Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

I don't watch TV but I'm interested from a technical perspective:

Assuming Discovery Networks were to disappear from Sky in February, would that mean that VM's feed is affected?

Or (more likely maybe) would Sky / Discovery leave the satellite signal active (so VM can continue to receive it) but send an entitlement management message to Sky's customer's cards to disable the channels just for Sky viewers in the short term in case dispute has been resolved?

Or maybe VM already receive those channels via fibre?

As far as I know, VM take their discovery channel feeds from the same Astra satellite that feeds the Sky service - and they use Sky viewing cards. If this is so, then in theory, anyone who happens to have a third-party Videoguard CAM that doesn't receive EMMs from Sky were to accidentally take their official Sky card out of their Sky box just before the decision is taken to stop broadcasting, then accidentally insert that card into their third party Videoguard CAM, presumably they might be able to continue watching Discovery for a few days...

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Vms feed will be fine i believe VM use a sattelite feed then distribute that to their customers.
Someone more informed will know more about that than me.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

There will be no disruption http://community.virginmedia.com/t5/...s/bc-p/3322835

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

The majority of VM's HD channels are received line fed & uncompressed to the master headend near slough. Feeds can be added this way, not to mention several distribution satellites that VM also have dishes aimed at.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

I see - I was under the impression that most of it came down from Astra via rack mounted satellite receivers. This used to be the case in the late 90's at least when I saw inside a hub site. Although the signals come from the master headend now, I had the impression that it was still fed via Sky for the most part - although this might be less and less true nowadays.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Its not been that way for years. VM get their channels directly.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Some of it no doubt comes from Astra, there is also a capability of receiving several other satellites & from Freeview DTT, as the attached image shows:

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/08...r_to_the_sofa/

Well, part of my speculation was based on this from just over 2 years ago...

If Discovery is received via satellite, the signal is probably still there for VM to receive. The article also mentions that VM rotate their viewing cards (presumably so they receive EMMs through a standard Sky box since aftermarket Videoguard decoders don't apply updates to cards - although I'm not sure if that's true for Cisco ones).

I was always interested in how this stuff worked. Far more so than watching the actual content being broadcast ironically.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Well, i've been told that VM get their HD feeds by fibre and SD feeds via the satellite.

Can't remember if it was an SD or a HD channel that I was watching on VM last night, but the ticker advice for Sky customers appeared at the top (think it was Discovery Science).

I don't think that this has a HD variant, so perhaps this explains why the ticker is being shown to VM customers??

Could this mean that for technical reasons, as opposed to the Sky/Discovery dispute itself, that we will lose access to the SD Discovery channels from the 1st February??

---------- Post added at 16:32 ---------- Previous post was at 16:29 ----------

Looks like VM may have contingency plans (assuming that what I was told was correct)...

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Well, that's what I was asking - but I would imagine that the Astra satellite will still be used since it is a feed as well as direct-to-home. But since Sky don't have the contract themselves, they would need to disable their customers' viewing cards.

That's why I'm saying that if someone were to accidentally leave their card out of their box when it should be updated for Sky customers, a legitimage Sky card that didn't get the message for whatever reason might continue to work in a third-party Videoguard CAM that can't pass updates to the card. It would eventually switch off, of course.

Alternatively, the signal will disappear from Astra but VM has a fibre connection ready to go.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

I've just switched from Sky to VM - install a week on Monday. Having started watching snooker on Eurosport a couple of months ago I was really pleased with my decision as I would be facing the prospect of losing Eurosport should I have remained with Sky. I'm starting to get worried now having read this debate on whether or not VM will lose it.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Worry not. They won't.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Yeah don't let my speculation worry you, they'll already have a process in place whatever happens.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

If spiderplant says the Discovery channels will be in place on VM they will be!

