Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

There have been many warnings lately about the use of Kodi, torrenting and illegal streaming generally, but is this the beginning of the end of piracy? Is the threat of criminal intrusion also putting people off?

Clearly, VM and Sky would benefit considerably if this was stopped, and it would certainly pay them to provide whatever assistance they could to deter piracy in the future.

https://www.express.co.uk/life-style...t-tv-block-ban

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

I doubt they will ever wipe these IPTV sellers out. It’s a bit like a game of wackamole.
There has been a concerted effort in the last couple of years and they have had the odd success. This has been due to the idiocy of the sellers by advertising on Facebook and the likes. A couple off well known long time Iptv suppliers have also been shut down.
I’m sure these film/tv companies will do all they can to shut down these sellers but I doubt they will get to all of them. These IPTV suppliers are worldwide businesses with servers all over the world.
Will The film and tv companies benefit? I suppose people who use these IPTV suppliers use them because they don’t what to pay (or can’t afford) full price to the corporates.
So would they pay if they had to. That’s a different question.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

If they did wipe out all piracy then there won't be much need for super fast broadband. So the ISPs would lose out. I'm sure we can now all cite legal reasons for having speeds of up to 350mb which does help matters.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

No, no and no. All the time content providers make their content too expensive/restrictive/time limited etc the pirates will thrive. First we had cassettes of albums traded in the play ground. Then rips of CD's on line, then DVD's and bluerays on torrents. Piracy evolves faster than the content providers can counter.

Now if they lowered their sights...

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

I'm sure there are quite a few people using piracy to get access to Premier League football matches which are just not available using any other route.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

It feels to me as though they are closing in on the pirates, and digital fingerprinting will help with that.

However, what if they start going after the punters? A VPN isn't going to protect you if the authorities raid the offices of IPTV providers of pirated programmes and seize the records of their customers. When that happens and ordinary people start getting landed with huge fines, this will put most people off, I would have thought.

People only do stuff like this en masse when they believe they can save a lot of money and get away with it. If it becomes apparent that they will catch up with you sooner or later, many would be put off doing it.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

I'm sorry OB but you appear to be living in the same cloud cuckoo land as the authorities.

You cited Kodi in your OP. With Kodi you don't need to sign up with anyone so they'll have a lot of luck raiding offices.

Even torrenting is still alive and kicking.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

I did mention Kodi because I was referring to that as a general introduction to the subject, but my focus here was on IPTV providers.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

Not necessarily.. I'm a PC gamer, and it's actually quite hard to get new games without using a download service such as Steam, or GOG. Even where a game does come on disk, what is released on the disk is often effectively a stub that downloads the rest of the game from Steam (or some other service).

Companies are increasingly doing this on console as well. I've had xbox one games that have to download >20 gig of data even though they come on a disc.

Then there are the video/audio streaming services (Netflix/Prime Video/Spotify etc), and the fact that even re-installing your existing devices (computers, tablets, phones etc) can involve downloading gigs of updates now. There are also services such as iCloud that encourage us to put all of our photos and home videos online.

I would argue Piracy is a major contributor to broadband use, but it's far from the only one.
I don't entirely agree. There will always be people who don't want to pay for stuff. Hell, when I worked for Blockbuster, we gave away some old films for free. We had to ask people to bring them to the counter, as the easiest way to ensure the inventory was up to date was for the manager to reduce the price on the computer to 0, then "sell" the film to the customer for nothing. People still nicked the films. I have a friend who watches a lot of films, but considers Netflix a rip off, so watches at least one film a day on dodgy streaming sites, despite the fact that most of the films he watches are probably on Netflix or Prime Video (he rarely watches anything newer than about 5 years old)

Services such as Netflix that offer a good selection of media for a monthly subscription have undoubtedly had a massive impact on piracy, but there are those who object to paying anything as they see the media as some evil thing that just exploits it's audience.

There are also those that see Piracy as a victimless crime as the big media companies can afford to lose their couple of quid. They can. But it's not them that loses out. It's the people on the projects they cancel or don't start in the first place, to make up the loss that lose out. They lose on on work that they may need to feed their families, and even on a small production, that can mean dozens of people are affected. That's bad enough, but on a large production, the number of people can run into the thousands, and add in the third party companies that supply services and goods to the production, and that can be tens of thousands..

Don't get me wrong. You or Me not paying £10 or £20 to see or buy a film and pirating it instead isn't going to make a difference. If we pirate it, then release a torrent and it ends up being downloaded thousands or millions of times, that *will* make a difference.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

Indeed.

In response to the OP

No & No

Let's take an example.

The Expanse.

