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-   -   General : 4 upstream channel bonding - post here (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/showthread.php?t=33705315)

Ignitionnet 27-08-2017 22:49

4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
As the title says, post here if you have 4 upstream channels bonded on your modem, alongside where in the country you are and upstream stats if you can.

It's a project in progress on the VM network so it'd be interesting to see just where they are.

It's a precursor to higher upstream speeds having the 4 channel bonding done.

daveybm 28-08-2017 10:20

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
1 Attachment(s)
4 x 16QAM, Area20 Wirral

Paul 28-08-2017 17:22

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Still only two here (Nottingham).

Cromulent 28-08-2017 19:48

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Only two here as well. Surrey. I'm on VIVID 350 as well so they are not giving higher speed customers priority.

vm_tech 28-08-2017 20:48

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Cromulent (Post 35914319)
Only two here as well. Surrey. I'm on VIVID 350 as well so they are not giving higher speed customers priority.

The tier the customers on won't have any bearing on how many upstreams are in use. It's all about the equipment out in the field. Some areas have 65mhz upstreams some have 42mhz. The 42mhz areas on only physically fit 3 upstreams, so the modems will run on 2 of the 3. The 42mhz areas will be upgraded in due course though. And the areas running older kit, as the future plan will be to go above 65mhz

2pence 29-08-2017 04:20

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
1 Attachment(s)
Still 2 here.

Ignitionnet 29-08-2017 09:31

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
I was rather hoping people with 4 channel bonding would post, not people who are still not on it, and the first post makes clear what I had in mind.

This was a thread modeled after the ones here.

http://www.dslreports.com/forum/comcast

Looks like it's a bit late for that. Oh well. :)

ianch99 29-08-2017 10:14

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Can someone explain the benefits of moving to 4 upstream channels (from 2)? Many thanks!

pip08456 29-08-2017 10:24

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ianch99 (Post 35914369)
Can someone explain the benefits of moving to 4 upstream channels (from 2)? Many thanks!

Read the first post.

joglynne 29-08-2017 12:20

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Manchester ( Baguley) area 20.

Paul 29-08-2017 13:32

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35914364)
I was rather hoping people with 4 channel bonding would post, not people who are still not on it, and the first post makes clear what I had in mind.

Your stated aim was to see how far the project had progressed.
Quote:

It's a project in progress on the VM network so it'd be interesting to see just where they are.
Therefore knowing it has not reached an area seems as useful as knowing it has, otherwise you have no idea one way or the other for that given area.

Queb 29-08-2017 15:24

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
4 bonded upstreams wolverhampton

ianch99 29-08-2017 16:32

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by pip08456 (Post 35914372)
Read the first post.

Thanks for your helpful reply.

The reason I asked was when I was researching this to better understand things, I came across this on the Wikipedia page:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DOCSIS

Quote:

Throughput

The first three versions of the DOCSIS standard support a downstream throughput with 256-QAM of up to 42.88 Mbit/s per 6 MHz channel (approximately 38 Mbit/s after overhead), or 55.62 Mbit/s per 8 MHz channel for EuroDOCSIS (approximately 50 Mbit/s after overhead). The upstream throughput possible is 30.72 Mbit/s per 6.4 MHz channel (approximately 27 Mbit/s after overhead), or 10.24 Mbit/s per 3.2 MHz channel (approximately 9 Mbit/s after overhead).
so I was curious if the 2 channels we have now can, in the real world, be pushed to get nearer these theoretical limits (2 channels ==> 54Mbps). The only reason I went to 350/20 is for the upload and so if our CMTS is stuck on 2 channels for the time being, would this preclude higher uploads even though, on first reading, the DOCSIS page hints at more.

Kushan 29-08-2017 16:44

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ianch99 (Post 35914436)
Thanks for your helpful reply.

The reason I asked was when I was researching this to better understand things, I came across this on the Wikipedia page:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DOCSIS



so I was curious if the 2 channels we have now can, in the real world, be pushed to get nearer these theoretical limits (2 channels ==> 54Mbps). The only reason I went to 350/20 is for the upload and so if our CMTS is stuck on 2 channels for the time being, would this preclude higher uploads even though, on first reading, the DOCSIS page hints at more.

More channels = more speed.

Though having more channels doesn't mean you'll get more speed, it does mean Virgin can push more speed down the line.

Sephiroth 31-08-2017 19:47

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
RG41

Upstream bonded channels
Channel ID Frequency(Hz) Mode Power
(dBmV) Modulation Channel Bandwidth(Hz) Symbol Rate (ksps)
6 39400000 ATDMA 45.3 64 qam 6400000 5120
8 25800000 ATDMA 45.3 16 qam 6400000 5120
7 32600000 ATDMA 45.3 64 qam 6400000 5120
5 46200000 ATDMA 45.3 64 qam 6400000 5120

When I use the SNMP browser call on the Hub 3, my mini-slot size has dropped from 4 to 2.

