New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Hi all, just looking some people's opinions on a new set up. I have always run with VM standard setup (Superhub running as WiFi router.) But I've got a new router and a new Cat-8 network cable.

My question is, when I change my VM router to a Modem and connect to the new router will I get better speed with the new Cat-8 network cable or should I stick with the Cat-6 that I have.

I'm hopping to do speed tests at each point just to see.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

you won't notice any different whatsoever and it will be a very long time until you do. I don't know what the cost of cat8 cable is but even if it is 10p I wouldn't recommend buying anymore. I like having the latest stuff for novelty but there is such a thing as overkill.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

A few years ago I put in loads of CAT6 cables around the house as it was the latest at the time.

I would if relaying buy the latest version.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Yup, cat6 has defo outlived its usefulness. We are past the need of 10gbits/sec and need 40 pronto. You must have one hell of a router with a stonking fiber internet connection.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

You may have missed off the sarcasm emoji there, mon General...

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Yes I was left scratching my head about this, I even googled cat 6 Vs cat 8 to make sure I read it right when General said he wouldn't buy anymore of it.

What I found out was cat 8 is faster but it is for alot shorter distance.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Hands up if your router and all the devices on your lan can do 10gbits/sec. No? Well cat6 is more than sufficient and you defo dont need cat8.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

I didn't know Cat 8 existed until i read this post lol.

I thought Cat 7 was still the thing.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

This helps explain some of the differences between cable categories.

https://www.cablesandkits.com/learni...thernet-cables

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

If you're running cables between rooms/walls/etc. it does make sense to consider running a better grade of cable than you currently need. That said, CAT6 is sufficient for 10Gbit and most home networking equipment still lacks that. It'll be many years before we need anything beyond CAT6 in the home.

CAT8 is really only if you plan to run 25Gbps+ stuff and that's not going to be in the consumer space for many, many years. If the price difference was a few pence then maybe? But almost certainly not required.

If it's cables between devices today, then CAT8 is absolutely overkill and makes zero difference. The HUB won't negotiate anything higher than 1gbps. Even consumer stuff isn't really going beyond 2.5Gbps (or 5gbps if you're lucky, 10gbps if you're very lucky) and CAT6 is still fine for that.

In short: Anything above CAT6 won't net you any benefit today.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Thanks all,

For just a wee update the cat 8 cable going from Modem to new router wouldn't work. Cat6 worked fine as expected. Cat8 cable code a few pound but it made for a nice test.

I'm going to runs some speed tests with cat6 & 8 from router to laptop.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Have fun wasting time

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

CAT8 differs electrically to balanced UTP and requires shielded terminations to work properly.

The primary use as it stands is that it offers SMEs who wish to stand up small data centres or comms rooms a cheaper alternative to multimode fibre.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Loving it

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Where are these blistering speed test results? I can't wait to see what 40tb/sec looks like

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

First thing I have discovered is I'm not getting my normal speed when in Modem mode.

Think it's time for a CS call

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

There's no reason why modem mode should reduce your speeds.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

He's a troll and this whole thread is a wind up.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

OMG I can't believe it :Yikes: To satisfy my curiosity I bought some Cat 8 so I could do my own test and see if there was any difference. I did before with cat 5e and after with cat 8. Everyone needs to get cat 8 for symmetrical 40gbits rfn. The upload is a bit off though and if it doesn't improve I am ringing customer services.

https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2020/07/2.png

https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2020/07/3.jpg

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

After speaking to the family about the BB before the install of the new router it was slow before.

So it looks like ive had slow BB for some time. ��

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Another ominous response. Are we supposed to guess what speeds you get in router mode and modem mode or we just staying with the ambiguous "slow"?

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

I should be getting 5oomb I haven't got above 300mb in any configuration. 🤦*♂️

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

What speed do you get if you connect directly via Cat6 to the Hub?

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Have you looked at the router config and checked to make sure you have been provisioned for 500mbits when you upgraded to the oomph bundle?


Your upstream will be the same as mine however your downstream will be a lot higher. I think it is provisioned at something like 575mbits so you should see 575000000.


and have you been doing the tests wired on a pc or wireless on a phone or old laptop?

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

The same, today when Tec support bead out we got 47mb to 140 something, but not 500 and not the guaranteed 258mb

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

This is what I got...and thanks for you support 😉

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

thanks for the screen shot, can you do the same for the upstream and downstream tabs so we can have a look at your power levels. Can you also setup a TBB graph which monitors your connection. It will show us whether you have just got a slow connection due to something like congestion or if packet loss is causing it. The graph will look like this:



It is easy to setup, click this link. All of this information is helpful and will assist the tech in diagnosing the fault if they are uncertain as to the cause.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Ok I've carated an account and set up and setup a monitor, hope this helps.

