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-   -   Virgin Media price rises break the law (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/showthread.php?t=33712105)

Mr K 24-08-2023 08:07
Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/co...nsumer-advice/
Quote:
Virgin Media’s price rises ‘break the law’, says Which?

Virgin Media has been accused of unfairly increasing broadband prices for millions of customers in a move that has been condemned as “potentially unlawful”.

The consumer rights group Which? has accused the telecoms company of applying “aggressive” inflation-linked mid-contract price increases while making it difficult for customers to cancel their deal without paying high exit fees.

Ms Concha said: “While other providers use the consumer price index (CPI) to calculate inflation-linked mid-contract price rises, Virgin Media is the only major broadband firm which will use the RPI from next spring.

RPI is currently significantly higher than CPI. It lost its status as a national statistic in 2013 and has been heavily criticised as a measure of inflation.”

Which?’s complaint to Ofcom also highlighted a clause in Virgin Media’s terms and conditions which states that it can “change our charges at any time”, arguing that this could amount to an unfair contract term and be in breach of the Consumer Rights Act.

Virgin Media has rejected the claims, describing them as “baseless” and “a one-sided, selective and misinformed reading of widely used contractual terms”.

However, Rocio Concha of Which? said Virgin Media was “trying to have its cake and eat it” by passing on inflationary price rises to millions of its internet customers.

“Which? believes this is not only unacceptable but potentially unlawful and Ofcom [the telecoms regulator] must investigate urgently,” she said.

Virgin Media strongly rejected the claim that it was potentially breaking the law.

Telecoms companies are facing growing scrutiny over their contracts following sharp increases in both mobile and broadband charges this year. Customers of BT, Vodafone and Three faced a rise of 14.4pc in April.

Virgin Media cable customers faced an average increase of 13.8pc. Mobile and internet firms have defended the large increases, saying they have to cover rising costs and investment in their networks.

Virgin Media will implement an annual price rise next April based on retail price index (RPI) inflation plus 3.9 percentage points.
“We have no plans to increase monthly bills multiple times within the same year. If separate out-of-bundle charges are increased at any point, this would be clearly outlined and customers would receive a right to cancel.

“Our terms and conditions have been drafted in line with standard industry practice, consumer law and Ofcom guidelines.”

Ofcom said it would respond to the issues Which? had raised. The watchdog is already investigating Virgin Media following complaints from customers that the company had made it difficult for them to cancel their services.

Ofcom said some customers were struggling to get through to an agent on the phone, while other calls ended mid-way through or were put on hold for long periods.

A spokesman said: “We already have an enforcement programme open into whether telecoms firms have previously been complying with our rules, which state that mid-contract price rises must be set out clearly before customers sign up.

“We are also reviewing whether inflation-linked, mid-contract price rises give customers sufficient certainty and clarity about what they can expect to pay. We will report on both of these later this year.”
Does Ofcom have any teeth? VM are going to find out....

Hugh 24-08-2023 09:11
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
I’m shocked!

I really can’t believe this.

You read the Telegraph?

Mr K 24-08-2023 09:18
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 36159103)
I’m shocked!

I really can’t believe this.

You read the Telegraph?
Every day Hugh, its hilarious, especially readers demented comments :D

Peter729 24-08-2023 10:05
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Ofcom does have teeth, they will tell VM, in a stern voice, they are very naughty boys and not to do it again. ��

Once that’s done it will bring the matter to a close and everything will carry on as before

denphone 24-08-2023 10:40
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr K (Post 36159104)
Every day Hugh, its hilarious, especially readers demented comments :D
You must have snapped up a years subscription for not much more then a pint and a pie.;)

bbxxl 24-08-2023 13:25
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
I have a fixed price contract so never had price increases until I renewed- at least until this year. I’m now on Volt and have to have an O2 SIM which I don’t want and they put their prices up by over 17% this year, when it was Virgin Mobile it was included in my contract price so no in contract rise. The change to O2 really is a con.

