UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/h...-a4485601.html

:clap:

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

A fine guesture. Let's hope they don't all come over at once. :erm:

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

The right decision.

I wonder how easy it would be for them to gain citizenship of Singapore? That country seems a potential beneficiary of corporate relocations from Hong Kong.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

The irony of this is priceless :)

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Excellent, that may help fill the potential fruit & vegetable picker shortfall

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Any move from HK to UK would still mean jumping through several immigration hoops over a few years. And incur costs to the immigrants I bet.

A (British) friend and his (HK) wife as keeping an eye on things over there, but it could go sour very quickly as China asserts itself. They have lived and worked there for several years now.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

I assume you are comparing poor jobless Romanians with wealthy entrepreneurial Hong Kongers and can't see the difference.

Amin's Ugandans have benefited this country considerably and people from Hong Kong will be the same. We should be welcoming people with the wealth, skills and knowledge that will benefit this country and are not a threat to the jobs of the low paid.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

The problem there is that if there are no jobs for these highly skilled knowledgeable people, they might then become 'a threat to the jobs of the low paid' . . . or a further burden to the benefits sytem.


Having said that, I'm sure that when the Covid situation is over, and Brexit finally sorted, there will be an abundance of roles that need filling ;) :rolleyes:

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Well when China drives Hong Kong into the ground and it's no longer viable as a free enterprise centre I'm pretty sure we can do with the entrepreneurs being on our side and working for us..

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Coming over here, stealing our jobs, etc.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

:rolleyes: grow up

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Seconded!

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Depending on the amount of wealth they able to ferret out of Hong Kong this could result in an economic boost, probably explaining why China is so pissed off.

Politically this could also be Boris importing "Tory voters", we'll have to see how many take up his offer.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Not my view but it is the inevitable response in time.

Irish, Asians, Eastern Europeans. It’s a staple throughout British history. Whether they walk into well paid or low paid jobs is irrelevant really. It’s an employment opportunity lost to someone already here is the simplistic outlook that some will view it with.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

aah right, I see how you meant it now.

Having said that, yes there will always be the unemployed (that want to work) viewing working immigrants with just a little annoyance ;)

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Pretty sure that the three million BN(O)s in HK aren't all "wealthy entrepreneurs"...

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Hong Kong has a highly educated workforce. It's likely those who have the economic means to come here are going to walk right into high-paying, skilled, jobs.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Agreed, but not 3,000,000+ of them (as we don’t have three million vacancies).

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Do we have space for an extra 3,000,000 Takeaway shops.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Plenty of High Street space soon once the second wave of Corona finishes off the businesses that survive the first.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Do these people tend to speak English?

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

It's widely spoken in HK.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

That will be a good help.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Certainly will, no extra interpreters needed at the housing benefits office, job center or hospitals :D

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Some of my other half's relatives are HK nationals and qualify as BNOs. A couple of her aunts who are of the older generation are not interested in coming here as their view is that they will be treated as second class citizens.

Judging by the attitudes of some in this supposedly welcoming, multicultural nation I am not half surprised.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Wow!

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Well they probably remember the days when thr British ruled HK and did treat them as second class citizens. But then also the elderly are the least inclined to migrate even when threatened.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Offence junkie just got a fix;)

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

I don't recollect such complaints when the Ugandan Asians came here. As I understood it, they created more jobs. It's what entrepreneurs tend to do.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Casual racism just got triggered...

---------- Post added at 20:20 ---------- Previous post was at 20:18 ----------

27,200 < 3,000,000+

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

3 million will not actually choose to leave.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

I’m not sure the “they steal our jobs” brigade care for the distinction or consider the evidence base of whether migrants offer more to the country than they take.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

They won't be allowed to leave.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

That is also true.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Take a plane to Paris. Then once there get a plane or train to London.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

If a North Korean defects they punish the family for three generations. The Chinese aren't that bad but they have more creative ways than simply bannijg flights to Britain.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

What do they do to them?

---------- Post added at 21:57 ---------- Previous post was at 21:56 ----------

If that's the case it's a pretty meaningless gesture by our Government.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

So in what ways, apart from their own consumption(food, housing, energy, etc), do they actually increase GDP per person? Not sure I've ever seen a full and proper explanation of how it works.


GDP or similar as a measure is just nonsense. In theory you could double the population and total GDP would go up. GDP per person is another matter.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

I think there were 'jobs galore' back in the day . . before everyone was put out of work through advances in automation, globalization, and the Gov't selling stuff off ;)

---------- Post added at 22:23 ---------- Previous post was at 22:20 ----------

Yep, something else I don't get . . . probably because 'stats' don't do anything for me ;)

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Tend to agree. It worked for Brexit so the playbook has been validated.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Stats prove nothing. It should be pretty easy for people to explain the exact mechanisms by which GDP per person is supposedly increased. Especially when those groups are complaining they are badly off and economically disadvantaged. The explanations should all be ready, "neatly tied up with a bow". How many businesses are just taking away money, that would've been spent elsewhere anyway.


