Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

Dominic Cummings went to visit, and live, with his parents in Durham (260 miles away) whilst he had the virus! https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-52779356

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He seems to have crossed over the line to become the news item itself. Not a good career move.

However, these comments from FT readers suggest there may be more to it than meets the eye:
"I was wondering how the little reptile was going to wriggle his way out of having to be there for the denouement of his brexit fiasco..."
"Spot on. He's very manipulative and I wouldn't be surprised if he's done this on purpose."
https://www.ft.com/content/c55a5daf-...f-8460242dff72

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Oooops. :erm:

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Timeline here
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...own-a-timeline

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What's that then, a hefty 'show em who's boss' fine of £100?

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Given what both happened to Niall Ferguson and Catherine Calderwood and you were PM what would you do?.;)

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Some other Tories and some people from Vote Leave have it in for him as well so it's not as if there is widespread support from him within the party or even with his former allies.

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And who doesn't go to his mum when he's ill ?

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I thought it was just advice, i mean Boris went to Chequers[second home] instead of returning to Downing st after his illness.

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Not according to the Government's guidelines. If you have CV-19 symptoms then the Government's clear instructions were to stay at home and self-isolate. The legislation was enacted very swiftly so may be imperfect and I don't know how prosecutable it is.
But Cummings' actions gives the impression that he feels rules are for little people.
He should now do the honourable thing and resign before the next Prime Minister's Questions.

---------- Post added at 08:34 ---------- Previous post was at 08:31 ----------

After not during.
I wouldn't have wanted to use the petrol pump after Cummings had filled up his car.

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Durham police believe it breached the rules. https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news...uring-18299781

Cummings’ parents are in their 70s, and the government guidelines state And it states that these people (70 and over) should take particular care to minimise contact with anyone outside their household.

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When people are prevented from attending the funerals of their loved ones and from meeting critically ill family members and from doing all sorts of normal interactions in the great interests of preserving the nation's health.

You simply cannot have one law for one and one law for another as Niall Ferguson and Catherine Calderwood had to resign because they broke the rules so what makes Dominic Cummings different.

It is rank hypocrisy no if's, no but's, and no maybe's and the public who are not stupid will see it like that..

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https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/...-bring-clarity (Open in an "incognito" window to read full article in The Spectator, if you’re not a subscriber).

According to his wife’s account, she was throwing up, and he went to their home immediately (good man doing the right thing) to look after her, but then, within 24 hours, had collapsed.

I wonder when they travelled to Durham?

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It undermines the whole effort to stop the virus spreading. If any doubts about following the rules are placed in people's minds - eg the Government doesn't follow its own advice so why should I? - then the R-rate will start rising and we'll have to return to a stricter lockdown.

What potentially makes Dominic Cummings different from Niall Ferguson and Catherine Calderwood is that Boris Johnson is dependent on Dominic Cummings.

He now needs to salvage Dominic Cummings' scant reputation by getting him to resign. Will he return like a bad penny? Doubtless, but Boris Johnson needs to send a clear message out to the country. And that message shouldn't be rules are just for little people.

---------- Post added at 09:24 ---------- Previous post was at 09:22 ----------

Timeline posted previously, but worth a repost. https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...own-a-timeline

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Considering it’s a “mild flu“, and indeed some (not me) take the view that large numbers experience no symptoms at all, it’s awfully bad luck for both of them to get the really bad version.

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l quote these words from the Health Secretary Matt Hancock when he heard about Niall Ferguson so it will be interesting to hear what he has to say about Dominic Cummings now.

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Hands up who wants to present the Government's next CV-19 briefing? :D

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That quote of the wifes account (by Hugh) reads like something lifted from a Catherine Cookson novel :rolleyes:

. . is she a wannabe author or something?

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I too was thinking pretentious BS. :D

---------- Post added at 09:56 ---------- Previous post was at 09:47 ----------

I think it's safe to assume that we're all pleased no one died directly without having to state the bleedin' obvious.

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Would you like a soap box to stand on :soapbox:

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I don’t have any opinion on the man himself.

However, precedence dictates that his position is untenable.

All he has to is resign, stay quiet for a few months, then he’ll back.

That’s pretty much what nearly every government minister does when they resign.

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Do you think Dominic Cummings' position is tenable? The Conservative Party seems to be following the SNP rule book here.

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The government have not said anything about it yet.

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Good point, it's allegedly all been via Laura Kuenssberg which if true is a cleverer approach.
We both agree on what will happen to Dominic Cummings though.

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Let's not let facts get in the way of a good rant ;)

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The UK prime minister's office has issued a statement saying his chief adviser, Dominic Cummings, did not break any rules when he travelled to his family home even though he was suffering with the virus.