Inactive Digital 24-08-2023 14:53
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
There's a difference between what's legally acceptable and what's morally acceptable.

Vague 'Inflation+' terms in contracts might be a valid term in a contract but, on a moral footing, ultimately leaves customers not knowing how much they will pay over the term of their agreement. As I type this, I have no idea how much per month I will be paying VM come next April in pounds and pence. In my eyes, that's morally wrong (even though I accepted the contract anyway!). But with most major competitors doing similar, there are few alternatives.

denphone 24-08-2023 14:55
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Some serious thinking to do early next year when our 18 month contract ends.

jfman 24-08-2023 17:38
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
I don’t really see what the drama is. The problem is inflation, not that companies put conditions in contracts.

If inflation was actually at the BoE target few would really be griping about £5-6 a month price rises. It’s been fairly run of the mill to have rises in that ballpark for decades for a Sky + Sky premiums + broadband package.

Mr K 24-08-2023 17:59
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfman (Post 36159135)
I don’t really see what the drama is. The problem is inflation, not that companies put conditions in contracts.

If inflation was actually at the BoE target few would really be griping about £5-6 a month price rises. It’s been fairly run of the mill to have rises in that ballpark for decades for a Sky + Sky premiums + broadband package.
VM are using RPI, the higher less accurate inflation measure( rather than the more accurate CPI), plus 3.9% for some reason. Are their costs going up higher than inflation? Customers are being asked to sign contracts with no idea what they will pay in future.
Even Mr Turpin wore a mask. Ofcom never caught up with him either....

Peter729 24-08-2023 18:01
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr K (Post 36159138)
VM are using RPI, the higher less accurate inflation measure( rather than the more accurate CPI), plus 3.9% for some reason. Are their costs going up higher than inflation? Customers are being asked to sign contracts with no idea what they will pay in future.
Even Mr Turpin wore a mask. Ofcom never caught up with him either....
To Ofcoms credit they are still looking for Turpin.

jfman 24-08-2023 18:03
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr K (Post 36159138)
VM are using RPI, the higher less accurate inflation measure( rather than the more accurate CPI), plus 3.9% for some reason. Are their costs going up higher than inflation? Customers are being asked to sign contracts with no idea what they will pay in future.
Even Mr Turpin wore a mask. Ofcom never caught up with him either....
RPI is by far the more accurate measure of inflation in the real world as experienced by the population at large.

CPI is selective to provide a lower value by excluding certain things - housing costs for example.

Mr K 24-08-2023 18:15
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfman (Post 36159140)
RPI is by far the more accurate measure of inflation in the real world as experienced by the population at large.

CPI is selective to provide a lower value by excluding certain things - housing costs for example.
Quote:
Look on the ONS site and you will see that it really isn’t mad for the RPI. It lost its status as a national statistic back in 2013 and the latest release on the matter is pretty clear that it is considered “a very poor measure of general inflation at times greatly over estimating and at other times underestimating changes in prices and how these prices are experienced
https://moneyweek.com/merryns-blog/t...-matters-55018

Other providers are using CPI. And where does the plus 3.9% come from? Are they laying thousands of miles of new cable? Or is it to make up for the customers they are shedding? Or is dare I say, corporate greed, and a weak regulator?

jfman 24-08-2023 18:29
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr K (Post 36159143)
https://moneyweek.com/merryns-blog/t...-matters-55018

Other providers are using CPI. And where does the plus 3.9% come from? Are they laying thousands of miles of new cable? Or is it to make up for the customers they are shedding? Or is dare I say, corporate greed, and a weak regulator?
I know the difference between RPI and CPI I don't need a link to tell me.

While I agree the telecoms market is poorly regulated I don't really see what the injustice is in Virgin Media including a clause for a price rise linked to (although above by a fixed rate) inflation. BT pull the exact same 3.9% from thin air.