---------- Post added at 19:47 ---------- Previous post was at 19:40 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by ianch99 (Post 35914436)
Thanks for your helpful reply.

The reason I asked was when I was researching this to better understand things, I came across this on the Wikipedia page:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DOCSIS



so I was curious if the 2 channels we have now can, in the real world, be pushed to get nearer these theoretical limits (2 channels ==> 54Mbps). The only reason I went to 350/20 is for the upload and so if our CMTS is stuck on 2 channels for the time being, would this preclude higher uploads even though, on first reading, the DOCSIS page hints at more.

You would get the 20 meg if the upstream contention is low.

General Maximus 01-09-2017 19:26

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ianch99 (Post 35914436)
The only reason I went to 350/20 is for the upload and so if our CMTS is stuck on 2 channels for the time being, would this preclude higher uploads even though, on first reading, the DOCSIS page hints at more.

I am on 2 channels and have no problems uploading at 2.54MB/sec

ianch99 01-09-2017 19:58

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by General Maximus (Post 35914915)
I am on 2 channels and have no problems uploading at 2.54MB/sec

Nor me:

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2017/08/10.png

I was just curious what speeds 2 channels could actually support in the (VM) real world when the Wikipedia maximum is over 50Mbps

General Maximus 01-09-2017 22:47

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
it is all depends on the modulation of the upstreams. Some are still QAM16 and some are QAM64. Those that are QAM64 have a 50% increase on throughput vs QAM16

http://www.radio-electronics.com/inf...qam-256qam.php

Sephiroth 01-09-2017 23:59

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by General Maximus (Post 35914933)
it is all depends on the modulation of the upstreams. Some are still QAM16 and some are QAM64. Those that are QAM64 have a 50% increase on throughput vs QAM16

http://www.radio-electronics.com/inf...qam-256qam.php

But that additional throughput goes away when you only allow 2 ticks instead of 4 for your transmit window. Nothing else has moved; it's still a 6.4MHz wide channel (as evidenced by the 5120K symbols/sec rate); the tick is still 6.25us.

Or, as Igni has mooted (not in his words though), has Cisco increased simultaneity at the CMTS so as to allow smaller transmit windows and thus allow more users to to get onto the upstream with smaller amounts of data that won't get too much contention at the CMTS. Something like that?

General Maximus 02-09-2017 09:12

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
they must have done something because they wouldn't have spent all that time trying to get the upstreams up to qam64 if it wasn't going to provide some benefit to them (you know what VM are like).

Sephiroth 02-09-2017 09:43

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by General Maximus (Post 35914946)
they must have done something because they wouldn't have spent all that time trying to get the upstreams up to qam64 if it wasn't going to provide some benefit to them (you know what VM are like).

They have the aim of giving at least 10:1. So by cleaning up the upstream components, they can get to 64QAM under DOCSIS 3.0.

And then they reduce the Mini-slot size from 4 to 2. Thinking deeper, and again with an eye to what Igni said, they may be using something more powerful at the Cisco CMTS end by way of FEC correction; like the DOCSIS 3.1 FEC handling regime. Whether or not that sits well with DOCSIS 2 or DOCSIS 3, I don't know. But it is the only thing I can think of that increases upstream efficiency. Igni will no doubt put me right on this.

General Maximus 02-09-2017 09:53

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
yeah, I just can't wait for docsis 3.1 though. I had a quick read of the wiki article and it is going to be like jumping to warp speed.

JordanTheToaster 02-09-2017 12:03

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
And all I want is more than 20 up for once.

Kushan 07-09-2017 13:34

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by General Maximus (Post 35914951)
yeah, I just can't wait for docsis 3.1 though. I had a quick read of the wiki article and it is going to be like jumping to warp speed.

Unfortunately I doubt Virgin will be rolling it out like that, I expect the initial 3.1 trials to use the same kinds of speeds we get now. I expect it'll be some years before we see gigabit downloads and probably a good 5+ years at the least before we see 100Mbit+ upload speeds.