Here in the UK I can either... Pirate
Or

Wait 9 months and see if they put it on Amazon Prime or similar (no guarantee there either)

If/When the respective distributors get their head out of their arse and stop region locking/subscription locking their content and/or making the prices something sensible, then Pirates will continue to flourish Arrrrrr

(btw S3 of the Expanse is awesome) :D

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

You may be interested in this link, which appears to indicate that the net is slowly closing in on those who view pirated material. I think this is the start of a long campaign.

Showbox users take notice now!

https://torrentfreak.com/showbox-sit...wsuits-181124/

Extract:

“Show Box is NOT a legitimate software platform for viewing Copyright protected movies. If you use ShowBoxApp to view copyrighted movies, the movie studios may be able to see your IP address and your viewing history,” it begins.

While it’s hard for copyright holders to track pirating users who use Showbox to stream from central servers, those who use torrents can indeed get in trouble. The warning makes that pretty clear as well.

“Movie studios are cracking down on illegal downloading and are filing lawsuits against users of ShowBox app. Websites that promote and/or distribute ShowBox are also being pursued by the movie studios for promoting illegal activity,” it adds.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

They would have a problem trying to find my IP address as I use a VPN which does not keep records not just on my PC and Laptop but also my phone no matter if I am just browsing the net.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

Authorities are not interested in people who stream, just downloading usually via torrents, the people they're REALLY after are the owners of such services, they kill that, they don't need to worry about the people using the service as the service will no longer exist, this was why and how Terranium TV shut down recently.

VPN's do come in handy too :D

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

You may be right, but my instincts are to avoid illegal viewing. So many people make the mistake of believing that how things are now is how things will be in the future.

Clearly, the target currently is the big players who make this stuff available. But, step by step, these operations will be closing down.

What concerns me is that when those operators close down, they will be after the punters. Businesses are businesses, and content owners will be looking to all that lost income and they will want to turn that to their advantage.

People may think they are safe with VPNs. Maybe so. But what if the companies providing VPN services get their offices taken over by the police, who then get access to their subscriber details?

I am not going to preach to anyone about this, but I do want people to think about the risks they are taking. You may get a period of time where you get free (or reduced cost) viewing, but what will be the potential cost of obtaining legal content for free?

Answers on a postcard....(to use a pre-email phrase).

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

Being a subscriber to a VPN service is not proof of anything. If the VPN service keeps detailed logs(which they tend not to do) then maybe you might be found out.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

No, but it is a lead. I don't think that people who subscribe or access illegal content are as safe as they think.

I am not trying to make a case here. I am trying to make people aware of the risks they are taking.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

I use a VPN to access some of my corporate clients computer resources. It's a requirement of their IT departments. Using a VPN is not evidence of illegal downloading / uploading. (Though it may be)

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

How are they going to get details of subscription from bitcoin payments?

The authorities may well get the IP address of the VPN being used for piracy but will not to be able to attach it to any one person due to no records being kept.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

But if these companies don't keep records, how do they know you are a member for the purpose of managing your subscription and access to the service? And although I understand that VPNs are supposed to work in such a way that you cannot be traced, I would not be that comfortable in convincing myself that there was no technical way my access to sites could not be traced through some technical means, particularly if the enforcers actually got into the company offices providing the service.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

It's always been a game of cat and mouse with the authorities and the 'pirates' for as long as I can remember, from floppy disks being swapped in the playground to cassette tapes copying songs, vhs tapes, CD's & DVD's, then along came the Internet and BB's with binaries, mIRC (still active arrrrr) Kazaa, Limewire, eDonkey, fast forward a little. Torrents, Kodi plug ins, android apps offering streaming.

Sometimes the pirates are on top, sometimes the authorities. The point I'm making is that it ain't ever going to stop. It's like playing Whack A mole.

There is a school of thought that suggests if things were priced somewhat more reasonably, then the vast majority of pirating would simply evaporate as people begrudge being ripped off.

Another issue in this global market place is availability. Quite simply some titles are never available through legal means or people have to subscribe to multiple media sources costing hundreds of pounds.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

The companies manage the subscription via the password, the password is valid for the length of subscription and can be renewed via it.

They don't even have my email address.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

It sounds really secure but I would not be happy to rely on what VPN sites say about anonymity.

A quick search revealed this from the 'golden frog' site, for example:

If a VPN provider kept absolutely no logs, they wouldn’t be able to:

- Offer plans with limits on GB usage or per user basis

- Limit VPN connections to 1, 3 or 5 on a per user basis

- Troubleshoot your connection or offer support for server-side problems

- Handle your DNS requests when using the VPN service. They might rely on a 3rd Party DNS provider that logs DNS requests

- Prevent abuse, such as spammers, port scanners and DDOS to protect their VPN service and their users.

