Originally Posted by JordanTheToaster (Post 35834701)

And it will still be a year or 2 before anything faster comes.

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35834715)

There is the minor issue of the non-FTTP areas. Some of those still need rebuilding.

The last set of upgrades were relatively recent. VM will go faster when they've a reason to.

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35834743)

Entirely new areas only. They aren't overbuilding existing cable connections, and plugging gaps in existing areas will be done with 1.218GHz HFC.

Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 35834755)

needs to be epon though, i understand the reasoning behind RFoG but it's an ineffective use of fibre.

Originally Posted by BenMcr (Post 35834765)

RFoG allows Virgin Media to offer exactly the same product experience for TV and Broadband in all areas.

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35834715)

There is the minor issue of the non-FTTP areas. Some of those still need rebuilding.

The last set of upgrades were relatively recent. VM will go faster when they've a reason to.

Originally Posted by vm_tech (Post 35834752)

23prince, what area was dug but never built?

Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 35834789)

But it limits the capability of the fibre and services that be provided. It's fine for areas next to existing network as you can deliver existing HFC over it, and in the future you can swap out the kit and deliver epon over the same passive network.

But there is no sense in totally new build areas such as Chester, Wrexham or Dunfermline in providing an RFoG solution. It should be epon.

Originally Posted by BenMcr (Post 35834812)

Network extensions in current cable areas are 'classic' HFC. It's new network areas that are FTTP.

RFoG is being used currenting in the FTTP areas to ensure consistency with the TV / Broadband services.

I'm sure if / when Virgin Media need EPON for their residential services, they'll use it. But it's not currently required.

Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 35834846)

I'm fully aware of the details of Project Lightening and what areas are being built what way. I've worked for Virgin Media for over 20years.

Many in Networks have no love of RFoG. Just wait until they try to deploy voice over it.

Originally Posted by BenMcr (Post 35834812)

RFoG is being used currenting in the FTTP areas to ensure consistency with the TV / Broadband services.

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35834880)

There's still no VoIP product ready? :confused:

Cable companies have been running voice over DOCSIS networks for a decade and a half. This is hardly state of the art. What collection of cowboys are writing the firmware for your CPE?

Sorry if I'm wrong but that's the only impediment I can think of as all the CMTS in use have been happily delivering voice for other MSOs and other members of the Liberty Global family for years.

Appreciate VM need some customisation on the firmware on CMTS to accommodate bugs in the Netgear Superhubs, mind..

Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 35834892)

No VoIP yet but doesn't mean they're not working on it. The VTP is very much ongoing.

Issues with OBI on the current FTTP set up.

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35834880)

There's a lot to be said for customising offers to the local networks. Didn't feel that bad doing it on Homeworks+, did it? :)

Originally Posted by BenMcr (Post 35834950)

HomeWorks+ is a regional rollout and will eventually be available to all areas.

Originally Posted by BenMcr (Post 35834950)

HomeWorks+ is a regional rollout and will eventually be available to all areas.

Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 35834789)

But there is no sense in totally new build areas such as Chester, Wrexham or Dunfermline in providing an RFoG solution. It should be epon.

Got to look a bit further ahead.

Originally Posted by MrIca (Post 35835074)

When was Chester announced as a new area? Things proved very difficult last time they tried anything there. Though you walk through the city centre and see plenty of old NYNEX jointbox covers. No cabinets though.

Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 35835083)

It may not have been yet.

Originally Posted by rhyds (Post 35835360)

It would be very interesting to see how they plan to fit out Wrexham. IIRC there's no existing infrastructure.

Originally Posted by rhyds (Post 35835360)

It would be very interesting to see how they plan to fit out Wrexham. IIRC there's no existing infrastructure.

Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 35835399)

Then it will be new build FTTP

Originally Posted by Kushan (Post 35835470)

I suddenly want to live in Wrexham.






(lol j/k, nobody wants to live there).

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35835527)

Maximum distance between DOCSIS CMTS and most distant user is 160km.

If amplification is needed this can be done in a building the size of a shed or even in street cabinets.

All good.

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35835527)

Maximum distance between DOCSIS CMTS and most distant user is 160km.

If amplification is needed this can be done in a building the size of a shed or even in street cabinets.

All good.

Originally Posted by MrIca (Post 35835533)

Thanks, good solid facts as ever. Raises a question though, why do they have so many hubsites now then if they can serve 160km? In my area for instance they've got one in Bromborough which seems to serve about 10 miles on every direction and then also some kind of smaller switching site in Birkenhead a few miles down the road.

I'm assuming they've also got a few in Liverpool and Warrington.

Originally Posted by rhyds (Post 35835536)

Stupid question: is that DOCSIS over fibre or coax? Bromborough to Wrexham is about 25 miles (town centre to town centre via the shortest road/street route). I'd imagined they'd be building some kind of fibre link (or using an existing dark fibre/ducting) over that kind of distance, or will it be served as a sort of "extension" of any Chester system?

Also, where does the TV side stand with regards to regional programming? Wrexham is in the BBC/ITV Wales/S4C region, would VM have to provide the correct region (as Sky does)? I'd imagine that getting a programme feed wouldn't be too difficult, but would it limit the number of other channels available?

Originally Posted by rhyds (Post 35835569)

Local CPE/parts/cable/sundries stock maybe?

Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 35835580)

Some hub sites/head ends have offices within them. Some are also used as stores and as a base for the installation contractors. The one where I work has all three.