Ignitionnet 07-09-2017 13:40

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
They are rolling it out like that, though using 3.0 upload channels for the foreseeable. Still plenty of life in 3.0 as a whole so no rush.

heero_yuy 03-05-2018 09:15

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
We had a power cut yesterday for an hour just after midday but it took til after eight for the boxes to reconnect but now I have 4 upstreams bonded on the SH1 but only at QAM16:

Upstream US-1 US-2 US-3 US-4
Channel Type 2.0 2.0 2.0 2.0
Channel ID 68 65 66 67
Frequency (Hz) 53700000 Hz 45800000 Hz 35800000 Hz 27400000 Hz
Ranging Status Success Success Success Success
Modulation QAM16 QAM16 QAM16 QAM16
Symbol Rate (Sym/sec) 5120000 5120000 5120000 5120000
Mini-Slot Size 128 64 128 128
Power Level (dBmV) 47.0 dBmV 46.0 dBmV 46.8 dBmV 46.8 dBmV
T1 Timeouts 0 0 0 0
T2 Timeouts 0 0 0 0
T3 Timeouts 2 2 2 2
T4 Timeouts 0 0 0 0

Power levels up and down are nicely within spec. :)

General Maximus 03-05-2018 12:00

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by heero_yuy (Post 35945658)
but only at QAM16:

Upstream US-1 US-2 US-3 US-4
Modulation QAM16 QAM16 QAM16 QAM16

they are all qam16

heero_yuy 03-05-2018 13:06

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
They've all moved up to QAM64 now. :)

ileikcaek 03-05-2018 13:49

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
I've had four upstream channels for at least seven months now, but they are all still on QAM16

https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2018/05/2.png

General Maximus 03-05-2018 19:43

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
if you get full speed and there aren't any congestion issues them don't worry about it. Moving all 4 channels to qam64 only gives you a 50% bandwidth increase.

trublue 04-05-2018 20:34

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
I don't usually check my network status, but after reading this thread I thought I would.When I checked it yesterday, I only had one upstream channel, I did a reboot and found I now have 4 :).Living in the Blackburn area.

Upstream Channels Lock Status Channel ID Frequency Modulation Tx Power Mode Channel Bandwidth Symbol Rate
Locked 4 25800000 Hz ATDMA 49.5 dBmV 64QAM 6400000 Hz 5120 Ksym/sec
Locked 2 39400000 Hz ATDMA 49.5 dBmV 64QAM 6400000 Hz 5120 Ksym/sec
Locked 1 46200000 Hz ATDMA 48.5 dBmV 64QAM 6400000 Hz 5120 Ksym/sec
Locked 3 32600000 Hz ATDMA 49.3 dBmV 64QAM 6400000 Hz 5120 Ksym/sec

General Maximus 04-05-2018 20:54

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
You should never have 1 upstream and everyone should be on a minimum of 2. I was going to put it down to you misreading the stats but i think it has got something to do with your power levels. If they creep above you are going to start having problems and would explain why you can only only see 1 channel. Keep your eye on it.

trublue 04-05-2018 22:12

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Thanks for that GM, and I will keep an eye on them.

General Maximus 04-05-2018 22:48

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
If the power levels get too high it becomes unstable, you will drop your connection while the interface resets that will be when you only lock onto one upstream because the levels are out whack. Either that or it is so bad you wont lock onto any at all at which point it will start all over again. Are you getting any t3 or t4 timeouts?

trublue 05-05-2018 16:10

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Is it possible for the upstream to fluctuate between 1 & 4 channels? I have googled what you mentioned regarding t3 and t4 timeouts, but still none the wiser. I don't have any problems with my broadband speeds or connection problems as far as I know.I have noticed my power levels are slightly higher than yesterday.

Upstream Channels
Lock Status Channel ID Frequency Modulation Tx Power Mode Channel Bandwidth Symbol Rate
Locked 4 25800000 Hz ATDMA 49.8 dBmV 64QAM 6400000 Hz 5120 Ksym/sec
Locked 2 39400000 Hz ATDMA 50.0 dBmV 64QAM 6400000 Hz 5120 Ksym/sec
Locked 1 46200000 Hz ATDMA 48.5 dBmV 64QAM 6400000 Hz 5120 Ksym/sec
Locked 3 32600000 Hz ATDMA 49.3 dBmV 64QAM 6400000 Hz 5120 Ksym/sec

General Maximus 05-05-2018 16:47

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by trublue (Post 35945986)
Is it possible for the upstream to fluctuate between 1 & 4 channels?

Nope, it has been about 15 years since people were on one upstream channel. You should be on at least two and most people are on three or four. They operate in what are called "bonding groups" up to a maximum of 4 channels. If 4 channels are available to your area then you use all 4 channels all the time, not some random number up to 4.

Quote:

Originally Posted by trublue (Post 35945986)
I have googled what you mentioned regarding t3 and t4 timeouts, but still none the wiser.