Given the expertise we are witnessing of what hackers are actually capable of these days, I would not be at all confident that a future clamp down would not affect me if I used an illegal site to gain access to content that I should not be able to see. Sooner or later, the powers that be will catch up, and the huge amount of money being lost to content providers will be the driver to achieving this.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

So much for golden frog.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

:D

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

Indeed, users of public WiFi services often use VPN for security purposes. Others use VPN to access geographically restricted services as well, or US websites that block European users and vice versa.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

Speaking from personal experience of my Family & Friends, the cost of one service (such as Netflix) is not the issue.

The problem is that to be able to watch everything you actually want to see, you need Netflix, Prime, Sky and some US ones we cannot even access in the UK.

If you only needed to pay for one source, you would eliminate a lot of illegal sharing.
Thats [part of] the appeal of torrent sites - you only need to go to one source for all your programmes.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

Although once in a while with torrenting I get an email off Sky advising the content is being shared illegally naming the title of what I downloaded. Mostly just TV episodes.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

Of course, that's where Sky, Virgin Media, et al can help. If they provided bundles of SVOD services the same way as they do with scheduled pay tv channels, you would only have to pay one subscription for the lot, and presumably at a cheaper price than if you subscribed to each service separately.

---------- Post added at 18:51 ---------- Previous post was at 18:48 ----------

I think you should be careful, Stephen. Clearly, they can identify you, and although to date they have been concentrating on the big players, sooner or later, they will go for the punters. The compensation they will be after will be considerable and will far outweigh the benefits of free or discounted viewing you have been able to access to date.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

What do you expect if you don't use a VPN?

If you do use one I would seriously consider changing to a different one.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

That's right, it's only matter of time before the 'speculative invoicers' return, I wouldn't torrent anything without a VPN

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

Exactamundo. Netflix helped reduce piracy because it was the one service you needed to mostly cover all your viewing needs. Now that everyone and their dog are pulling things from Netflix and setting up their own exclusive streaming service, it's turning into a mess of providers and there isnt a hope in hell people will subscribe to many of them. Piracy will increase again, and its the fault of the big corporations just mindlessly making a land-grab for more profits.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

Piracy will never go away

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

Most certainly not until the prices come down on the content people want.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

As if that will ever happen!:rolleyes:

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

You mean like bluestacks with showbox.

That went down the other day as well. I agree though piracy is always going to be about especially when you have VM packages in the range of £74 a month and that doesn't even cover the things like Netflix/Amazon

I would like to see a service where I can view the latest cinema release from home without having to take a trip to the cinema when I can't be bothered

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

I actually believe the price is (in some cases) irrelevant, because there are those who want everything for free.

Piracy won't go away, and I think to some extent, Hollywood actually needs it. It can generate publicity for shows and films that would otherwise have nothing. Game of Thrones for instance. That was a relatively small, very expensive show at the start, then really took off when season one became the most pirated show ever.

But, I am digressing. I think Piracy is probably being reduced, although mainly by services such as Netflix, Prime Video and all the various subscription music services. I suspect even those selling dodgy TV boxes and sticks will ultimately suffer because these services are starting to offer a lot of the content offered by those boxes for a lot less money, and legally. Of course, they won't replace everything, such as sports, but I think they will help.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

You could give it away and people would download illegally, its human nature.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

The net prepares to start closing in.

https://www.digitaltveurope.com/2018...cy-watch-list/

---------- Post added at 13:50 ---------- Previous post was at 13:48 ----------

Not if the fines imposed ensured that it was not worthwhile to do so. With better detection and enforcement, things could change quite quickly. At present, viewers of pirated material think they can access whatever they want with impunity. That's why so many people do it.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

The net only closes in those jurisdictions where it is illegal, the Internet is global, and TPB hate that.

The only sane thing the authorities could do to make a dent in it, would be to ban private VPN usage, and restrict it to Business use only.

But you know what? someone would find a new way to circumnavigate that, as I said it's all just cat and mouse, somedays the cat wins, mostly the mouse, you DID watch Tom & Jerry as a child right?

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

They seem a lot more concerned about illegal streaming these days, rather than torrents.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

They won't ban VPN useage. However the GDPR legislation does show that countries can impose laws which can impact on people abroad.

I think something will happen along these lines in the future, although I don't know how far off that is yet. However, even with the present situation, if US companies providing or distributing content were able to track you down one way or another, the US, presumably, could request extradition to make you face the consequences of your actions through the US courts. I know some will argue that you are safe with a good VPN, but you know what, I am not convinced. I simply wouldn't risk it, and I don't believe that the police won't be able to track you down if they raided the companies providing these services, inspected the records that they lead you to believe they don't keep and used technical devices to track down illegal streaming.

I am concerned that such a bombshell could suddenly land without warning and ensnare UK offenders before they had a chance to mend their ways with a pre-warning. I do think everyone should be very careful now, this situation won't be allowed to continue. There is too much money being lost.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

It made me chuckle when one of the bigger VPN suppliers started advertising their product on national TV.