Sorry to ask but how long would you leave it?

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

The graph populates in real time and needs 24 hours for a full cycle. If you go back and check it now you'll see you have got about 2 hours worth on the right hand side. You can post it tomorrow evening once you have had a full day and we'll be able to immediately see if there is an issue. We still need the power levels and snr from your downstream and upstream tab, they look like this:




I am just here to get the ball rolling. There are more tech savvy peeps on here than me and there are also VM techs that are members of the forum. The sooner you get the info posted the better and then they can chip in and offer advice.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

I don't know but this doesn't look good

https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2020/07/4.png

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Upload and Download

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

If you are using your new router you need to go into the gui, look at the firewall settings and allow it to respond to icmp echo requests (pings). Make sure you have got the correct VM ip address setup for it in TBB as well.

Your power levels are within spec and fine. If you scroll down in the downstream tab have you got any post-rs errors or is it clean?

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Think I've fixed the firewall, I'll see in the morning.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Your rs errors are mint as well. The plot thickens......

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Overnight. Think this is live one ��

https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2020/07/5.png

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Can we go back to basics, please?

What kit are you testing the speed on (old laptop, new laptop, PC, etc., and is the NIC capable of 100Mb/s+?), what browser are you using, etc.

Is anyone else in the house doing anything on the internet at the same time (streaming, gaming, downloading)?

You need to set up a base testing environment - so no one else using the VM internet (everybody’s devices disconnected from vm WiFi), run a couple of different speed tests, and post the results back here.

It’s difficult to help without full info.

https://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest

http://www.speedtest.net/

http://www.broadbandperformance.co.uk/

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Make sure speedtests are done wired too.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

When testing speed I and the VM Tec used the following setup.

VM router set to router mode, high specification laptop connected with cat6 cable. Nothing else connected via cable or wirelessly. Browsers used chrome and edge. Website speed tests speedtest.net and fast.com

Ps. Network card is a gigabit card

---------- Post added at 10:01 ---------- Previous post was at 09:58 ----------

Might VM have to pull new cable from the cab to the house?

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

No, if there was a damaged cable somewhere you would see evidence of it in the post rs-errors I asked you about. Your graph is mint btw as is all the other information you have provided. At the moment it doesn't look like there is technically anything wrong so there is either something higher up the VM network causing an issue (e.g. congestion issue) or something else is running on your network sucking up the bandwidth or secret option No. 3.
If there was an area/congestion issue it is highly likely VM were aware of if and even if it has not yet hit the thresholds for raising a ticket the guy on the phone and the tech who came round to your house would be aware of it so that rules that one out. Secondly, we take you at your word that you are running the speed tests as we have suggested and there aren't any other devices connected to your network and hammering it in the background. If that was the case your graph would like mine.

So time for secret option No 3. Laptops are really bizarre and have peculiar settings hidden all over the place (e.g. power saving modes) which affect the performance of NICs. To satisfy my curiosity have you or anyone else in your house got anything else you can run a speed test on like a relatively new android phone? 2-3 years old should be fine. Speedtest.net have a mobile app which you can download from the Play store and it will look like this:


We wouldn't normally condone running wireless tests because they bring a whole new set of variables with them but in this case it will be worth it. I have a sneaky suspicion.....

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Samsung s7 edge
https://www.speedtest.net/my-result/a/6299849975

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

I can get my full 220mbit download on my Samsung S7, while in the same room as the Hub3.

Maybe you're on a congested wifi channel.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

He said he ran the previous speed tests on the laptop using a wired connection. The wireless test is delivering the same result as the laptop and it is a different device using a different different connection method. I wanted him to do that specifically because I was really hoping that it was just a dodgy windows settings on oem app which was screwing up the nic on the laptop. I have been proved wrong :)

When is your second tech visit? When he comes round can you ask him if it is possible (if he has a gadget) that can do a speed test from VM's end to your connection in the cabinet and if that is ok, from the cabinet to where the cable terminates on the outside of your house. I know they can do it to check the power levels coming down the line and the other bits we have looked at but I don't know whether they can run a proper speed test. I am really curious to see whether this is something in your house or on the VM network.

Incidentally, did you try putting the shub in modem mode, connecting your new router and doing a wired test from your laptop. You should be aiming to do this anyway going forward as your new router is better than the shub and you will want it to handle all your traffic including wireless.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

I currently have the super hub in modem mode and connected to my new router with cat6 cable.