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Perhaps this will convince you.

http://www.keepdiscovery.co.uk/faq/

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Willing to bet they don't disappear on Sky at all. There'll be a last minute deal etc etc. All brinkmanship over money and seeing who'll blink first. Bet Discovery do, Skys bullying and money usually holds sway.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Although it seems to be Discovery trying to use bully tactics this time around.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

l think you need to take those rose tinted glasses off for once.;)

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

I'd imagine discovery need sky a lot more than sky need them? I can only really see eurosport being a loss to sky customers and they dont even show that much on those channels anymore.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Pretty much agree Vince , I can live without the Discovery channels and most of the time Eurosport that said I don't see why I should pay what I am with those gone. I'll be ringing in should they go with a view to cancelling my contract even though I'm in term , if they offer me an incentive to stay that's a bonus.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

I thought the same but according to Discovery

"Every week, more than five and half million people watch one of our shows on Sky"

If that's accurate, there will be a number of cheesed off customers and they are starting to make their voices heard on Twitter.
https://twitter.com/DiscoveryUK/stat...41066337468416

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Indeed that is quite considerable if true and Sky would be very foolish and arrogant to underestimate the support of some pretty popular channels with quite a lot of customers.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Just checked BARB and the channels are quite popular although you can't see the number by provider.

http://www.barb.co.uk/viewing-data/w...ewing-summary/

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Oh silly me ofcourse my bad i forgot that any company associated with Malone can do no wrong to you dear sir, although social media states otherwise regarding Discoverys behaviour in trying to get sky customers to phone skys customer service which in turn creates problems for genuine enquries getting through.
But silly me must have rose tint glasses on eh? :rolleyes:
If Discovery are so confident they are worth as much as they want then why don't they go it alone?
Oh that's right because not many would subscribe to their reality tv crap (excluding eurosport as that has it's own player).
But hey ho i'm the one with rose tinted glasses on, time you took your head out of the sand young man.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Do you think Sky are some tinpot operation ? They've been surveying people for over a year on what channels they like and questioning specific to these I'm pretty sure they'll have an idea as to how this will impact subscriber numbers. It's a game between two huge corporations which one will cave first.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Now tell me where have stated that Mr Malone can do no wrong??? as l am pretty sure he ain't much better then nefarious Rupert.

---------- Post added at 13:37 ---------- Previous post was at 13:36 ----------

6 million customers a week watching Discovery channels on Sky's platform is nothing to be sniffed at.

---------- Post added at 13:42 ---------- Previous post was at 13:37 ----------

And less of the young please as l am probably old enough to be your father although you have to remember when one is getting on in years one generally becomes more dense as the brain starts to go.;)

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

The young was a compliment :p:
Discovery claim 6 million customers a week but how many will they get if they went it alone? I'm sure quite a few of that 6 million would not subscribe.
Universal channels get 12million+ weekly watching on sky platform but you don't see them demanding silly money then crying on social media when they get told to do one.
Discovery were the ones who walked away from negotiations not SKY, now i'm no fan of SKY as most on here know but for once i actually agree with SKYs stance on this.
What's saying Discovery don't start the same crap with BT and tv player too? i'll exclude vm as vm are in a good position due to malones 29% stake in Discovery but malone risks backlash bt sky may make future negotiations for vm very difficult all because of Discovery thinking they are better than what they are.
The bottom line here is ultimately there will only be one loser and that's us the consumer.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Indeed the consumer generally will always be on the bottom of the pile sadly.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Guess you don't like Tennis or winter sports then?

We watch something on one of the portfolio of Discovery channels every day. I'd love Discovery to provide a streaming platform so that I can ditch Virgin TV

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Throw in nat geo and we'd cut the cord in an instant.

We're really getting close to dumping the TV package and line rental and just taking the BB. So many trash channels.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Not the food channels l gather.:drool::drool:

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Two really and one is on freeview anyway. :)

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Absolutely bang on mate!