I wasn't trying to confuse you. Which shub have you got? There should be a table similar to your power levels under the same upstream tab which tell you how many T1, T2, T3 and T4 timeouts you have, ideally it should be 0. As an example, if you have got a shub 3 it will look like this:


SnoopZ 05-05-2018 18:33

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Has it really been 15 years since only 1 upstream? Surely that is not right?

trublue 05-05-2018 18:46

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
I know you weren't trying to confuse me, I'm just a little thick:) I am on shub 2, the only info I found on time outs was this

Modem Initialisation
Stage Status
Downstream Acquisition Locked
Primary Frequency 266750000 Hz
DHCP Done
TFTP Done
Time Of Day 18:36:07 BST
Security BPI+
Counters T1,T2,T3,T4,Sync,Resets 000,000,000,000,000,000

General Maximus 05-05-2018 20:01

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SnoopZ (Post 35945993)
Has it really been 15 years since only 1 upstream? Surely that is not right?

fair enough, more like 12 years because I can remember having one upstream on my ambit 256

Quote:

Originally Posted by trublue (Post 35945995)
I am on shub 2, the only info I found on time outs was this

Counters T1,T2,T3,T4,Sync,Resets 000,000,000,000,000,000

that's cool, no T3 or T4 timeouts which is good. Apart from that reboot you did have you been experiencing any connectivity issues/drop outs or has everything been okay as far as you are aware?

SnoopZ 05-05-2018 20:47

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
I was thinking it was like 5years since we went to 2 upstreams but I can't find any info on it, just shocked it has been that many years since we all went to 2.

Anyone know for sure?

General Maximus 05-05-2018 21:08

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SnoopZ (Post 35946008)
I was thinking it was like 5years since we went to 2 upstreams

Na, i had 2 upstreams on my ambit 300 and that was back in 2009 at least.

trublue 05-05-2018 22:38

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
I did lose my connection last week for a minute or so, I just put it down to my VPN playing up. Thanks again for taking the time to answer my queries, much appreciated.

General Maximus 06-05-2018 10:35

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
np, if you power levels go above 50 or you start experiencing drop outs you need to give VM a ring on 150 and a tech to come out and fix it. As an fyi we haven't discussed your downstream power levels but anything between -7 and +7 is ok and they want to be as close to 0 as possible. Around 0 and +3 is awesome.

trublue 06-05-2018 13:53

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
My downstream channels are averaging around +2.3 so no problem there. Upstream seems to be consistent at between 49.5 for 3 channels with one at 50, so I will keep an eye on these and for drop outs.

heero_yuy 06-05-2018 14:15

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
If you've not already done it set up a BQM monitor at thinkbroadband. If you start seeing packet loss or increasing latency then it's onto VM to get it fixed.

trublue 07-05-2018 20:44

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Should I be concerned about this?

https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2018/05/4.png

General Maximus 07-05-2018 21:08

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Na that's fine. You dont need to be anal about checking the graph but if you think your connection is playing up or you start getting random disconnects then you need to check the graph. You are looking for fat red lines top to bottom.

trublue 07-05-2018 21:55

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Thank you, GM.

dave.m 10-05-2018 09:09

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Work being done in my area today (Northants - Kettering) Area 31

Gone from 2 to 4 up streams.

US-1 US-2 US-3 US-4
Channel Type 2.0 2.0 2.0 2.0
Channel ID 89 92 91 90
Frequency (Hz) 46200000 25800000 32600000 39400000
Ranging Status Success Success Success Success
Modulation 16QAM 16QAM 16QAM 16QAM
Symbol Rate (Sym/sec) 5120000 5120000 5120000 5120000
Mini-Slot Size 4 2 2 4
Power Level (dBmV) 46.21 43.75 44.75 45.75

Sephiroth 10-05-2018 18:10

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dave.m (Post 35946415)
Work being done in my area today (Northants - Kettering) Area 31

Gone from 2 to 4 up streams.

US-1 US-2 US-3 US-4
Channel Type 2.0 2.0 2.0 2.0
Channel ID 89 92 91 90
Frequency (Hz) 46200000 25800000 32600000 39400000
Ranging Status Success Success Success Success
Modulation 16QAM 16QAM 16QAM 16QAM
Symbol Rate (Sym/sec) 5120000 5120000 5120000 5120000
Mini-Slot Size 4 2 2 4
Power Level (dBmV) 46.21 43.75 44.75 45.75

Do post them again later today when it's settled down. The Mini-slot size is all over the place and one of the power levels (US-1) looks like its moving around.

checker 12-05-2018 09:45

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Four bonded here in Derby

Upstream bonded channels
Channel Frequency (Hz) Power (dBmV) Symbol Rate (ksps) Modulation Channel ID
1 39400000 45.8 5120 16 qam 83
2 32600000 45.3 5120 16 qam 84
3 46200000 45.8 5120 16 qam 82
4 53700000 46.8 5120 16 qam 81

dave.m 14-05-2018 07:18

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sephiroth (Post 35946455)
Do post them again later today when it's settled down. The Mini-slot size is all over the place and one of the power levels (US-1) looks like its moving around.