I'll run a test as soon as I can, Sundays a bit mad here ����

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Try downloading the ookla speedtest from windows store. That seems to give the correct reading on my PC, rather than the website.
https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2020/07/10.jpg
http://village.photos/images/user/de...bc992bd303.jpg

Taken 5 minutes apart, both wired on same PC
https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2020/07/11.jpg

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

I'll give that a go aswell

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Also, another option is to download a huge file from a site, and see what speed it's downloading at (for instance, COD:MW update)

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

What's going on with your upload as that is low?

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Well spotted, thanks very much.

I hadn't noticed there was a series of critical errors
Unicast Maintenance Ranging attempted - No response - Retries exhausted

Also only 1 upstream bonded channel.
Upstream bonded channels

Channel
Frequency (Hz)
Power (dBmV)
Symbol Rate (ksps)
Modulation
Channel ID
1
39400089
5.1
5120
64 qam
4

Just performed a hard reset and back to normal.

https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2020/07/12.jpg

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

this is the results with setup
SHub>>NewRouter>Laptop
>> cat 6
> cat 5e

Best ive got, but cabled i should be getting more.

Also its is with the windows speedtest App, the web version would complete but got a download of 70 somthing

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

that is just a minor improvement from this morning and nowhere near what you should be getting; it would be rubbish for 350mbits let alone 500. I didn't think the app would make any difference tbh because we basically did the same thing on your phone earlier which was using a different device and platform. Still good to do though because it is just another thing to tick off the list. When is the tech coming round?

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Previous post Just checking - is the laptop connected directly to the shub, or via your new router, when you’re doing the speed tests?

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Laptop connected to new router, new router is connected to VM supper Hub.

The Tec was here on Saturday, he just said it was the Laptop. I'll see what happens on Monday, VM are ment to be coming back to me...don't see this happening

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

If the tech said it was your laptop that was the problem then he must have run a test to validate that.

Looking at your speed test results it does suggest your NIC may be running at half duplex.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

But I got an up-to-date laptop and got the same results

---------- Post added at 07:11 ---------- Previous post was at 05:51 ----------

Didn't even think of that, I've had a look and I'm set to full;)

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Can you try just using the VM router alone? (Or have you done this, it’s not clear)

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Yes I've tested with the VM Super Hub in both router and modem mode

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Just on it's own - no other router involved?

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Pretty much any lappy you are likely to be using will have a 1Gb capable network port, the cables used are also going to be OK.
Is it possible to try a Linux live system - used to be easy - go to newsagent, but Linux Format and boot DVD but the magazine isn't supplying discs at this time, but you can download and burn to DVD or USB, boot from that and retest. This can remove the O/S as possible cause. You can also check the NIC's settings to see what the laptop thinks it should be configured as. (Others can show how to get same info from Windows).

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

I thought it was the laptop as well but he has tried it on his phone and he gets the same result. I know his phone could do 500mbits if it was available because I have got the same phone and mine reports full speed for me (378mbits) and my router tells me it is connected at 866mbits so if I was on the 500mbit tier I could physically achieve it.

I don't suppose you have got a friend who can bring round a different laptop or tablet who could do run a test?

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

That was on of the last things I did was to get a friend's laptop and it's was the same I also tried it with my son's Mac book Pro and it was giving the same results.

Think I'll give the Linux boot disk a run and test it 🤞

---------- Post added at 15:24 ---------- Previous post was at 14:25 ----------

Results from speed tests using Linux OS
One is wireless the other cables with cat6 to the super Hub

Tried to upload picks but site not letting me....

WiFi-73.02
Cat6-152.76[COLOR="Silver"]

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

If you think you have got it bad check this out. Even trying to load this webpage felt like I was back on dialup. A quick reboot of the shub fixed it:

https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2020/07/6.png

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Wish a reboot would fix mine....I've just given up...VM don't care. My contact end around the start of September, I think I'll just move services. It's sad really I've been with VM from the start...

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Can you remember when you started to have problems. Was you on 350mbits prior to 500 and did you get full speed then?

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

I did get 500mb NP, but once I started to look into the speeds recently I noticed how slow it had become. The kids had been saying for a bit before that

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Just wondering if there was a particular point in time you noticed it and if it coincided with any equipment changes in the house (like you bought a new xbox).