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

This might be for you:

http://tvplayer.com/plus?gclid=CPXTq...Fc-87QodP0wNXQ

£5.99 per month. Launching on Smart TV's soon. Tried it on Amazon Fire TV. Picture quality is not too bad.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Thanks. I feel re-assured now. :)

I'm sure Sky subscribers won't like me saying this, but I hope they do go ahead and pull the plug. Sky need a kick in the nuts. Their dominance of the pay TV market p***es me off!

I know it'll hardly bring them down, but it'll put a dent in their armour. There's a lot of people watch documentary channels so it'll be good if Virgin have a bunch of channels that Sky don't.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

I'm hoping they do too see how well Discovery does without it's claimed 6million sky viewers a week.
Plus it's great seeing sky get a bloody nose.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

I don't think that personalise this debate will do any good at all.

The facts are that (Discovery say) they have been charging Sky the same since 2008 and have only now increased the price despite having increased the number of channels over time.

(Sky say) that audience figures have declined and Discovery have not been sufficiently proactive in providing on demand services (but Discovery say) they were actively prevented by Sky from providing more on demand services.

Obviously, two sides to the argument, so rather than portraying this as Murdoch v Malone, a more careful evaluation of the facts might be more appropriate.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Proof is in the pudding Discovery have form for this behaviour they did it in Norway, Romania, Germany, the USA and now they trying it here.
Their past behaviour certainly hasn't done them any favours.
What's saying that bt, tv player and possibly vm aren't next for discovery to pull this crap on?
I think vm will be ok though due to Malones stake in discovery but if it was SKY doing this to malone he'd soon be crying to ofcom.
Both murdoch and malone need a good kick up the backside.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

My personal take on this is if Sky was not hell bent on paying over the odds for Football they might not be in this position now. The more sky pays out on football the less they have for non sporting channels.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Well, it seems to me that in Sky's world, they can put up their charges substantially year on year, and it's ok to refuse a moderate price increase to another content provider who have not put up their prices for 8 years.

Brilliant logic, that. I'm surprised anyone is buying that argument.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

l am not anti Sky at all but sadly nothing surprises me about their unrealistic financial demands from others and at the same time quote from that same old bible they think that other companies financial demands are unrealistic.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Absolute classic I nearly spat my coffee out , I guess that makes me Pro VM.:D:D

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Its what you call unbiased constructive criticism as many a time before l have criticised other providers including Virgin if you care to look but as you well know being a member of this forum for nearly as long as l ;) Sky do have quite a long history of abusing the market to their own ends unless you think otherwise MM?..;)

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Well we know that's not true, MM!

http://advanced-television.com/2017/...rriage-stance/

According to Sky, Discovery wanted £1b, but Discovery say they were paying more than they are now in 2006!

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

It looks like Sky are going to lose these channels.

The following preparations have been made:

4461 11.836 H 27.5 5/6 DVB-S OPSK now showing a caption saying "Unfortunately Sky is not able to bring you this channel as the broadcaster has withdrawn it from the Sky platform".

The EPG info says "Programme is no longer available".

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Good on SKY i say if discovery had only done this stunt here i might of believed Discovery however given that they've pulled the same crap in sweden. germany, romania,norway and usa let's see how dicovery do without their claimed 6 million a week viewers.
I hope BT do exactly the same if Discovery try this crap with them because they will i feel.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

well my epg still showing all discovery programs right through to next monday and the caption on my screen still says "may" lose the channels ,so nothing definite yet

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Well Marty best to check early on Wednesday as if it has gone off there will be the same message on all of Discovery's channels.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

I suspect that customer facing information will continue to say this until the deadline.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Only just occured to me if Discovery do pull channels of sky the DMAX will be a vm exclusive channel.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

That will please some on here.:hyper:;)

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

tbh I don't think I'd notice if they'd gone. Less channels to flick through before deciding to go to sleep I suppose.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

I am nt technically minded. But.

Where do VM get there signals from. Say Sky have there Dishes pointing skywards.