People in this country are getting poorer because of Government incompetence, not because broadband companies fudge their price rises.

Lest we forget if we regulate them all we will simply pay higher prices sooner since they will all want/need that fixed return.

The Government wants (indeed needs) Virgin Media O2 and Openreach to hit their rollout figures otherwise their own aspirations for full fibre are down the pan.

Pierre 24-08-2023 22:23
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inactive Digital (Post 36159122)
There's a difference between what's legally acceptable and what's morally acceptable.
:scratch: :scratch: :scratch: :scratch:

Not on this site, there isn’t.

Skie 26-08-2023 22:02
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
If you agree to pay £50 a month for 24 months, it should be £50 a month for 24 months. The RPI/CPI + arbitrary percentage doesn't give you any level of certainty about what you'll be paying in 18 months time, whereas it gives the provider a lot of certainty. It's not a fair contract. Now that everyone is doing it, it's not even avoidable, which adds more unfairness.

Hopefully Ofcom change the rules. Providers pay for a lot of their things via multi-year contracts too, so it's not like they can't be certain about their own costs for 24 months.

jfman 27-08-2023 13:38
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Once Ofcom change the rules look out for the 5-10% “just in case” tax going onto the prices next time it comes to renewing. There’s almost zero chance of such a regulatory change actually benefitting consumers.

Mr K 27-08-2023 16:23
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfman (Post 36159314)
Once Ofcom change the rules look out for the 5-10% “just in case” tax going onto the prices next time it comes to renewing. There’s almost zero chance of such a regulatory change actually benefitting consumers.
As long as choice and increased competition remain then that will control prices. VMs unfair rules are designed to tie customers in whatever the unknown rise and stop choice/cancellation.
You'd hope Ofcom would be strong enough to make the current contracts null and void - I somehow doubt it.

jfman 27-08-2023 16:30
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr K (Post 36159321)
As long as choice and increased competition remain then that will control prices. VMs unfair rules are designed to tie customers in whatever the unknown rise and stop choice/cancellation.
You'd hope Ofcom would be strong enough to make the current contracts null and void - I somehow doubt it.
Increased competition doesn’t stop them putting these clauses in. There’s no reason to anticipate it’d stop pricing in a premium as a consequence.

Itshim 27-08-2023 18:53
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfman (Post 36159322)
Increased competition doesn’t stop them putting these clauses in. There’s no reason to anticipate it’d stop pricing in a premium as a consequence.
Did anyone hold a gun to anyones head , it's not as if people didn't understand stand what they signed up to. Just walked away from a long term supplier because of a price increase. Told him so, offered to reverse the charge but he can take a running jump .:erm:

Hugh 27-08-2023 19:04
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
However, some of us have the challenge that VM has no comparable competition (speed wise) in our area - I can get around 47Mb form non-VM Telcos at the moment, with no forecast date for fibre

From the OpenReach site

Quote:
Build planned between now and Dec-2026

Mr K 27-08-2023 20:58
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 36159324)
However, some of us have the challenge that VM has no comparable competition (speed wise) in our area - I can get around 47Mb form non-VM Telcos at the moment, with no forecast date for fibre

From the OpenReach site
10mb used to be considered good enough for most things, and it is.

bbxxl 27-08-2023 21:06
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
The property I am looking to buy has maximum of 11, should be 5-8 and a guaranteed minimum of 3.
That’s not useable to work from home.
Luckily I’ve just found I can get Skylink which should give me useable speeds.

Pierre 27-08-2023 21:27
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 36159324)
However, some of us have the challenge that VM has no comparable competition (speed wise) in our area
That’s like complaining that I only have choice between garages that sell Aston Martin’s and Ford Fiesta’s.

I demand there are also Ferrari and Lamborghini garages here too.

At least you have that choice. Just Fiesta’s and Lada’s for me.