I've posed a question. If there's an explanation, let's hear it.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

So businesses extract money from the wider economy?

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

The North Koreans have a strange class system based on how loyal you are. If your family gets put in the traitor class you get less food and opportunities and will get mistreated.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

The sort of example I was thinking of, was a takeaway where if somebody didn't spend it there, they would've spent it somewhere else. Not necessarily on food.

Still waiting for this supposedly simple explanation, that should've been ready and around for decades, just to be trotted out.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

The same way anyone else increases GDP - assuming they're working.

The person works and presumably produces something of value for someone which'll contribute to the overall output of the country. In turn, they'll also be paid and spend in the economy generating further demand and in theory futher work (which will lead to more output, more spending and so on).

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Don't forget that taxation is supposed to play it's part.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

And if that person wasn't in this country, would that job mysteriously not exist? But how much of that tax is from income that non-immigrants would have earned instead. It's not exactly new income that wouldn't have existed if they hadn't come here. Maybe some of it, simply from the extra demand of extra people being here. Then you have to factor in the money they send abroad. The effect of that is many times the amount involved. Normally money will pass from A to B to C etc within this country. They all earn an income with the same money. If it goes from A to B and then out of the country, it is lost income and GDP for this country.

Just generating further demand is a nonsense argument. You could allow in 10m people, and it would magically increase demand, but NOT where the money to pay for that demand came from. As a total GDP figure, the economy of China looks great compared to the UK, but look at the GDP per person, and it's another matter. Scotland has a lower GDP than Bangladesh. Which would you say is the richer country?:rolleyes: Scotland's GDP per person is the region of 20 times higher.

Eg A TV programme a few years ago. Slovakian Roma couple came over with TWENTY-TWO of their children and grandchildren. All housed in several homes, all receiving benefits of one sort or another(only one had a job), needing taxpayer funded interpreters and support officers etc. Now add in SIX THOUSAND others had also come over and were living in Rotherham. Another example was a guy from Romania came over, intending to stay just for a year, claim enough benefits to send £10,000 back to Romania, to do up his house there. They will have all added to total GDP, but it will have had to be funded by public borrowing.

The wealthier of the Hong Kong residents will likely have kept their heads down and not be at risk. In order to realise their assets, they would have to sell them to somebody else. Who would be buying?

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Isn't that the point here: they have calculated that the offer will never be claimed in enough numbers to matter so that they look good in making it and costs them (next to) nothing.

Of course, if they have miscalculated then the fun begins ..

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Like Blair and the Eastern Europeans: Only a few thousand.

Make that hundreds of thousands. :rolleyes:

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Any specific job might have already existed but in the aggregate more workers should produce more output producing more jobs. Yes, part of it is the extra demand more people makes. That's the GDP per head increased slower than GDP during the early 2000s when we had an increase in EU migration.

However you're assuming there is a static amount of work. More economic activity should generate more work. It's a pretty foundational concept to how our economic system works. There isn't a static amount of money or work to be done.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

...but mass automation is just around the corner.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Well yeah, that's a whole different argument. :D

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/d...01%2C023%2C583.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

And where does this "more output" go to? A higher total GDP, DOES NOT mean a better economy. Where does this money that is funding this alleged massive extra demand come from? You could let in 10m extra people, all on benefits, and the GDP would go up. But in no way whatsoever would the economy be better. The GDP per person would be further diluted.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Have you thought of doing some research on this, rather than badgering Damien with questions?

https://www.thebalance.com/what-is-t...h-rate-3306016 If there are more people in jobs earning and spending money, GDP increases...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-13200758

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Have you given any thought to the idea that Damian might be the font of all knowledge on the subject.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

You are correct that there is no economic benefit to everyone being on benefits. But if they all "opened takeaways"* and the market was able to sustain all those takeaways without subsidies then in classical economic thinking that is a real contribution.

*crazy example but here we are

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

No, because he has never professed to be an economist.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Calm down dear. We just have different views on the ability, morality and accountability of this Government. You admire them because they have managed to deliver on your particular ideological goals and I dislike them for so many reasons.

You seem to view any criticism as "bile" and "unconstructive". This is your prerogative but it implies that you are incapable or more likely, unwilling to address points that show this Government in a unsavoury light. Your dismissal of continual lying about the handling of this pandemic as "well, all politicians lie don't they?" is illustrative. It seems they literally can do anything as long as they continue on the path you favour.

Others may want to provide a more objective assessment of them and call them out when required.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

I didn't say it would make a better economy, which is a subjective argument to make anyway, you were asking how it increases GDP. I said how. Now, you're trying to make the argument into something else which I am not arguing.

Either abroad as the stuff we export, or from the banks or the Bank of England. The money supply is not finite and, very simplistically speaking, it should increase to much the value produced in the economy.

Yes, which is why at the start of this I said 'assuming they're working.'.