This is after a reboot yesterday morning. The T3 timeouts are during start up only. Connection seems fine.

US-1 US-2 US-3 US-4
Channel Type 2.0 2.0 2.0 2.0
Channel ID 91 92 90 89
Frequency (Hz) 32600000 25800000 39400000 46200000
Ranging Status Success Success Success Success
Modulation 16QAM 16QAM 16QAM 16QAM
Symbol Rate (Sym/sec) 5120000 5120000 5120000 5120000
Mini-Slot Size 2 2 4 4
Power Level (dBmV) 43.75 42.75 44.75 45.00
T1 Timeouts 0 0 0 0
T2 Timeouts 0 0 0 0
T3 Timeouts 2 0 0 0
T4 Timeouts 0 0 0 0
https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2018/05/5.png
https://www.thinkbroadband.com/broad...Broadband Ping

jcm193 14-05-2018 08:08

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
We also now have 4 upstream channels is Torbay ive no idea when they appeared though


Channel Frequency (Hz) Power (dBmV) Symbol Rate (ksps) Modulation Channel ID
1 25800000 45.8 5120 64 qam 36
2 32600000 47 5120 64 qam 35
3 39400000 47.8 5120 64 qam 34
4 46200000 47.5 5120 64 qam 33

Rexz 14-05-2018 09:09

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Upstream Channels
Lock Status Channel ID Frequency Modulation Tx Power Mode Channel Bandwidth Symbol Rate
Locked 78 39400000 Hz ATDMA 44.5 dBmV 16QAM 6400000 Hz 5120 Ksym/sec
Locked 77 46200000 Hz ATDMA 45.0 dBmV 16QAM 6400000 Hz 5120 Ksym/sec
NotLocked 0 0 Hz 0 dBmV 0 Ksym/sec
NotLocked 0 0 Hz 0 dBmV 0 Ksym/sec


Still 2 upstream channels in Newton Abbot...

---------- Post added at 09:09 ---------- Previous post was at 09:00 ----------

US-1 US-2 US-3 US-4
Channel Type 2.0 2.0 2.0 2.0
Channel ID 78 80 79 77
Frequency (Hz) 39400000 25800000 32600000 46200000
Ranging Status Success Success Success Success
Modulation 16QAM 16QAM 16QAM 16QAM
Symbol Rate (Sym/sec) 5120000 5120000 5120000 5120000
Mini-Slot Size 2 2 2 2
Power Level (dBmV) 44.75 42.25 43.00 45.00

Rebooted and got 4. All on 16QAM though...

General Maximus 14-05-2018 22:17

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
don't worry about it, qam64 is only 50% faster than qam16 so you aren't missing out on much, especially if you haven't got any speed probs anyway.

Neo-Tech 17-05-2018 15:51

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
In Heckmondwide.

US-1 US-2 US-3 US-4
Channel Type 2.0 2.0 2.0 2.0
Channel ID 85 87 86 88
Frequency (Hz) 46200000 32600000 39400000 25800000
Ranging Status Success Success Success Success
Modulation 16QAM 16QAM 16QAM 16QAM
Symbol Rate (Sym/sec) 5120000 5120000 5120000 5120000
Mini-Slot Size 2 2 2 2
Power Level (dBmV) 41.00 40.50 41.50 39.25
T1 Timeouts 0 0 0 0
T2 Timeouts 0 0 0 0
T3 Timeouts 0 0 0 0
T4 Timeouts 0 0 0 0

JordanTheToaster 25-05-2018 12:30

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Guess I'm part of the 4 upstream club now.

https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2018/05/9.png

ethan103 25-05-2018 14:55

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
what does this mean from my hub?


https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2018/05/10.png

General Maximus 25-05-2018 18:48

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ethan103 (Post 35948001)
what does this mean from my hub?

you are using 4 upstream channels

ethan103 25-05-2018 20:21

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by General Maximus (Post 35948020)
you are using 4 upstream channels

Is that good or bad >.<

heero_yuy 26-05-2018 07:24

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
4 is better than 2. QAM64 better than QAM16.

It allows the system to better balance / share the available capacity.

ethan103 26-05-2018 09:55

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by heero_yuy (Post 35948060)
4 is better than 2. QAM64 better than QAM16.

It allows the system to better balance / share the available capacity.