Of course no one who acquires a VPN service has any intention of streaming the latest videos from some Kodi streaming service or bypassing the UK's ISP's ban on Piratebay.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

I think it's a case of what gets the most bang for your buck.

It's going to cost a certain amount to catch each torrenter, then there will be costs involved in retrieving any money (including court, possibly). That would get a few downloaders.

If you catch the owner of a illegal streaming service, it's probably going to cost around the same as a torrenter, but would stop dozens, potentially hundreds, if not thousands of people viewing the content illegally.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

How naive of you. That is not a crack down on piracy as such but those who make money from it.

That I agree with.

No one who is actually part of piracy does it to make money. We do it freely and detest those who charge.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

Yes, I know, pip. It is very clear that they are concentrating on suppliers at the moment. All I am saying is that I doubt that it will stop there.

I mean, when you think of how much money Sky is losing through pirated Premiereship football streams, why wouldn't they go after those who have viewed matches for free if they had a means to do so?

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

Personally I don't give a sh*t about football but Hey-Ho.

Sky pays millions to fund companies that own football teams to pay millions to a few players for a few years to "entertain" the masses.

Football used to be a sport, it is not now.

I say screw the (insert whatever you wish).

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

Because they obviously feel it's better to try and stop the distribution of it than the people viewing it.

Shut one source down and another pops up it's impossible to fully eradicate it.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

The answer to this is something that will never happen anytime soon.

What the studios are doing is attempting to produce their own streaming service that just will not work.

Think about it. You sign up to a package with VM and get channels you have no interest in but you still pay for.

I'm sorry guys until I can watch when I want to watch on a paid for legal platform I' ll continue to be a pirate with KODI.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

Well thats their own fault.

If they didnt pay stupid amounts of money for the matches in the first place, then they wouldnt "lose" so much.

Its also somewhat nonsense anyway, most of the pirates would simply not watch the matches if they had to pay, so thay have not "lost" anything.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

Well that's all right then.

If they are caught they can claim they didn't do anything wrong as they weren't depriving sky of any income - absolutely unbelievable:confused:

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

What Paul says is true though. I receive the Sky Cinema channels for virtually nothing, but this isn't costing VM or Sky anything as I wouldnt pay for them anyway.

In fact, as this was done by way of an apology for the way that frontline staff treated me, it could be argued that this concession actually makes them money, as without it, I would probably have closed multiple accounts over time.

If someone steals a bar of chocolate from a shop instead of buying it, the shop has lost the full cost of the product. However, if the person wouldn't/couldn't afford to buy it and stole it, the shop has only lost the cost of the chocolate at trade price.

There's multiple ways of looking at things.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

Silly analogy Richard.

I will not pay for something in 6 months time that I can watch now.

Can I have a bar of chocolate now?

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

That’s not how it works...

VM have to pay Sky a fixed amount for every subscriber who they register as watching their channels, whether or not VM have given those channels to the subscriber for nothing/a reduced amount.

So if you have got them for nothing/near to nothing, it has cost VM something.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

And yet I can watch something for nothing about 6mths before you pay to watch it.

Not only that but I've already seen the Arrow Universe crossover totally free and legal.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

And if everyone did this, there would be nothing to pirate, as there would be no revenues to fund the making of programmes/films.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

I think you missed the legal bit.

http://watch.ustvnow.com/guide

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

My apologies - I was replying to that post, and was thinking of your previous post, where you stated

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

Would it be safer if people went onto the dark web to pirate things? I think you need a VPN anyway for the dark web, so that would help with anonymity too.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

You don't need the dark web but a VPN is a must.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

Exactly.

My sympathy, if you can call it that, for Big Media/Hollywood evaporated when they brought out DVD regions. That and all the constant special, special editions of Star Wars etc. Talk about paying for something twice, three, four times over...

The biggest gift to the world was Microsoft leaking leaking the video compression tech onto the internet, that and the arrival of broadband in around 2004ish.

As has already been said, until you can go onto a legal site and get everything immediately, then piracy will still flourish.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

A VPN is not a must to be an online pirate unless you're using public torrent sites or trying to bypass ISP blocks.
Its very easy to download this weeks latest "Linux iso" totally encrypted without using a VPN.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

The latest (or any) "Linux iso" has nothing whatsoever to do with Piracy.

Bit torrent protocols are a legitimate legal method of Linux distribution.

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

LOL. :rofl:

You do realise he doesnt really mean the actual latest linux distribution. ;)

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

:rofl:

Thanks @pip08456 on a boring and slow day you have brought a big smile to my face :)

Re: Is piracy on the way out and will VM and Sky benefit?
 

Of course.



Happy to oblige.:D