So where is the main Sat station for VM. And do VM dishes point directly to Astra. As l was under the impression that VM signal cam via Sky dishes. That why VM were always fighting with Sky over channels.

Or do VM have talks with various companies ie Discovery to sort out deals.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

VM use seperate sattelites and negotiate their own deals.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Some of us remember when cable first started & Discovery was recieved by the cable companies from Intelsat 27.5W. Eurosport was taken from Eutelsat Hotbird at 13E. There are still lower power distribution satellites up there, & it would actually be cheaper for broadcasters to uplink to these than general broadcast satellites like Astra. If you doubt VM's ability to still use them, take a look at post 7 of this thread.

VM only deal with Sky for the channels they own.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

AIUI all of the Discovery channel feeds are now via fibre.

If no deal is reached, this is what Sky plan to show from 1/2/17:

https://s27.postimg.org/4kokftw5v/Sk....png?noredir=1

---------- Post added at 22:58 ---------- Previous post was at 22:55 ----------

Wasn't Discovery formerly owned by United Artists and then Telewest??

I remember when they started on Astra analogue in 1993 and the Discovery Channel was only on from 4pm to midnight along with Bravo.

Later on they used the capacity to show TLC from 9am until 4pm.

This TLC was educational and eventually closed down and was nothing like the TLC that is on VM today!

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

If i was SKY i'd take Discoverys EPG slots from them too why should they keep them for if they ain't agreed anything.
Nat geo channels imo are leaps and bounds ahead of Discovery for quality content these days.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

It's not clear who actually owns the Discovery EPG slots. It's generally accepted that Discovery own them apart from TLC which either of them may own.

Apparently, TLC resides in a slot that was previously recycled from a former Sky channel.

They will have to find a way of keeping their valuable SD EPG slots alive that conform to Sky rules; it's suspected that they may show temporary programming at various times of the day.

If not, Sky have created a generic 'channel' showing the slate that I posted earlier that they can point the various Discovery EPG slots to.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Peace talks fuel hopes Discovery will keep channels on Sky ahead of midnight showdown.

Read more at http://www.campaignlive.co.uk/articl...jLHHy4tSxSX.99

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Tiny bit of wrong info there the #keepdiscovery wasn't started to encourage sky and discovery to keep the peace it was infact set up by Discovery to wrongly encourage sky customers to bombard skys customer service with calls.
Discovery are very lucky SKY still wish to hold talks and vice versa too.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

To be fair the writings on the wall , that article doesn't look positive for those wanting to see the channels remain.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Well come the morning Sky viewer's will certainly know their fate.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Or to get customers miffed with the loss of Discovery channels to contact Sky customer services and let them know how they felt

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Those still up will probably see them pulled at midnight; that's when Sky pulled their channels from VM as opposed to the end of the broadcasting day at 5:59:59.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Anyone with Sky Q will know pressing the home button lands you on Top Picks , Sky now has a tile titled Umissable documentaries (not one Discovery Communications show listed) they are also repeatedly running an advert for the same content titled unmissable documentaries across all their own channels.

Anyone hopeful these channels will stay it's not looking good in my opinion.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Indeed.

Also, we now know why Sky Sports Mix was created. If you look ahead in the EPG they are showing (repeats) of winter sports to try and emulate Eurosport ;)

This is the memo that Sky have been sending to dealers:

https://mobile.twitter.com/maplefilt...79201162989569

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

yep it is certainly not looking good MM as you so succinctly say.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

---------- Post added at 17:30 ---------- Previous post was at 17:29 ----------

[/COLOR]They have this on the sky+hd boxes now too.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

http://www.cityam.com/258140/city-am...1th-hour-deal?

Who knows ?

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Well we will know quick enough whether it was sabre rattling by both sides or the start of something far more serious and more long term MM.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

All on transfer deadline day :D

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Good grief you will be burning the midnight oil tonight then MM.;)

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

All channels staying on Sky!