Is there any chance of getting QAM64 or do this not get upgraded readily by VM?

And what does that do, provide faster speeds or does it help with latency?

Synthetic 26-05-2018 10:07

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Has anyone noticed an actual improvement in service when going from 3-4 upstreams?

Still on 3 but never had an issue with congestion, suspect that's why we're still on 3 :D

https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2018/05/11.png

heero_yuy 26-05-2018 10:08

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
The level of modulation used is a result of the hub negotiating the connection to the cabinet. If the signal to noise ratio is good enough the connection will automatically go to QAM64.

Higher modulation means more throughput and you're more likely to get your provisioned speed.

Don't think it improves latency though.

General Maximus 26-05-2018 11:54

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ethan103 (Post 35948072)
And what does that do, provide faster speeds?

I wont bore you with the technical details but qam64 is 50% faster than qam16. The idea is that more channels increases the amount of available bandwidth and couple that with increased modulation increases it further. So.........going from 2 upstreams at qam16 (which is what everyone used to be on) to 4 upstreams on qam64 triples (x3) the amount of available bandwidth to you. It sounds great but isn't going to do anything for you unless you had issues to start off with (which I never have) plus it gives them plenty of leg room for future upgrades.

Quote:

Originally Posted by heero_yuy (Post 35948074)
Don't think it improves latency though.

nope

Quote:

Originally Posted by Synthetic (Post 35948073)
Has anyone noticed an actual improvement in service when going from 3-4 upstreams?

nope

Jon22 26-05-2018 12:57

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by General Maximus (Post 35948076)
So.........going from 2 upstreams at qam16 (which is what everyone used to be on)

Some areas still are on that. I know this area was, unless it's changed in the last few weeks. I could connect the Hub up to see, still got a week or so before the cancellation goes through.

SnoopZ 26-05-2018 13:09

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Yes still on 2 upstreams in cb24, I am along way from the cabinet so I guess that is why I never see qam64.

Inactive Digital 26-05-2018 18:13

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jon22 (Post 35948081)
Some areas still are on that. I know this area was, unless it's changed in the last few weeks. I could connect the Hub up to see, still got a week or so before the cancellation goes through.

I visited my parents in Newport today and they are on 4 x 16qam. I'm a few miles down the road still on 2 x 16qam.

JordanTheToaster 26-05-2018 20:16

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
The only thing I've noticed is that my graph went from this:

https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2018/05/12.png


To this:

https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2018/05/13.png

Jon22 26-05-2018 23:18

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Inactive Digital (Post 35948108)
I visited my parents in Newport today and they are on 4 x 16qam. I'm a few miles down the road still on 2 x 16qam.

Interesting, wonder if the local node has been done. Hopefully it has as would of helped with the upstream congestion, if not solved it. Still not enough for me to cancel the cancellation though.

cje85 27-05-2018 11:00

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
I now have 4 bonded upstreams since rebooting my hub yesterday (St Helens area).

1 32600000 36.3 5120 16 qam 3
2 53700000 37.8 5120 64 qam 5
3 25800000 36.3 5120 16 qam 4
4 39400000 37.8 5120 16 qam 2

Only 537 is 64QAM but I've been told that's normal for my area?

kalleh 27-05-2018 17:02

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by JordanTheToaster (Post 35948135)
The only thing I've noticed is that my graph went from this:

https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2018/05/14.png


To this:

https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2018/05/15.png

More Upstream channels better latency as not as congested as before.

JordanTheToaster 27-05-2018 17:54

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
I thought so still a welcome surprise just getting 4 up channels randomly.

kalleh 27-05-2018 18:13

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by JordanTheToaster (Post 35948235)
I thought so still a welcome surprise just getting 4 up channels randomly.

Let's hope the next step is a capable CPE with has a modem mode from day 1 and no chipset issues :)

Jon22 05-06-2018 20:44

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
4x QAM64 upstream channels on my Dad’s connection now. On Telf14.

rhooton 06-06-2018 21:59

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
I'm on 4 x QAM64 upstream channels in Brighton area 20

Inactive Digital 06-06-2018 22:43

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jon22 (Post 35949405)
4x QAM64 upstream channels on my Dad’s connection now. On Telf14.

Still 2 x 16qam in Muxton. Can't say I've ever noticed any upstream issues though, so probably no need for more.

SnoopZ 07-06-2018 11:15

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
I am not on 4 yet but have just gone to 2 qam64s for the first time ever so maybe they're upto something here too.

Jon22 07-06-2018 12:38

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Inactive Digital (Post 35949556)
Still 2 x 16qam in Muxton. Can't say I've ever noticed any upstream issues though, so probably no need for more.