But during the period in which we had a lot of migration we did not see GDP being diluted, we saw it increase:https://www.statista.com/statistics/...nited-kingdom/

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Maybe it's because he doesn't brag about his abilities on this forum :erm:

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

I have to tip my hat to Damien - his posts are always very informative.
I've seen a lot of stuff on this forum and I confess I didn't know what a straw man was until I joined this forum. But I'm not sure I've seen people brag about their abilities.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Not what i said.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Some interesting discussion over the last couple of pages.
One thing that kept coming up was the reference to 'those employed, working' spending money on goods made. Working 16 hrs a week on minimum wage doesn't buy you much, but if it helps the GDP why don't we all just work 20hrs a week (with pro rata wage) and cure the unemployment problem ;)

Another suggestion was people earning money but sending/spending it 'back home', which is more prevalent than you'd think.

oh and . .
Where have you been for the last decade? :D

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

In fairness there’s no way the Government would make the offer without sitting down and having some kind of stab at how many would be likely to come, their background, education, existing means.

While he’s quite cynical about it, there’s an element of reward in PR terms (for anyone in any line of work) in being seen to make a generous offer that nobody will take up.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

It also strengthens the Hong Kong people's negotiation position, assuming the Chinese don't throw a tantrum.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Nah, they're not like that, nothing in the last few days to show any backlash ;)

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Wealthy? It'll be their middle class coming over if they come at all and their 'wealth' will be tied up in the businesses left behind, just like it was with the Ugandans many of whom had no more than the clothes on their back when they arrived.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Yes, it has already started, but you ain't seen nothing yet. Some economists predict that about a third of jobs will disappear within 10 to 15 years. There won't be enough jobs for people already living here and I think we will probably have to introduce an unconditional citizens income. This will be at a massive cost.

This is why I think that we must prepare ourselves to mitigate this by ensuring that any future immigration is on the understanding that it is temporary whilst they are needed by the UK. That way everyone knows where they stand and people we need that want to come here can make an informed choice.

---------- Post added at 16:36 ---------- Previous post was at 16:36 ----------

Good point.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

what if they give birth to children whilst here what would be the status of those children ?

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Full British Citizenship, with a free house, two cars, three TVs, and credit cards with unlimited spend.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Unofficial guesswork involving an independent survey of 19 people in Burger King, has found that all 23 of them believe the UK has sank 0.76 cm in the past 27 minutes due to the weight of immigration.

Four strangers at a bus stop in Slough have stated that if everyone wore 'air sole' trainers the UK could bounce back

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

That's a very valid point you raise. As it stands they would be British and entitled to a payment, which is not something that we want. The BNP already oppose this as they say something along the lines of, if a cat has kittens in the nice warm straw of a stable, it does not follow that it has, therefore, given birth to foals!

The trouble is, if we don't allow any more immigration, this would affect us in the present day e.g. fruit picking.

Could we enact a law that says that certain people born in the UK aren't British, but are the nationality of their parents?? I really don't know.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Having worked in Slough in the early 2000s, I thought it was full of "air soles"... ;)

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

You've just described my ex mr's;)

---------- Post added at 17:34 ---------- Previous post was at 17:25 ----------

The kids would be British i can't see any way around that,and you can't chuck the parents out without the kids ,which would contravene the rights of the kids [British citizens] and you can't leave the kids without parents[British law] so it's fair to say that they are staying ,any hoo the whole conversation is irrelevant as China won't allow them to leave, so we should work on the premise that not many of them are coming to the mother land.

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

I am surprised you have married so many men ;)

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

:D:D:D

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

have you seen the women in Cleethorpes? :Sprint:

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Every time i look it costs me a house and most of my money :)

---------- Post added at 12:12 ---------- Previous post was at 12:10 ----------

If i had it could have saved me a fortune;)

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Tell us more! :)

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

Re: UK offers right to residency and path to citizenship to 3m Hong Kong citizens
 

It works for same over here, there are job roles in education called HLTA's or cover supervisers.

Hlta roles are like teachers they plan lessons and take lessons when teachers can't for less money usually around £20-24k a year

Cover supervisers do the same role but don't plan lessons they take lessons already planned for absent teachers they get around 18-20k a year

However years ago and still happens now when she got her HLTA status which is an NVQ 4 level she couldn't get jobs in this area because NQT's were getting these roles or teachers and ex teachers that didn't want the teaching role anymore all got these jobs pushing those with the right qualification out for those with higher ones.

Forwarding on a few years she now has a PGCE but doesn't have the right one to get the full PGCE lvl 6.5 or something she said.

She decided not to bother going down the teacher route and opted for HLTA postions but still found that "teachers" going for these postions always got the jobs basicially she said it's pushed a NVQ lvl 4 job upto and beyond a degree level.

She's got a HLTA position now but it's took some years and 16 years working as a teaching assistant.

So we have to be carefull of what experiance and positions we fill here from outsiders that are over qualified for those posts