Mr K 27-08-2023 21:31
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 36159333)
That’s like complaining that I only have choice between garages that sell Aston Martin’s and Ford Fiesta’s.

I demand there are also Ferrari and Lamborghini garages here too.

At least you have that choice. Just Fiesta’s and Lada’s for me.
Fiesta, every time.

Paul 28-08-2023 01:39
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 36159324)
However, some of us have the challenge that VM has no comparable competition (speed wise) in our area - I can get around 47Mb form non-VM Telcos at the moment, with no forecast date for fibre

From the OpenReach site
Quote:
Build planned between now and Dec-2026
It said that for my area, then FTTP suddenly arrived last summer.

Jaymoss 28-08-2023 08:04
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul (Post 36159339)
It said that for my area, then FTTP suddenly arrived last summer.
Says the same but was hoping for it before Feb but I doubt it now. Will have to try to haggle hard with VM for a deal that covers 2 April price hikes

Hugh 28-08-2023 09:40
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr K (Post 36159328)
10mb used to be considered good enough for most things, and it is.
Black & white TV used to be considered good enough for most things, but life/technology moves on…

You’re turning into the dude (no, not The Big Lebowski…).

bbxxl 28-08-2023 09:54
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr K (Post 36159328)
10mb used to be considered good enough for most things, and it is.
My first modem was 2400 Baud down and 300 up. It worked but I wouldn’t recommend it now. It only cost £799 but data charges were excessive.

Mr K 28-08-2023 10:01
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 36159350)
Black & white TV used to be considered good enough for most things, but life/technology moves on…

You’re turning into the dude (no, not The Big Lebowski…).
10mb is more than good enough to stream HDTV , it used to be the top tier
https://forums.digitalspy.com/discus...-years-gone-by
not sure Dude would be impressed though ;)

Hugh 28-08-2023 10:23
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr K (Post 36159354)
10mb is more than good enough to stream HDTV , it used to be the top tier
https://forums.digitalspy.com/discus...-years-gone-by
not sure Dude would be impressed though ;)
Unfortunately, not for 4K…

https://www.cable.co.uk/broadband/gu...0for%20example).

Quote:
for 4K UHD you'll need 25Mbps minimum, but we recommend a connection of 50Mbps to cover all scenarios (live 4K broadcasts require more speed, for example
Quote:
For 4K streaming across all these services pay special notice to the word ‘minimum’. Depending on what is going on on the screen at any given time, the amount of speed you require will go up and down – these minimums, then, do not guarantee you a 4K UHD stream 100% of the time and will drop in resolution when things get busy. To guarantee a true 4K stream across any service you should take the minimum and add 25% to those requirements.
If you have two people streaming different 4K programmes, and anyone else in the house gaming/downloading/YouTubing/etc, 10Mb/s isn’t going to be a valid option…

Mr K 28-08-2023 11:04
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Well I don't have a 4k tv and I don't game. So maybe I'm an outlier? ;) Suspect many just still use the interweb for browsing. Speed these days is just a marketing gimmick that benefits few. Reliability is everything.

Anyway back to VM and breaking the law over its new contracts. It's also the cancellation run around they are giving anyone cheeky enough to try and cancel.

https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/ne...e-difficultie/

VM could get fined, and ordered to pay compensation if Ofcom get their finger out. It's as much a test of Ofcom as VM, bet both come up short

bbxxl 28-08-2023 11:14
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr K (Post 36159354)
10mb is more than good enough to stream HDTV , it used to be the top tier
https://forums.digitalspy.com/discus...-years-gone-by
not sure Dude would be impressed though ;)
256k used to be top tier When ADSL first came out, before that I had 64K ISDN.
Your point is?