I did a reboot of the Hub on Tuesday evening and then it came back with 4 upstream channels. Might be worth a try if you haven't already.

ccarmock 07-06-2018 20:22

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
SM4 area (fed from New Malden) Changed from 2 x 64QAM upstream channels to 3 x 64QAM upstream channels today. Was notified of config work as this is a business service, the work was listed as New Malden D3 config 8.

Surprised it didn't go right to 4 as in other areas.

JordanTheToaster 07-06-2018 21:33

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ccarmock (Post 35949697)
SM4 area (fed from New Malden) Changed from 2 x 64QAM upstream channels to 3 x 64QAM upstream channels today. Was notified of config work as this is a business service, the work was listed as New Malden D3 config 8.

Surprised it didn't go right to 4 as in other areas.

I went from 2 QAM64 to 3 QAM64 to now at 4 QAM64 so you might get yours soon.

raging bull 08-06-2018 05:42

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Here in Leeds went from 2 QAM16 to 4 QAM16.

Horizon 08-06-2018 16:46

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Been getting terrible download speeds the last day or so, so just checked the modem and I've got four upstream channels too. I'd rather have the faster downloads back! Getting a lot of T3 timeouts whatever that is.

East London.

Synthetic 08-06-2018 20:45

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Still 3 here but not had any issues up or down, which I guess is why we're still on 3!

Inactive Digital 08-06-2018 22:11

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jon22 (Post 35949621)
I did a reboot of the Hub on Tuesday evening and then it came back with 4 upstream channels. Might be worth a try if you haven't already.

Yes that sid the job: 4x 16qam now. I last rebooted on Monday/Tuesday so must have happened one day this week.

roughbeast 10-06-2018 12:16

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
1 Attachment(s)
Four channels appeared in the last few days, Coventry CV3. Looking at my TBB quality graph it seems teh conversion was done in the small hours of 7th. June.

No improvement in TBB graph quality.

SnoopZ 10-06-2018 12:31

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by roughbeast (Post 35949994)
Four channels appeared in the last few days, Coventry CV3. Looking at my TBB quality graph it seems teh conversion was done in the small hours of 7th. June.

No improvement in TBB graph quality.

Your upstream levels look on the low side.

roughbeast 10-06-2018 14:25

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by SnoopZ (Post 35949999)
Your upstream levels look on the low side.

No obvious effect on performance. I guess levels should be nearer 40.

Here's my downstream Channels 1 - 10 are lower - around 3 or 4 dBmv

General Maximus 10-06-2018 16:50

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SnoopZ (Post 35949999)
Your upstream levels look on the low side.

I think 30 is the magical number but still, I have never seen them that low but as long as everything is working okay there isn't anything to worry about. You might find he lives right next to the cabinet so his modem doesn't need a lot of power to get the signal back to the network.

Sephiroth 10-06-2018 17:13

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
There isn't really a magic upstream number. The way that DOCSIS works is that the upstream power level is never higher than is necessary for the CMTS and the Hub to communicate with each other as determined by the keep-alive traffic.


In Roughie's case, he is close to the cabinet and downstream power levels are therefore high (and upstream low). Although the lower frequency channels are knocking on 10 dBmv, the hot weather will decrease that as the metal expands. That said, it would do no harm to put an attenuator to the back of the hub - say 6 dB.

roughbeast 10-06-2018 21:15

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sephiroth (Post 35950028)
There isn't really a magic upstream number. The way that DOCSIS works is that the upstream power level is never higher than is necessary for the CMTS and the Hub to communicate with each other as determined by the keep-alive traffic.


In Roughie's case, he is close to the cabinet and downstream power levels are therefore high (and upstream low). Although the lower frequency channels are knocking on 10 dBmv, the hot weather will decrease that as the metal expands. That said, it would do no harm to put an attenuator to the back of the hub - say 6 dB.

Earlier this year engineers pulled through a new street coax for me because of low power levels that were affecting HD TV. To be certain of good service they put an attenuator in. I'm not sure of the dB value.

Sephiroth 10-06-2018 21:22

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
It could do with further attenuation just to be sure of staying within bounds.

PaulH225 12-06-2018 08:17

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
SO16 - had an outage yesterday and it's come back on with 4 upstreams:

Upstream
US-1 US-2 US-3 US-4
Channel Type 2.0 2.0 2.0 2.0
Channel ID 40 41 39 38
Frequency (Hz) 25800000 53700000 32600000 39400000
Ranging Status Success Success Success Success
Modulation 64QAM 64QAM 64QAM 64QAM
Symbol Rate 5120000 5120000 5120000 5120000
(Sym/sec)
Mini-Slot Size 2 2 2 2
Power Level 45.50 46.25 45.75 46.25
(dBmV)
T1 Timeouts 0 0 0 0
T2 Timeouts 0 0 0 0
T3 Timeouts 1 0 0 0
T4 Timeouts 0 0 0 0

Superhub 2AC

Paul

SnoopZ 17-06-2018 22:01

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SnoopZ (Post 35949608)
I am not on 4 yet but have just gone to 2 qam64s for the first time ever so maybe they're upto something here too.