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

No, we didn't have any hardware changes. My kids said it's been slow for weeks now, but I didn't notice until I started to look into it

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

On the phone with VM today again, done all the same tests Tec booked for the morning ������

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

I hope you're getting some kind of a discount at the moment because i think you maybe entitled to it until your speed is increased.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

I was just thinking that, but let's get it fixed first then we can talk money.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

With regards to getting to the bottom of this I suggest the following:

1) He will see that two techs have been out previously and what work they have completed. Being confident that the fault isn't VM's end he will no doubt suggest that it is your laptop or your new router that is the problem. Being very calm and polite let him know that you have done multiple speed tests directly to the shub, wired from your laptop, as well as wireless tests from your phone and other devices and they have all delivered the same result no matter what device is used and whether it be wired or wireless so you believe the issue isn't your end and on VM's side. It isn't about telling the tech what to do or who knows best but simply providing him with as much diagnostic information as possible. You should also let him know that you used to be able to get full speed and this problem has only manifested itself recently.

2) He will no doubt check all the connections around the house as well as your connection to the cabinet. If he comes back and says he can't see anything wrong ask him if there is any way (as in a phone call) he can see if there is a capacity issue in the area or any other network issues which would be affecting your speed. I am sure he will know already but it just gives him a nudge to ensures he covers all the bases.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Guys here now, definitely 2nd or 3rd line support, very nice and helpful.
He showed me the capacity in the area and for 1 blip it got to 60% rest of the week it was well in its low 40s.
He's talked about Sam Knowles. VM use to get real time spread tests.
Max he was getting was 200Mb

Hi did say that Samsung s7 phones are well known for creating problems on the network....

Don't know how much I believe this I've had my s7edge from it came out and never had a problem with it or the network

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Sam Knows (SK) is essentially a continuous monitoring on your line using a repurposed router with custom software (earlier ones were able to have full software applied and used as routers). You plug into network (router or SH) and then plug other devices into the SK box (this is so the SK box can pause testing when you load the network). The box tests speeds, ping, UDP all sorts of things and you get access to a dash board so you can see results plotted on graphs.

I used to have a box but now removed. It was a really useful tool as it rules out any possible PC issues either in PC, NIC, cable, O/S, driver (though problem in SK unit, cable or ports would still cause local issue).

The graphs can show if there are cyclical issues (e.g. speed drops every day at 1600-2000), point of time change (jitter increased at certain date).

Used to be really useful but the monitoring relationship changed and I don't have it any more. (NOTE : I say this as a customer/participant - I have no knowledge beyond end of monitoring of the relationship).

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

Did the tech do anything?

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

If they have acknowledged there is a capacity issue you should be moving down to 350mbits at the very least; there is no point paying for speed you can't possible get.


absolute rubbish and I want to say bs if the swear filter doesnt punish me

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

VM tec showed me the capacity of the area, it for the most part was around 35% to mid 40s and it only peeked at around 60% once over the week. So they have a load of room for capacity.

In the end he got over 500mb on which Broadband checker website, he said he didn't trust speedtest.com.
But sure the second he went I plugged the laptop in and got 7MB ����

But I've connected everything back up again and it seems fine for now.

The Samsung s7 bit I think is a bit of BS myself. He started going on about Android updates and falling off the network...

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

my bad, I miss interpreted that. I read it as everyone was only getting 40% speed on average and max 60%. If that is area utilisation then there is plenty of juice to go around. As an fyi there is absolutely nothing wrong with speedtest.net and it has been the gold standard for over 10 years. VM can't diss it because speedtest.net isn't some dodgy 3rd party test site which is unreliable, they point you to VM's own speed test server on VM's network. There is one thing having a dodgy result if you leave VM's network and go to another 3rd party server. A bad result could be due to any number of things beyond VM's control but when you can't get full speed across VMs network to a server on their network then something is wrong. It is good logic and and good troubleshooting and for VM to speak badly of it is poor. Regardless of which tier I have been on over the years I have always been able to get full speed off speedtest.net and the only times I haven't is when there has been a problem (which is the entire point of it). My Android phones and tablets have always achieved full speed as well.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

I'm going to let it go for now because it's really starting to get my going and the Drs say that's not good for you.

If i leave it a week or 2 keep a note of when the network goes slow.

The Android bit seem to be to big to be true, the s7 was a very popular phone and we have 2 in this house and never had a a problem with them.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

The engineer was giving you total B/s about your S7. All you had to do was turn it off and say " what's the problem now then?"

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

There is (was?) a problem with band-switching on S7's which would cause them to lose Wi-Fi connection. A workaround was put into the SH3 firmware last year so that S7's would remain online using the original band. But it never affected the network.

Re: New WiFi Router and Cat8 cable
 

I did turn it off, it was all just more blag and bluster