Here's the full statement:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-52781481

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So the facts are he did nothing illegal and broke no rules,Thanks for clearing that up Den:tu:

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The need to protect the family? They weren’t in danger any more or less than any other family self isolating for 14 days. The whole point of the guidance was so you could only spread it among yourselves.

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Are you not forgetting a few things papa.

Here are a few reminders for you as remember these are not my words but the words of the PM and government ministers.

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Regardless of whether he was right or wrong, the veracity and ferociousness of the opposition parties hatred to him. It would just be easier if he laid low for a few months

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It doesn't seem to apply to politicians and unelected bureaucrats just the rest of us. :erm:

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Ah, so right and wrong aren't important any more so long as the Government makes it through.

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There is a culture of hatred and bullying involved in this witch hunt, no doubt because of his involvement in Brexit.

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As you stated in a previous post if he resigns he will come back in a few months anyway but at this given moment his position is untenable.

He has to do the honourable thing and resign.

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What a complete load of rubbish as Brexit has nothing to do with it apart from a few malcontents still pontificating as Brexit is happening now one hundred per cent no matter who is in power.

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He's not an MP he's just a working man.
Should every working person lose their job because some people mistakenly think they broke a lockdown rule?

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Revenge is still on peoples minds you just won't accept it as the reason to want him gone.

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And l am not sure you understand the governments own Coronavirus advice whether it was from the Prime Minister or government ministers.

The populace understood it well so why can't you...

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And the fact that there is provision in the law covering this situation,if a law had been broken the police would have prosecuted and no 10 would not issue a statement saying no rules or laws have been broken.

Your right it is a poor show but did you expect anything else.

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So you obviously think No.10 considers Dominic Cumming's career far more important that the viability of its lock-down strategy then papa?.

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I’m sure his consideration was his circumstances and his child. Nobody is doubting that. It’s his deciding to potentially put that above the law and the guidance which is under scrutiny.

The guidance was clear. Households should isolate themselves. Not to bring other people into it. If he had symptoms then there was every chance his children could have carried it, and spread it to the grandparents - over 70 and at risk. This was specifically the type of scenario that guidance was designed to prevent.

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Exactly. The same applied to Dr Catherine Calderwood who was also somewhat hesitant in resigning. It's about someone in a position of authority following the rules.

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I have no opinion on the thoughts of the Government as they are not in the public domain,if i was to assume to know their thoughts i would just be making an ass of u and me

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Reminding someone in authority to do the honourable thing and resign because they broke the rules they helped with is not a witch hunt. This is now a millstone around Johnson's neck which cannot be blamed on political opponents.
As Den has reminded us, there have been two precedents before. Why do you think he should be treated any differently?

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So let me get this straight, two parents with suspected Covid-19 do the responsible thing and leave their child with parents. No one would ever consider breaking the gov rules to save their children?

But wait, leaving the home for a “medical reason” is justified and allowed.

I see this is just some lame point scoring by Remainers. Some of you really piss me off with your bullshit reasonings.

This Cummings non-bombshell story is Pathetic and weak and so are those who think Cummings was irresponsible and broke the rules and should be fired or resign, when he certainly did not. Those of you in this category, you need to stop your butt hurt over Brexit, you lost several times in Democratic processes.

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It's not about Brexit, Mick. The people voted for it, and in 2019 voted for a Government to deliver it. Fair is fair. Politicians that wanted to remain had opportunities via the opposition and didn't do it, that's their fault.

Whether anyone would consider the same action as Cummings as reasonable for their own kids isn't relevant. Nowhere, anywhere, did it say in the guidance to remove your kids from the situation, or across the country, if someone in your household has coronavirus. You had to isolate for 14 days with the very significant risk you'd transmit it amongst yourselves.

The urge for him to resign is just the natural way of things - everything needs a resignation. Scotland's CMO, the Professor with the mistress, it's simply untenable to insist the public follow rules that you will not. You can't stand up there, apologise for being an idiot and move on.

Politics would probably be better off, and much less polarised, if you could.

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I'm not politically affiliated to any of the dorks, and I believe he did wrong :)



Anyway, as I feel a little unwell today - may or may not be Covid - I've decided, for the protection of my family here at home, to self isolate for 14 days in a rather nice self contained holiday home on the south coast.

Goose Gander and all that :p:

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Agree 100%.
I think some people's admiration for Cummings - inside and outside Government - is blocking them from accepting his need to resign. As Den suggests, the public aren't fools and there is now a competent opposition leader so the current situation will not last.

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

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I think some peoples pathological hatred of cummings is clouding their judgement and exagerating a none story in the hope of exacting revenge for the outcome of the referendum.

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

It's not often I agree with this bloke:-
https://twitter.com/piersmorgan/stat...402454534?s=20

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

Well only when it suits your agenda.