Originally Posted by MrIca (Post 35835583)

I see. Well all the vans I'm seeing a Virgin Media direct labour, not contractors.

Originally Posted by MrIca (Post 35835583)

Well all the vans I'm seeing a Virgin Media direct labour, not contractors.

Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 35835590)

How do you know, in many instances they use the exact same vans.

Originally Posted by MrIca (Post 35835533)

Thanks, good solid facts as ever. Raises a question though, why do they have so many hubsites now then if they can serve 160km? In my area for instance they've got one in Bromborough which seems to serve about 10 miles on every direction and then also some kind of smaller switching site in Birkenhead a few miles down the road.

I'm assuming they've also got a few in Liverpool and Warrington.

Originally Posted by MrIca (Post 35835553)

I still don't understand what the engineers do in the hubsites though. I see dozens going in and out of the Bromborough one.

Originally Posted by MrIca (Post 35835603)

Oh right, I always thought the subcontractors use vans with the logo of their company, Kelly Communications for instance with a Virgin Media logo also. These vans just have Virgin Media on them with van related puns on the front. Why would VM allow subcontractors to use VM owned vans anyway?

Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 35835627)

VM don't own the vans, the vans are leased as are the contractors. They are all logo' up the same as the vans are dedicated working on the VM contract.

If you're having VM installed then VM want you to see a VM van, not a Kelly's van.

I'm not saying the vans you see are contractors vans, they may or may not be.

Originally Posted by Horizon (Post 35836833)

Just a little titbit of info from the webcast today, VM are currently building out to 300k homes at a cost of £500 per home passed. This time last year the number was at 30k homes.

A question asked to Mike Fries was, could VM accelerate and even expand the build out to more new homes. The answer was that Liberty was pleased with the numbers and take up of services and they could expand and accelerate if they wanted, or slow down if costs were too high.

So, there is a possiblity that the build-out may increased to more homes once this current project is done.

Originally Posted by vm_tech (Post 35836844)

This is what I've always thought: project lightening is a 5 year, 3 billion pound project. If this returns them 4 billion, why would they stop at 5 years? Obviously it's a waiting game they won't see the money back instantly, but if they forecast it will bring more money in they will carry on. They will stop once the forecasts say there's now too much risk of not earning money from this, so we will stop

Originally Posted by Horizon (Post 35836833)

Just a little titbit of info from the webcast today, VM are currently building out to 300k homes at a cost of £500 per home passed. This time last year the number was at 30k homes.

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35840023)

The cabinet on the right as you look at it is a power cabinet. On the left you've a 'standard' CATV and nodal cabinet that'll deliver services to a bunch of people's homes alongside terminating fibre. In the middle looks like a plinth for an MSAN that provides telco services. Those are delivered with the MSAN in the cabinet already so presumably the ducts and plinth are covered up waiting for the MSAN itself.

Closer to delivery time I imagine that cover will be replaced by the MSAN.

---------- Post added at 19:55 ---------- Previous post was at 19:52 ----------



The 4 million premises, £3 billion Lightning is the first phase of the project. If it goes as planned VM can and will continue to build.

---------- Post added at 19:57 ---------- Previous post was at 19:55 ----------



VM are willing to suck up considerably more than £500 per premises passed during the course of this project. They will be building to completely new towns and are budgeting £750 per premises passed across the lifetime of the project.

The back end of the project here will be coming in at close to £1k per premises passed, offset by the costs of the earlier phases of the build and justified by take up and expected ARPU in those streets.

Pierre can probably pull up the details on that particular drama.

Originally Posted by MrIca (Post 35840132)

Great, so Virgin Media are going to that new estate. Interesting, as they didn't build out to a new estate that was built only 2 years ago round the corner.

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35840137)

They are pursuing new builds far more enthusiastically now for obvious reasons - it costs way less to provide cable while an estate is being built than when it's all done.

Originally Posted by Arthurgray50@blu (Post 35840143)

I have just spoken to the wife, and she claims that we have it already. We are TW7. Well if that's the case, something is wrong, as our broadband is poor.

Originally Posted by Arthurgray50@blu (Post 35840160)

My wife has just told me that VM increased our BB from 30 to 100, which is the highest VM do - that's what VM have told her.

---------- Post added at 23:18 ---------- Previous post was at 23:18 ----------

I believe strongly that is you pay for top quality, you should get the best there is.

Originally Posted by Arthurgray50@blu (Post 35840160)

My wife has just told me that VM increased our BB from 30 to 100, which is the highest VM do - that's what VM have told her.

---------- Post added at 23:18 ---------- Previous post was at 23:18 ----------

I believe strongly that is you pay for top quality, you should get the best there is.

Originally Posted by rhyds (Post 35835360)

It would be very interesting to see how they plan to fit out Wrexham. IIRC there's no existing infrastructure.

Originally Posted by Kushan (Post 35842050)

Having been to Chester City Centre, I wouldn't be surprised if they avoided it entirely as well. To say that it's narrow and pokey is somewhat of an understatement.

I do love Hickory's though.

Originally Posted by MrIca (Post 35843613)

Saying that though, can you even get Virgin Media in Liverpool city centre?

Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 35843639)

Yes.

Originally Posted by Skie (Post 35843786)

It's a bit weird in Liverpool iirc. Commercial district is CATV'd up but you can't get normal service and the postcode checker will tell you no, it's either a business fibre connection (a proper connection, not the soho grade stuff they run over the residential network) or a line into a multi-tenant residential property that can provide it to all of their apartments.