Mr K 28-08-2023 11:22
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbxxl (Post 36159362)
256k used to be top tier When ADSL first came out, before that I had 64K ISDN.
Your point is?
My point is 10mb is good enough to steam HDTV which is the most I ever ask of my BB.

bbxxl 28-08-2023 11:44
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr K (Post 36159364)
My point is 10mb is good enough to steam HDTV which is the most I ever ask of my BB.
That’s all you ask, but you probably said the same about SD to and other lesser things before that.
The world moves on. You don’t have to if you don’t want to.

Pierre 28-08-2023 16:53
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr K (Post 36159364)
My point is 10mb is good enough to steam HDTV which is the most I ever ask of my BB.
It’s horses for courses.

We get 30Mb, if it’s blowing the right way, can go down 15Mb, and we get about 6Mb up.

That drives, At any one time, 3 iPads, a meta-quest/ PS4 / computer depending what he’s on and a TV streaming HD.

And it can just about cope with it all, but my eldest will complain that it’s laggy.

Also downloading an update on the PS4 can take multiple hours (sometimes 6-8)

I’d be over the moon with 100Mb symmetrical. I don’t know what the lowest tier would be on full fibre, but if they offered that, that’s all I’d want.

Paul 28-08-2023 17:46
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 36159390)
I’d be over the moon with 100Mb symmetrical. I don’t know what the lowest tier would be on full fibre, but if they offered that, that’s all I’d want.
Full fibre (at least from openreach) is not symmetrical.

The fastest is generally around 900/100.

My TalkTalk was 150/25, and my current is 300/45.

Other common offerings are around 75/15, 500/70 & 900/100.

Pierre 28-08-2023 19:36
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul (Post 36159394)
Full fibre (at least from openreach) is not symmetrical.

The fastest is generally around 900/100.

My TalkTalk was 150/25, and my current is 300/45.

Other common offerings are around 75/15, 500/70 & 900/100.
Well that’s not really much better than DOCSIS.

I suppose I’ll have to hope some come into my area with XGS.

HughA 29-08-2023 17:46
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Some non Openreach ISPs provide symmetrical fibre services. In my area LIT Fibre offer symmetrical connections from 100/100 to 1000/1000 at competitive prices.

Rillington 09-09-2023 19:19
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr K (Post 36159321)
As long as choice and increased competition remain then that will control prices. VMs unfair rules are designed to tie customers in whatever the unknown rise and stop choice/cancellation.
You'd hope Ofcom would be strong enough to make the current contracts null and void - I somehow doubt it.
Sadly this doesn't seem to happen these days as most businesses operate like a cartel - one increases prices and the other follow suit, and mid-contract price increases is a perfect example of this.

I thought that regulators were there to protect customers from this type of behaviour but you do get the impression this is not the case with Ofcom which lets the industries which it is supposed to regulate do whatever they want, regardless of the harm caused to the customer. Therefore, I have to conclude that, as you have said, Mr K, Ofcom won't do anything to stop this practice.

Dude111 10-09-2023 01:49
Quote:
Virgin Media has been accused of unfairly increasing broadband prices for millions of customers in a move that has been condemned as “potentially unlawful”.
Yea while quality goes downhill!!

People need to fight this and not sit there!!

Peter729 10-09-2023 10:00
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dude111 (Post 36159906)
Yea while quality goes downhill!!

People need to fight this and not sit there!!
I simply went elsewhere.

bbxxl 10-09-2023 10:39
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dude111 (Post 36159906)
Yea while quality goes downhill!!

People need to fight this and not sit there!!
I’ve been with Virgin for the past 16 years as they were the only provider of fast internet.
Open reach have just come to my road so they will now have competition.
Pity I’m just moving to an area with no virgin or open reach.

Paul 10-09-2023 16:18
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
I'm almost certainly going to leave VM when my next renewal is up.

I now have nothing else from them other than 1G BB (TV dropped 18 months ago, Phone dropped 2 months ago). Having tested FTTP for the last few months, its working just fine, plus I now have a proper static IP (VM are not officially static, they do rarely change). I can get 900+M for less than VMs 1G service (and on shorter contracts, and no web site blocking) and in reality, the difference is pretty small (in fact, on my current router, no difference at all since it struggles above 750M).