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

Calm down Smurf, you're sounding a bit 'bitter and twisted' ;)

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

On 23rd March, at the government briefing, the Deputy Chief Medical officer made it explicitly clear that seeking childcare while you are ill is an exceptional circumstance and is within the rules.

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

I just don't like to see someone bullied for looking after his family by people who hate him because of the referendum

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Spot on.

The hounding of this man is really pathetic because he "won" Brexit. People need to seriously get a bloody grip.

He just left his London home with a scrum of press outside, not Social distancing, when he neared, he had to remind them. Absolute bunch of hypocrites. They couldn't give a stuff about Covid-19, just want to diminish this man because he won "Brexit". So pathetic how some people are and the press.

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

:tu:

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

What she actually said

Not “if you speculate that you might become too ill”. If he was too ill to do so how could he safely drive 260 miles? A journey that reasonably would take four and a half hours.

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

The arch bully gets bullied?! If so, sometimes there's justice. If there was nothing to hide why has this been kept quiet for so long?

It does seem to be different rules for different people. That Jenrick bloke broke the lockdown too, to see Mummsy and Daddsy. - no action taken either. If you're a minister or Bozza's chum, the rules don't apply.

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Equally Mick there are some defending him because he delivered Brexit, and would simply be frothing at the mouth if this was Diane Abbott.

The Brexit divide is a two way street.

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

It's not as bad as when I initially posted the story but it's still not great. The Government advice was to not to leave the children with their grandparents:

https://www.manchestereveningnews.co...-dont-17945774

Cummings didn't just do this. He drove up to Durham to do this.

He has a good job and he is also a key-workers allowing him to send the kids to school and/or pay for childcare.

This is probably a dilemma for families across Britain and they were explicitly told not to give children to their grandparents by Boris Johnson and would have made alternative arrangements.

I don't think it's unreasonable to ask why Cummings is exempt from that? It's an exceptional circumstance to break the self-isolation rules to seek medical care and/or care for your children. It's a push to say that involves travelling 250 miles to give them to your Parents when the Prime Minister whom you advise has told other people, the public, not to do that.

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

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Bollocks. I am defending him because he broke no rules, or broke any laws, big bloody difference, so don't you come to me with this kind of BS. :dozey:

Other thing is - I even defended Labour's Stephen Kinnock who visited his parents dropping off essentials to a vulnerable group, his elderly parents.

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Which you are allowed to do.

You are not meant to get them to provide child care as they are a vulnerable group. Also Stephen Kinnock, like Jennrick who was accused of the same thing, were not self-isolating at the time either.

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

The issue is not about bullying, the issue is: Why is there one set of rules for Dominic Cummings and another for the likes of everyone else? As Damien has pointed out, Boris "...told today's press conference: "Children should not be left with older grandparents or older relatives who may be particularly vulnerable."

I've also regularly praised the Chancellor who's a Brexiter, as a review of these forums will demonstrate.

What's interesting now is that Dominic Cummings has stepped up and defended his actions in person. It will be interesting to see how this plays out as the evidence is stacked solidly against him.

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I didn’t mean you specifically, which is why I said some, and I do recall you defending Stephen Kinnock so I wasn’t levelling the accusation at you.

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That is meant in general or what is usually the norm.

Mr Cummings and his wife had suspected Covid-19. So they left their child with their parents to look after, that is not forbidden.

Nearly every Cabinet member backing Cummings. Government staying hard and fast on this one and I don't blame them. They should, he did nothing wrong.

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

The PM Boris Johnson himself pointed this out yesterday.

https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/sta...07261086392320

The Conservative party on their own Facebook account stated this a little while back.

https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall/st...237313/photo/1

The messages can't be any clearer but it obviously does not apply to the government and its advisors.

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WTF - You didn't mean me specifically but then accuse me of potential vilifying of Diane Abbott if she had done same.

Do you actually have a clue of what you're saying to folk, seriously? :erm:

---------- Post added at 14:15 ---------- Previous post was at 14:12 ----------

So one cannot self isolate in a car, how is a parent meant to get their child to be babysat with trusted parties then?

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But Boris Johnson explicitly said not to do this. Doing it when you have COVID-19 is even worse! The whole point of not moving around the country and not seeing relatives is to avoid spreading the virus.

Breaking self-isolation is to think childcare I think is understandable, travelling 250 miles to your parents so they can provide that childcare is not IMO. Could they really not do this with someone in London?

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Yes he said not do that yes, but if there is an exception and there is a jolly good one, both parents are ill with Covid-19 and they want to do the right thing and protect the child from getting it, their right to do so then that is the exception to what Boris says.