GOOD NEWS! All our channels are staying on Sky. We can’t thank you enough for your patience & support. Best fans in TV! #KeepDiscovery
https://twitter.com/DiscoveryUK/stat...12462904172544

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Quite ironic really :D

---------- Post added at 19:43 ---------- Previous post was at 19:38 ----------

That's it you've done it now mate, the VM fanboys will be throwing their cornflakes at the cat in rage that VM aren't getting Dmax as a exclusive now. :p:

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Maybe as a consolation prize, Discovery can rustle up DMAX +1 as a VM exclusive? :)

I actually think Sky keeping access to all these channels was important to them. If they hadn't, their base pack would have looked weak and VM could claim to have the better channel line-up. Pleased the situation has been resolved but hope it doesn't lead to more prices rises across all providers.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Confirmed by Sky also.
http://www.sky.com/discoveringmore

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Not many Virgin fan boys on this forum as think your imagination is simply running riot again.:D

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Thank god that's all over now I can concentrate on the drama that is deadline day

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Well your wise old wisdom was right again MM.:D

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Tbh i'm just pleased for those who enjoy Discovery content that it's now all sorted out.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Yes often when things are looking into the abyss a solution presents itself.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

One can only try and guess opinion from the articles we read , unless your involved in the negotiations nobody really knows the full story. I'm frequently wrong on things Den or at least so the Mrs always tells me.:D

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Well one thing we have to remember in our household's is remembering is who wears the trousers.;):D

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

That Twitter link says the page doesn't exist!

Nevertheless, this is now a done deal.

http://www.a516digital.com/2017/01/d...e-reached.html

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

What colour trousers is she wearing now, Den? :D

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Pink with yellow spots.;)

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

You're married to Mr Blobby?

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

l will leave it to your imagination SP.;)

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

That could be very dangerous :p:

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

On that bombshell! :D

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

The deal settled upon appears to involve Sky paying the lower carriage costs that they wanted, but with some other tweaks eg Sky taking back the TLC slot and putting Pick on there and more freedom for Discovery to run their business as they see fit.

Apparently, Pick is moving to 125, Challenge to 152 and TLC to 145.

Both parties are claiming victory, so I suspect, to reflect the fact that Discovery are being paid less than what they wanted, Sky have agreed to allow Discovery to have the increased control and flexibility that has been mentioned.

I suspect that this involves allowing them to make some of their channels FTA and have a suspicion that this is how UKTV managed to get Really, Drama and Yesterday onto Freesat.

As part of their contingency plans, Sky threw some money at PBS America to make some documentary programmes, which Sky, Freesat and Virgin Media customers will all be able to enjoy :D

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

I was confused about the PBS America deal, but this clarifies it..

http://variety.com/2017/tv/news/sky-...al-1201974511/

Stephen van Rooyen, CEO of Sky for the UK and Ireland, meanwhile, made a point of noting that Sky also struck a new deal with PBS America to provide similar lifestyle, nature, science and documentary programming that Discovery channels carry.

---------- Post added at 08:09 ---------- Previous post was at 07:53 ----------

I hope you are right about that last bit, Richard. The scope of the agreement with PBS America is not yet clear and it may only impact on Sky satellite subscribers. Watch this space...

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Not sure the PBS America deal would have adequately replaced the potentially lost Discovery channels though.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

True but then if we are talking factual in my opinion PBS is night and day better , the majority of the Discovery content these days is reality rubbish.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Yes l agree PBS does have some good factual content that is for sure and although l am not a reality fan there are many who are MM.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Richard, no need ot post the same message in three different threads. Just post what is relevent to that discussion.

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Well, that's all a big surprise (not).

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

You will make a Mystic Meg yet then Mr K.;)

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Good! I was getting fed up with the intrusive rolling message..

Re: Sky Discovery (potential) switch-off (technical)
 

Not unless there would have been PBS1,2,3, etc! If that was their intention and it's still going ahead on that basis, I think VM will be left only with its existing PBS channel, good though that is.