The main thing that has kept me with them is my wifes email address, but we have begun moving her off that onto a none ISP linked address.
I basically stopped using mine a few years ago.

Skie 10-09-2023 19:19
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul (Post 36159918)
The main thing that has kept me with them is my wifes email address, but we have begun moving her off that onto a none ISP linked address.
I basically stopped using mine a few years ago.
So I left almost 2 years ago now and my email is still working :) (we did transition away anyway, but I still see the VM email spam filter being as useless as ever)

Paul 11-09-2023 13:45
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skie (Post 36159919)
So I left almost 2 years ago now and my email is still working :) (we did transition away anyway, but I still see the VM email spam filter being as useless as ever)
Interesting to know, but I would not like to rely on that happening. :)

Rillington 12-09-2023 18:39
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul (Post 36159918)
I'm almost certainly going to leave VM when my next renewal is up.

I now have nothing else from them other than 1G BB (TV dropped 18 months ago, Phone dropped 2 months ago). Having tested FTTP for the last few months, its working just fine, plus I now have a proper static IP (VM are not officially static, they do rarely change). I can get 900+M for less than VMs 1G service (and on shorter contracts, and no web site blocking) and in reality, the difference is pretty small (in fact, on my current router, no difference at all since it struggles above 750M).

The main thing that has kept me with them is my wifes email address, but we have begun moving her off that onto a none ISP linked address.
I basically stopped using mine a few years ago.
Iirc their most recent figures did see a net reduction in customers for VM and maybe the next set of figures will see these losses accelerate when more and more customers realise exactly what they are locking themselves into with the current Virgin Media contract.

And like you, I'm almost certainly going to leave them as well and the main reason is the contract.

Hugh 12-09-2023 20:13
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rillington (Post 36159945)
Iirc their most recent figures did see a net reduction in customers for VM and maybe the next set of figures will see these losses accelerate when more and more customers realise exactly what they are locking themselves into with the current Virgin Media contract.

And like you, I'm almost certainly going to leave them as well and the main reason is the contract.
Broadband down by 15.3k customers, out of 5,700k, so a loss of around 0.27%.

https://news.virginmediao2.co.uk/wp-...ographic-5.pdf

Previous quarter broadband was up by 28.8k customers.

https://news.virginmediao2.co.uk/wp-...nfographic.pdf

Mr K 12-09-2023 20:58
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 36159953)
Broadband down by 15.3k customers, out of 5,700k, so a loss of around 0.27%.

https://news.virginmediao2.co.uk/wp-...ographic-5.pdf

Previous quarter broadband was up by 28.8k customers.

https://news.virginmediao2.co.uk/wp-...nfographic.pdf
Meanwhile fibre broadband has gained a million customers over the last year. https://www.computerweekly.com/news/...-fibre-network

VM have become complacent and greedy. It's already backfiring.

bbxxl 13-09-2023 18:54
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Just received the email from Virgin.
Basically. We are going to screw you but you can cancel by 31/10/23 with no get out fee but we know most people won’t have to option to.

Rillington 13-09-2023 21:23
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
How so, in your case?

Thank you for those figures Huw, and i think the read of significance will be the forthcoming quarter as this will reflect the reality of the new contracts which is why I am seriously considering leaving, and judging by posts Ive read here their new contracts could end up costing them more customers than they had expected.

Hugh 13-09-2023 21:24
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rillington (Post 36160009)
How so, in your case?