It has now gone to 1x qam64 and 1x qam32.

rtho782 18-06-2018 08:58

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
I had an outage this morning and am now on 4xQAM64.

DS SNR is a bit low tho.

Quote:

Channel Frequency (Hz) Power (dBmV) SNR (dB) Modulation Channel ID
1 323000000 1.5 37 256 qam 24
2 315000000 1.2 37 256 qam 23
3 307000000 1.2 37 256 qam 22
4 299000000 1.5 38 256 qam 21
5 291000000 0.9 38 256 qam 20
6 283000000 1 38 256 qam 19
7 275000000 0.7 38 256 qam 18
8 267000000 0.9 37 256 qam 17
9 259000000 0.9 37 256 qam 16
10 251000000 1 37 256 qam 15
11 243000000 0.7 37 256 qam 14
12 235000000 0.7 37 256 qam 13
13 227000000 1 37 256 qam 12
14 219000000 0.7 37 256 qam 11
15 211000000 0.7 37 256 qam 10
16 203000000 0.5 37 256 qam 9
17 195000000 0.9 37 256 qam 8
18 187000000 0.9 37 256 qam 7
19 179000000 1 37 256 qam 6
20 171000000 0.9 37 256 qam 5
21 163000000 0.7 37 256 qam 4
22 155000000 0.9 37 256 qam 3
23 147000000 0.9 37 256 qam 2
24 139000000 -0.4 36 256 qam 1


Downstream bonded channels
Channel Locked Status RxMER (dB) Pre RS Errors Post RS Errors
1 Locked 37.6 0 0
2 Locked 37.6 5 0
3 Locked 38.6 5 0
4 Locked 38.6 9 0
5 Locked 38.9 0 0
6 Locked 38.9 4 0
7 Locked 37.6 2 0
8 Locked 37.6 5 0
9 Locked 37.6 0 0
10 Locked 37.6 5 0
11 Locked 37.6 5 0
12 Locked 37.6 1 0
13 Locked 37.3 6 0
14 Locked 37.6 0 0
15 Locked 37.3 6 0
16 Locked 37.6 0 0
17 Locked 37.6 5 0
18 Locked 37.6 6 0
19 Locked 37.3 5 0
20 Locked 37.6 4 0
21 Locked 37.6 2 0
22 Locked 37.6 6 0
23 Locked 37.6 7 0
24 Locked 36.3 2 0


Channel Frequency (Hz) Power (dBmV) Symbol Rate (ksps) Modulation Channel ID
1 39400000 47 5120 64 qam 6
2 25800000 47 5120 64 qam 8
3 32600000 47 5120 64 qam 7
4 46200000 47 5120 64 qam 5


Upstream bonded channels
Channel Channel Type T1 Timeouts T2 Timeouts T3 Timeouts T4 Timeouts
1 ATDMA 0 0 0 0
2 ATDMA 0 0 0 0
3 ATDMA 0 0 0 0
4 ATDMA 0 0 0 0

SnoopZ 18-06-2018 09:56

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SnoopZ (Post 35950943)
It has now gone to 1x qam64 and 1x qam32.


Now back to 2x qam64.

I do have concern about my DS SNR as it is around 31-35 and i get alot of pre rs errors and a few post errors on the odd channel now and then, but it doesn't seem to affect my internet but i do have an issue where a few channels on TV i can't get or break up!

So for all the installers here what are my options for fixing the TV channels and bumping up my DS SNR if i am already on the top tap, got a new thicker cable and an HDU-200 installed?

roughbeast 19-06-2018 09:14

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
1 Attachment(s)
What's all this then? Suddenly I have a slot for information on time-outs. This wasn't there until 2 days ago. There was an overnight reboot of SH3 and an instant improvement in the TBB quality graph.

Software version : 9.1.116.608

Sephiroth 19-06-2018 09:28

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
It is one of the firmware improvements.

Synthetic 20-06-2018 10:30

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
It's the Intel cpu "fix" that appears to prioritise ICMP so graphs look better :)

adduxi 21-06-2018 11:58

Re: 4 upstream channel bonding - post here
 
Noticed some red on the TBB yesterday and I rebooted when I got home.
We are now on 4 x 16QAM upstreams. BT27 area.


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