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I think their argument isn't to stop the child getting it? After all, if two parents have already caught it it's highly likely the child has been exposed to it as well and certainly would have more chance to be so in the day's drive up North. I mean if you want to avoid them getting infected - don't sit in a car with them for hours.

It was that childcare was available if they both fell badly ill.

But could they not do this in London?

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

Like him or hate him - he certainly knows how to pwn the press:

Mr Cummings leaving his London residence earlier:

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

Why did his wife lie about their location in this article in the Daily Mail last month?

She explicitly states "how her 'extremely kind' husband struggled to breathe while at home in London with her and their four-year-old son Alex.".

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ronavirus.html

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Yes he should have done it locally as much as possible but perhaps he couldn't have got someone to agree to look after his child for a full week at such short notice?

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

That certainly does look like they were covering something up.

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In the current incumbents case, what ever cummings tells him to do

Someone with a virus that'll potentially kill her

More likely no doubt because there's many people like me who have carried on working throughout and haven't seen their partner in the flesh since mid march coz she's shielding with blood cancer or their children since around the same time because they don't want to run the risk of infecting them and all the while that time is growing longer because people won't follow the clearest of instructions

Yeah and sod anyone unfortunate enough to encounter you on the way there

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

His wife did not mention the location. The Daily Mail assumed. Every quote of her in the article is from the Spectator piece she did.

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

I believe that is why it is known as the Daily Fail,quite surprised some are now quoting it as a reliable news source;)

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But the exception was only announced two weeks after Dominic Cummings had set off on his trip.
https://news.sky.com/story/coronavir...thing-11993298
And it's entirely plausible that the exceptions were only devised to try and accommodate Dominic Cummings' situtaion.

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Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

Oh dear, public perception not quite going the way of the media narrative of "fire him, fire him, he must resign.".

https://www.cableforum.uk/board/atta...1&d=1590246657

P.S Happy to have voted "Remain" on this poll. ;)

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

It wasn't done on a whim, or to deliver a birthday cake, or to attend 2 funerals of people they had no connection with. It was done with a very specific purpose in mind, and one that most people would've done in the circumstances.



If his extended family had lived in London, then it would've been a lot simpler.


What would other people have done in those difficult circumstances?

---------- Post added at 16:19 ---------- Previous post was at 16:14 ----------

He DIDN'T see his relatives.




---------- Post added at 16:21 ---------- Previous post was at 16:19 ----------

Since when is a birthday cake an essential item? Were there no other Labour party people available in England? Were there no deliveries of shopping available in his area?

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

Sorry nomad, I ain't going through this discussion with you again, old argument that I have zero interest in returning to and yes I still stick by what I said at the time, but I am not doing this with you again today.

In other news, Campbell kicking and screaming I believe about Cummings...

Just seen this tweeted...

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

Well, the only location Wakefield mentions in her article is London, implying that is where the family stayed for the duration of their isolation; she appears to have omitted the fact that they were in Durham in her Spectator piece - purely by accident, probably... :erm:

She did, however, in the Spectator article mention She probably didn’t think it relevant to mention driving 260-odd miles whilst emerging...

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

The daily conference was an utter farce this evening,

I learnt nothing new, the press may be able to smell blood in the water, but I’m sure most of the nation couldn’t give a shit about Cummings.

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

This has been the problem with the Lobby briefings throughout this whole crisis. It is a public health crisis and we need public health information. Yes, of course there's a political dimension but it is vastly more important that 60+ million people know what's expected of them and what the outlook is, not whether one of the prime minister's political advisers should or shouldn't have gone out driving and whether he should resign. But of course the ladies and gentlemen of the Press are bored with coronavirus now and would much rather be back in their own happy place, doorstepping politicians and peddling scandal.

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

I think you're probably right, most of us couldn't care more than tutting when the news was announced any more than we could when it was Ferguson or that Scottish non entity but they were forced to resign and the likes of Hancock and IDS both said they'd done the right thing, they said much about the most recent cummings and goings?

Expected of them but not expected of those making the rules

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

If you do it daily then the virus information isn't going to change that much so it will become like this.

I don't think it stops new information coming out it's just whichever story is the obsession of the day will take prominence. Yesterday it was all about the quarantine measures for example.

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

Another fabulous remark:

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

Police are still saying they spoke to the family, No 10 still saying they didn't.

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

I wonder why Dom or Mary didn’t contact either of Mary Wakefield’s brothers (Maximilian & Jack) for assistance/support, both of whom live in London?

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

Who knows? who care’s? Maybe they don’t Get on, plenty of my family I don’t speak to or care for.

You know it’s supercilious comments like the one above that really boils my piss.

Re: Dominic Cummings visited parents during lockdown measures
 

Wow! Seven pages already. Certainly seems to be a keen interest in this story.