Thank you for those figures Huw, and i think the read of significance will be the forthcoming quarter as this will reflect the reality of the new contracts which is why I am seriously considering leaving, and judging by posts Ive read here their new contracts could end up costing them more customers than they had expected.
Have to agree with you - I’m awaiting fibre competition in the area so I can cost my options

Gavin-D 14-09-2023 16:38
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Just had an email from VM reminding me of the changes to the price rises from 2024 they are also offering the chance to leave penalty free until October 31st

Media Boy UK 27-11-2023 19:39
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
II think Virgin Media UK prices may go up by 12.8% in 2024

Base on Virgin Media UK on their rule of RPI and add Virgin's + 3.9% price rises:

I feel the Virgin Media UK's prices are set to go up by 10% to 12.8%.

*September 2023 RPI was 12.8% (When you add on both RPI and Virgin's + 3.9%)
*October 2023 RPI was 10% (When you add on both RPI and Virgin's + 3.9%)

TimeLord2018 27-11-2023 20:03
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
It's decided by January RPI rate.
https://www.virginmedia.com/help/prices

Media Boy UK 27-11-2023 21:09
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
I did think it was set by September or October RPI rates.

Dude111 28-11-2023 13:29
If they give you a price on a contract,THEY CANNOT CHANGE IT....Am I wrong??

Peter729 28-11-2023 13:53
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dude111 (Post 36165262)
If they give you a price on a contract,THEY CANNOT CHANGE IT....Am I wrong??
Unfortunately Yes, the current VM contract price is not fixed for the term of the contract, there is a clause in the contract that allows for price increases.

Itshim 28-11-2023 17:16
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter729 (Post 36165266)
Unfortunately Yes, the current VM contract price is not fixed for the term of the contract, there is a clause in the contract that allows for price increases.
Pity we can't do the reverse :D

Gavin-D 12-12-2023 09:03
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Ofcom has announced that Phone, TV and broadband customers must be told about mid-contract price rises at the point of sale and "in pounds and pence" and not based on inflation.

Inactive Digital 12-12-2023 11:24
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gavin-D (Post 36166410)
Ofcom has announced that Phone, TV and broadband customers must be told about mid-contract price rises at the point of sale and "in pounds and pence" and not based on inflation.
It's at consultation stage, and I'm sure the telcos will robustly defend maintaining the status quo.
Personally, I'd welcome this change (second to no mid-term rises allowed at all).

Chris 12-12-2023 11:35
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inactive Digital (Post 36166415)
It's at consultation stage, and I'm sure the telcos will robustly defend maintaining the status quo.
Personally, I'd welcome this change (second to no mid-term rises allowed at all).
They’ll squeal alright - quoting in percentages has allowed them to get away with inflation PLUS another 3 or 4% every year without anyone seriously questioning it (3 or 4% sounds like a very tiny amount, certainly less than the £1 or £2 a month it might actually be). It also puts all the future financial risk on the customer. An equitable fixed term contract ought to share the risk (the customer is tied in but the supplier is committed to the price). So they won’t want to see the end of that.

However, Ofcom’s statement this morning is unequivocal. If they had meant to leave room to back down they would have done so.

Inactive Digital 12-12-2023 12:17
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris (Post 36166418)
They’ll squeal alright - quoting in percentages has allowed them to get away with inflation PLUS another 3 or 4% every year without anyone seriously questioning it (3 or 4% sounds like a very tiny amount, certainly less than the £1 or £2 a month it might actually be). It also puts all the future financial risk on the customer. An equitable fixed term contract ought to share the risk (the customer is tied in but the supplier is committed to the price). So they won’t want to see the end of that.

However, Ofcom’s statement this morning is unequivocal. If they had meant to leave room to back down they would have done so.
I couldn't agree more. It isn't a fair term that, as customers bound in contracts, we do not know in pounds and pence how much we will be paying for our services in just four months' time.

So, assuming this goes through, how will the telcos try to counter it? A flat 10%, 15%, 20% extra each year..? It seems to me likely they will all congregate around a similar figure, the same way they did (by and large) around the inflation +3.9% figure.

