trains have guards.

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Didn't they want to get rid of guards too? Maybe also dispense with passengers, they make trains look scruffy and slow things down.

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What would the guards do, beside issue a fine if the passenger doesn’t have a ticket?

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They did, but as I have attested to in my recent posts on the subject I am against that and support guards on trains.

They can’t have it both ways, either have staff at every station……..no chance.


Or have a person + Driver, on every train. That has to be the model.

With major stations with offices.

---------- Post added at 22:12 ---------- Previous post was at 22:10 ----------

Help disabled people

Issue a ticket. Every train I got to Leeds I bought my ticket on the train from the guard.

General safety

I’m sure I could list more, but those three are reason enough.


Also, that very statement says to me, that you have not used a train on the regional network for a long time, if ever.

Otherwise, you wouldn’t have made that statement.

Re: Ticket office closures
 

And the Rail Delivery Group have done such a sterling job up to now #sarcasm

Re: Ticket office closures
 

I believe that all the Hampshire railway ticket offices are set to close under these proposals by South Western Railway (SWR). They claim to mitigate this by:

I would hazard a guess that over time, these staff would be cut to a point where the major stations would join the minor ones having no staff for most/all of the time.

You know there are still enough people in this country who are dumb enough to vote for the party that underwrites this. Welcome to Broken Britain but don't arrive by train :D

Re: Ticket office closures
 

I think you guess correctly - closing the ticket office but retaining staff to help with ticket purchasing only really makes sense if the idea is to teach people to rely on ticket machines, and online purchasing and timetables. And once they think the traveling public has been sufficiently educated they will withdraw those staff too.

Re: Ticket office closures
 

The issue here isn't about de-staffing of any stations. It's about the mass closure in England of ticket offices. I think that there are plans to reduce staffed hours at the edges at some stations although I'm not aware of any plans, right now, to fully de-staff any station.

Re: Ticket office closures
 

The issue absolutely about station de-staffing, for example:

https://www.hampshirechronicle.co.uk...ces-set-close/

As I mentioned above, this change allows the Rail companies to easily run down the station staffing numbers over time to improve their profits.

Re: Ticket office closures
 

Well I think it is, there again the last train I went on, was the cross channel and brought that ticket on line.

Re: Ticket office closures
 

I'm pretty sure the money will flow as savings to the government as the government now takes revenue risk. Train companies will not mind the reduction in revenue as it won't impact them.
This is all about the dead hand of government hiding behind private sector companies, some of whom are in fact subsidiaries of European rail operators.

Re: Ticket office closures
 

And, as if by magic:

https://www.ft.com/content/6096e55d-...b-cb5d1006c339

Re: Ticket office closures
 

Good as it was complete and utter idiocy if they had gone through with what they were planning.

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it will still happen, they'll just do slower, without fanfare, as they have been doing for years.

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Usual Tory carp. Threaten to take something away. Withdrew the threat making it as if they are giving you something back. *******s need booted out now.

Re: Ticket office closures
 

Be careful what you wish for. :erm:

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Indeed the country that gave us the catastrophic trolley for several years with all the disasters it entailed.;)

Re: Ticket office closures
 

Ummm, the rail companies were taking them away, not the government. :dozey:

Since you missed it ;

Re: Ticket office closures
 

Who privatised the railways in the first place? And what a success its been .....

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Totally irrelevant as usual.

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Rail delivery group runs the government agenda.

Re: Ticket office closures
 

Mr K and Paul are probably both right! Here's how the trade press reported it.

Two observations from reading the article:
- the proposals were mandated by government
- the requirements were to meet a "high threshold of serving passengers" although this criteria seems to be undefined
https://www.modernrailways.com/artic...-closure-plans

Re: Ticket office closures
 

I think that you're right, especially for those whose stations are operated by Avanti as Avanti wanted to close the ticket office at every station over which it has juristiction, including Manchester Piccadilly.