Chris 12-12-2023 12:30
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
My guess is that they will make a long term assumption that a 5% increase will, most years, yield them an above-inflation uplift. That amounts to 50p per £10 monthly payment, so after year one on a £30/month contract they would have to say the price was going up by £1.50, so £31.50 in year 2. After that if they stick with the percentage they would be lifting it by £1.60 (rounded up) to £33.10. For ease of marketing they might just say £1.50 a year.

Pierre 12-12-2023 13:04
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Telcos are feeling the squeeze. The COVID years were salad days.

A lot of people has more disposal income and people working from home needed fatter, faster and better broadband.

But COVID ending and inflation arrived.

In a 180, speed of light turn. Suddenly people are saving money, cancelling subscriptions, choosing lower tariffs, Keeping older phones etc. Switching to Altnets.

VMO2 have taken a massive hit to their Cashflow, as I'm sure every other telco has.

Hugh 12-12-2023 13:25
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 36166425)
Telcos are feeling the squeeze. The COVID years were salad days.

A lot of people has more disposal income and people working from home needed fatter, faster and better broadband.

But COVID ending and inflation arrived.

In a 180, speed of light turn. Suddenly people are saving money, cancelling subscriptions, choosing lower tariffs, Keeping older phones etc. Switching to Altnets.

VMO2 have taken a massive hit to their Cashflow, as I'm sure every other telco has.
Yup…

Just had an email from VM offering an upgrade from 250Mb to 350Mb for £3 per month extra.

(not taking it - 250Mb is enough for for the two of us (and it’s only that because of Volt/O2 have upped it from 125Mb))

Joedm45 12-12-2023 15:12
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Could we see the return of 12 month contracts?

This is your price per month for a year, renegotiate thereafter but likely you'll pay more instead of getting it cheaper like some do when renewing.

Yes, people will hop providers every year if they really want to save a few quid but some will not want the hassle for the sake of £1 or £2 a month

TimeLord2018 12-11-2024 11:51
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
New price increase model announced
https://www.cordbusters.co.uk/virgin...ice-increases/

bbxxl 12-11-2024 12:54
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Since I moved house 6 months ago, I’ve not been able to get Virgin so now pay £25/month for 900Mb up and downstream and £10/month for my telephone (all calls included.
I use ROKU for TV so not as convenient but has the vast majority of what I want.
My broadband/telephone contract has no price rise for the 2 year contract.
I don’t miss Virgin as much as I thought I might and am saving a lot.

Jaymoss 12-11-2024 13:04
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
I am looking forward to dumping VM next April no matter what they offer me this time. Do not want another contract. I have a long term fixed Openreach supplied deal and FTTP is rolling out in my area. Bye Bye VM at last

bbxxl 12-11-2024 13:34
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
I would check your other options. Plenty of synchronous providers - Openreach isn’t one of them (yet, they are trialling in small areas, I believe).
Check https://bidb.uk/ for your options.

RichardCoulter 12-11-2024 17:11
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TimeLord2018 (Post 36185862)
At £3.50 a month, because inflation remains low, Virgin are to increase prices more than any other provider at a rate higher than under the old scheme.

This must be why they are currently proactively contacting customers to extend their contracts, so that they cannot leave without paying about 95% of the remaining contract.

Paul 12-11-2024 21:12
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
While £3.50 may be fixed, it also seems a lot, esp on lower priced broadband.

Still, I'm kicking them into touch soon anyway, a new customer pays £27 a month less than me (for 18 months). Scamming bar stewards.

Peter729 12-11-2024 21:22
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul (Post 36185910)
While £3.50 may be fixed, it also seems a lot, esp on lower priced broadband.

Still, I'm kicking them into touch soon anyway, a new customer pays £27 a month less than me (for 18 months). Scamming bar stewards.
Virgins definition of loyalty is

MUG

RichardCoulter 18-11-2024 15:08
Re: Virgin Media price rises break the law
 
The way in which Virgin increase their prices was covered in today's Rip-Off Britain:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m00255zm


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